MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index
 FAQ & Terms of UseFAQ & Terms Of Use   Wiggler RadioMW Radio   Muff Wiggler TwitterTwitter   Support the site @ PatreonPatreon 
 SearchSearch   RegisterSign up   Log inLog in 
WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Basics...
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> 5U Format Modules Goto page 1, 2  Next [all]
Author Basics...
Jay88
Ok I got a studio 88 2 years and, well life got in the way. Priority's.

For learning and getting it "into your head" is there basic rules I can follow in patching?

I want 7 oscillators all at once.
I want my sequencer going.

Right now its pretty muddy.
Its all a huge V12 motor sound. Dead Banana

I need to learn the general "Flow" and the JPGS and videos dont cut it for me because I have a lack of skills with modulars.

So much for having a real job...now I can focus on modular Dead Banana .
Dave Peck
I don't know what 'JPGS' means but have you read any books on synth basics?

What about experience with non-modulars? Have you had much experience with a basic mono synth, like a minimoog?
Synth Con Meo
Dave Peck wrote:
I don't know what 'JPGS' means but have you read any books on synth basics?


I think he means .jpg's as in Jpeg image files.
JohnLRice
Also, what sort of music/sounds do you want to create? Some names of bands, artists, tracks etc would be helpful to those that want to help you. thumbs up

In general, start simple and small! nodnod You may want all 7 VCOs going at once but just work with one VCO in the patch until you are getting results you like, then patch in a second one and slowly work you way up to 7.
DJFonzi
Can you narrow down "norcal?" There's a few of us in the general vicinity, if there's someone close to you, might be worth hooking up. I'd be willing if you're around the South Bay, Monterey Bay, but I'm thinking you're actually in REAL Northern California.
Jay88
JohnLRice wrote:
Also, what sort of music/sounds do you want to create? Some names of bands, artists, tracks etc would be helpful to those that want to help you. thumbs up
.


I like Steve Roach, he helped me now and then with advice. Every one knows how nice he is. I also like techno and house and purchased a TR-909.

Im near Redding ca.

I do have a mini moog, An A6, A prophet 600, Rhodes, Samplers and an 88 key modern workstation sampler.

I like space music.

jpg's as in Jpeg image files on synthesizers.com
I also have the PDF book.

I am more an expert on studio work and have rebuilt several moogs from ground up and soldered in CPU chips in other synths.

My latest project as of this week is a TR-909 into a mackie 1604 mixer with all 10 voices.
The moog and the Studio 88 all on its own channel.

Plus an additional 16 channels of pure analog synth, summing mixers...
I dont use any software other then cubase 9/Waves.

I have been making money rebuilding vintage gear not selling music and kind of ended up where I am now. oops
ranix
I also got started in modular synthesis using a Studio-88, and I bought mine around when you did if I remember right (2014)

my advice is to get a decent 2-channel oscilloscope and spend some time exploring the synthesizer as if it were a piece of lab equipment. It's taken me a few years to get to the point at which I can start composing with it

you can ask any questions any time about what's going on or how to accomplish something you can't figure out
trentpmcd
Jay88 wrote:

Its all a huge V12 motor sound. .

Is it wrong of me to say that the first thing I thought of when I read this was "I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)"? hihi Yeah, that's a lawnmower, but still...

I don't have a big system, but I still think John L Rice's advice of starting small and working up is the best. You have other analog gear, so it shouldn't be hard to figure out the simple path and then experiment from there.

And I know you said the videos don't work well, but there are some great videos on synthesizers.com site. Start with Roger's "basic patch" video and explore.
kindredlost
I am only familiar with the Studio 88 system from the pics on synthesizers.com website, but isn't there just one filter in there? The Q107 is a pretty decent all-around filter but you might be better off with a different one for variety. I'd look into the STG Soundlabs Post Lawsuit Lowpass Filter or the Corsynth C101 OTA Lowpass.

http://www.stgsoundlabs.com/products/post_lawsuit_lowpass_filter_mu.ht m

http://corsynth.com/home/modules/discontinued/c101-filter

If you aren't using the A/B Q143 Presets module then it would be a good place to put the other filter. I assume you have the blank filled with an additional VCO because you said you have seven oscillators. The System 88 is stock with six oscillators.

The additional variety might help and Steve Roach uses a Post Lawsuit filter as well for some of those really rich filter sounds. Just sayin'. cool
Flareless
trentpmcd wrote:
Jay88 wrote:

Its all a huge V12 motor sound. .

Is it wrong of me to say that the first thing I thought of when I read this was "I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe)"? hihi Yeah, that's a lawnmower, but still...


Definitely a 7 oscillator patch nanners

@OP - Follow John's advice. Start slow with a few modules. Make a patch and experiment with variations. Have fun and don't be afraid to try things out.

Just don't plug inputs into inputs or outputs into outputs. That will cause a warp core breach.
kindredlost
Another thing to try is to become familiar with the Fixed Filter Bank. It is a good way to rid the midrange mud from a patch but you are probably already well seasoned in all that sound sculpting.

It’s easy to get too thick in a hurry when stacking up vco’s and The choice of waveforms is paramount. Try listening to them without a filter for a while until you get used to the sound of the Q106’s. Try a pair in linear and then exponential FM patch to get an idea of the differences. Also a good hard sync patch or even a soft sync patch can open up a more interesting sound with just a pair of vco’s. After all that you can introduce some filter sweep to the core sound with more confidence.
Mark11Audio
DJFonzi wrote:
Can you narrow down "norcal?" There's a few of us in the general vicinity, if there's someone close to you, might be worth hooking up. I'd be willing if you're around the South Bay, Monterey Bay, but I'm thinking you're actually in REAL Northern California.


He lives somewhere west of Redding in Trinity County... from one of his earlier previous posts... so yeah, REAL NorCal... thumbs up
Rex Coil 7
I think most of us that are familiar with modulars would agree that there is (most definitely) a point of diminishing returns when it comes to stacking VCOs. Once you hit ~about~ 4 VCOs, anything after that is just mud.

That is, unless you're doing the massive 8 note chord portamento sweeps that Dennis DeYoung (Styx) did with his Oberheim 8 voice on the Grand Illusion album. They are most dramatic in the song "Castle Walls".

But if you're just making unison stacks, 4 VCOs is about the top end of usefulness.

If you combine them into groups of 2 VCOs as dual oscillator "voices", then you're essentially create three "voices" plus an extra VCO to use for single oscillator sounds (which there are MANY MANY MANY of in pop music). So three voices (comprised of 2 VCOs each) may be a better use of your resources. There's a shit ton you could do with hard sync and FM on each voice that will distinguish each voice more clearly as well.

End.

cool
ranix
I've been getting a lot of cool sounds with weird resonance by mixing the output of two oscillators and sending the result to the linear frequency modulation of the 2nd oscillator. It also syncs the two oscillators and can get osc 1 in a stable 90 degree + or - phase shift to osc 2 by twiddling knobs
Jay88
So from reading every post I should go 1vco 1 ossolator, Fixed Filter Bank and the midi stuff and ignore the sequencer and the reverb and keep it simple?

If I make a mistake and plug inputs into inputs or outputs what happens?
cry

So what happened is the builder of this synth had ordered it new and did a few swaps to get the ladder filer.
ranix
you should do whatever you want dude, you could record the output of your oscillator directly if you want to. Just the oscillator. Or you could skip the oscillator and self-oscillate a filter and just record that. Or whatever you want. And add more modules to your path as you go. And when you're done take all the cables out and start over.

Roger has a bunch of example patches on the synthesizers.com youtube channel you can try, understanding what's going on is just a matter of sitting in front of it twiddling knobs for long enough. I highly recommend an oscilloscope
Jay88
Was watching videos today.
And a software oscilloscope will be a be choice? I know there is a few in my pc.
ranix
not sure, never used a software oscilloscope. As long as you can plug a cable into an output and see the waveform on a screen you should be good
Jay88
Im thinking of just unplugging every cable and reading the PDF work book thats is going around Modular Synthesizer Mastery - Volume 0.2

Try with the first the west coast patch> SlayerBadger!
donkey for rent
Howdy -
I'm in the SF Bay Area, but if you wanna PM me we could easily set up a skype call sometime and just walk through a few things. I'm surely no expert, but I have a handle on some of the basics, and I'm eager to pass on the stuff I learned from the gang here.
megaohm
An easy way to explore your modular is to make patches that imitate synths you're already familiar with.
If you have a minmoog, patch up a minimoog-like synth.
3 VCOs (two would work, too) into a mixer to VCF to VCA with a couple EGs.
Once you get there, start embellishing - add another EG, an additional VCA for one VCO before the mixer. That can give you dynamic instead of static oscillator level control.

The suggestion for an oscilloscope is a great one.
Get a hardware scope instead of software. You need it for those other projects anyway (you're likely to miss something otherwise). Cheap and used is perfectly fine, too.

Jay88 wrote:
JohnLRice wrote:
Also, what sort of music/sounds do you want to create? Some names of bands, artists, tracks etc would be helpful to those that want to help you. thumbs up
.


I like Steve Roach, he helped me now and then with advice. Every one knows how nice he is. I also like techno and house and purchased a TR-909.

Im near Redding ca.

I do have a mini moog, An A6, A prophet 600, Rhodes, Samplers and an 88 key modern workstation sampler.

I like space music.

jpg's as in Jpeg image files on synthesizers.com
I also have the PDF book.

I am more an expert on studio work and have rebuilt several moogs from ground up and soldered in CPU chips in other synths.

My latest project as of this week is a TR-909 into a mackie 1604 mixer with all 10 voices.
The moog and the Studio 88 all on its own channel.

Plus an additional 16 channels of pure analog synth, summing mixers...
I dont use any software other then cubase 9/Waves.

I have been making money rebuilding vintage gear not selling music and kind of ended up where I am now. oops
cornutt
I've found that a good way to do space music is to patch something that has a bunch of different, slow modulations (like about 0.1 Hz). You can get some good drones going this way. Add reverb, and presto!
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
I was just going to suggest using a mixer to attenuate those 7 VCOs. You might find that if you adjust the levels of some or all of them relative to the others, it won't be so grungy.
bwhittington
It's more of a list of ideas/concepts than a guide to patching technique, but the pdf in the first post of this thread might be useful:

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=93120

If you are getting distracted by all of your VCO's, you might try practicing with your sequencer patched to your Minimoog. Or a simple Minimoog style voice like megaohm suggests. It took me quite a bit of practice to start making sequences that I thought sounded interesting. Isolating a simple thing like that and then experimenting with some concepts in the pdf I linked might be a decent start.
milkshake
Jay88 wrote:

For learning and getting it "into your head" is there basic rules I can follow in patching?


Unfortunately, there are no shortcuts. You will have to spend time learning synthesis.

On top of the great advice already given, my advice is to start with just one module, learn how do the outputs sound, what do the knob positions do, what happens when I patch an output to an input. Basically learn the module.
Then learn an other module.
After that patch the modules together and repeat the same process.
Add a third module, rinse and repeat.

It takes about 20 years to master a violin, or any other instrument, so it takes about 20 years to master a modular synth.
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> 5U Format Modules Goto page 1, 2  Next [all]
Page 1 of 2
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group