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ES-8 / Ableton / Windows
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Expert Sleepers  
Author ES-8 / Ableton / Windows
darkgr33n
Hey all,

Is anyone able to share how they use ableton/es-8 and be able to hear it in the mix ?

After an initial flurry or activity I had drifted away from eurorack for almost a year, instead discovering audacity and, more lately, ableton 10. I then happened to read about the ES-8. It sounded perfect. An easy way to introduce my modular 'scapes to ableton.

However, I've been struggling for almost a day and just can't get it to work as I thought it would.

I think the biggest issue is i'm on windows 10.

After I installed the ES-8 I then read about windows not allowing you select separate input/output devices. Not sure where I read it now as I can't seem to find it again. It wasn't immediately obvious.

I had imagined that I would be able to play one of the ableton instruments, and send that out to the modular, and then back in again to record while ableton was playing and while I wiggle wink

OR even just make a noise with the modular and record it into ableton while being able to hear what i'm doing.

However I just can't work out how to monitor the output of ableton when the es-8 is selected.

I have installed ASIO4ALL as suggested in the forum, but it doesn't seem to make any difference. In the ASIO4ALL panel, I have selected both the ES-8 and my soundcard which is driving the speakers (ASUS Xonar DS).

I do seem to be able to send audio out of ableton into the modular [clouds] and i can hear it if i plug a headphone directly into the output of clouds, and when i pass it back to the ES-8, the ins/out light up to show its receiving audio, but I just can't hear it.

If anyone can offer any help, I'd appreciate it.

I'm a effectively a eurorack noob and an ableton noob, so i'm hoping it's my own stupidity preventing me from using it smile

Thanks
os
The easiest solution would be to connect your speakers to the ES-8.

Otherwise you're into asio4all to combine the two interfaces.

What is your other interface?
darkgr33n
os wrote:
The easiest solution would be to connect your speakers to the ES-8.

Otherwise you're into asio4all to combine the two interfaces.

What is your other interface?


Hey os,

Thanks for your reply.

As I said, I'm a bit of a noob with some of this, and I'm not sure what you mean by interface ?

I guess you mean my soundcard. It's an ASUS Xonar DS card.

My speakers are connected to my soundcard - they're just little desktops.

I'm not sure how I'd connect the ES-8 directly to the speakers, but I'm not sure that's what I want to do. I'd like to be able to hear the modular within Ableton, the same as one of the soft-synths.

So really I guess it's a case of trying to get ASIO4ALL to work. I've found a few guides online but nothing seems to work. Tried various installs, restarts etc. I'm assuming that ASIO4ALL

I guess the first question is, am I wrong in thinking that with the ES-8, I should be able to run ableton - midi drums etc - and record the modular while wiggling, or have I got that wrong ?

As I said, I have read that someone in a previous post got it working, but it wasn't a detailed enough answer for it to be any help to me wink
darkgr33n
https://ibb.co/injhwc



here's a quick grab of the setup. asio4all has both the soundcard and es-8 switched on. You can also see that the audio track in ableton is receiving a tone from hertz donut in the modular smile when I play a midi piano, and plug my tiny apple headphones into the out of the ES-8, i can hear the piano. The master is in ableton is receiving all audio. All of that is great - I just can't hear any of it through my speakers hmmm.....

I think asio4all is not quite doing what i expected.

When the ES-8 is switched off, I can hear ableton through my speakers. As soon as I turn on the modular, the speakers stop working.

EDIT. Also when unselecting ES-8 in ASIO4ALL I can hear ableton again - re-enabling ES-8 cuts the speakers.

I'm beginning to think it's not going to work the way I had hoped :( Damn you Windows and your lack of ability to create aggregate devices.

so close, yet ...
darkgr33n
found the post where the kobinn had it working for him.

he said:

Quote:

How I do it is, in sound preferences, in recording devices there's the es-8. I go there and check the 'listen to this device' box and select my soundcard there.
Then in ableton you should just select the es-8 as the interface and everything that's inputed to channels 1 and 2 from your es-8 will sound through your speakers. That's the basics.

My actual set up is, I send my last output from the modular to input 3 and 4 from the es-8, then I route input 3 and 4 from ableton in an audio track to output 1 and 2, that are patched to input 1 and 2. That way I always have an audio track specifically for the modular and I can use it while listening to other stuff on the ableton project.


but i seem to struggle to follow the second paragraph.

I've setup my playback devices with listen to this device ticked and unchecked allow exclusive control.

I have my hertz donut routed to input 4 on the ES-8. I've got an audio track set so audio in is input 4 and audio out is 1/2 and the master is receiving audio .. but i don't know how he hear it via ableton.

darkgr33n
OK, I think I was approaching it the wrong way.

If I set the master to ext-out 1/2, I get all of the audio of ableton into the es-8; I can then patch that into my WMD pro output and then use the phones out on that to aux in of my speaker and voila, we have sound smile

I wasn't thinking of the ES-8 in that way. Even though its called an audio interface very frustrating I guess I wasn't expecting to send everything out of ableton into the modular.

If I had an adat input on my soundcard, i'm guessing i could use the adat output on the es-8 to go to the soundcard. i'm not familiar with adat.

the next thing will be how to work out how to start/stop ableton and send the clock. it's late now so will tackle that tommorrow wink

Thanks
os
That's one way to do it, but the thing you were originally trying with asio4all should work.
darkgr33n
os wrote:
That's one way to do it, but the thing you were originally trying with asio4all should work.


I'd definitely prefer it to work that way - so the modular works like a soft-synth - I just can't see a way of getting ableton to allow me to monitor the sound.

Maybe someone that has it working on windows might be able to help. I think the issue could be that the Master track is set to output 1/2, which is assigned to the ES-8. I hoping it's something stupid that I'm doing due to my lack of knowledge - I just can't see a way of routing the master out to the soundcard. In the ableton config, I have switched on inputs 1/2 3/4 and outputs 1/2 3/4 5/6 7/8 but that's where I'm stuck.

I've got to put a shed up today but will have another look tonight, but it's encouraging to know it should work the way I had hoped.

Perhaps I should have 'Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device' checked within the windows sound playback devices settings. arggh.
os
Master outs are set just above the master fader:



Can you re-order the devices in asio4all so your audio interface comes first, and the ES-8 second?
darkgr33n
os wrote:

Can you re-order the devices in asio4all so your audio interface comes first, and the ES-8 second?


I don't know! That's what I was just thinking as ES-8 is first in the list. Let me have a root about and see if I can find some instructions online for reordering within asio4all. smile
darkgr33n
I've been reading and setting-changing for a couple of hours now and i'm no closer to getting it to work as I'd expected. As above, I can monitor the whole mix through the ES-8 but it's not ideal that way so I think maybe the ES-8 isn't the way to go. Almost made it but not close enough for what I wanted. Will send it back Monday I think unless anyone else has any ideas. Thanks for your help though os, appreciated smile
darkgr33n
still struggling. i think asio4all is the issue here.

would i be correct in thinking that if i grabbed a focusrite scarlett 18i20 - which has adat in and out - that i could join it up with the es-8 successfully ?

i'm not sure if the es-8 is effectively a modular version of the focusrite though and might have been better off going down a different route ?

as i said, windows not being able to create aggregate devices alongside trying to get asio4all to work is my issue here and not the es-8 per se
os
Quote:
would i be correct in thinking that if i grabbed a focusrite scarlett 18i20 - which has adat in and out - that i could join it up with the es-8 successfully ?

Yes.

You may have been better off with an ES-3 & ES-6 in this case, but the ES-8 will certainly work.
darkgr33n
Thanks os smile

I can swap the es-8 for the es-3 + es-6 and grab a focusrite as well and hopefully i'll be back in the game wink

Thanks again for your help. I'll probably be back when its comes to me trying to get the clock synced up wink
darkgr33n
can i just use any toslink cable with the es3/es6 + 18i20 ?

something like this
os
Yes.
darkgr33n
thanks os - ordered the es-3/es-6, focusrite and cables!
Riggar
And ....... how it's going?
darkgr33n
Riggar wrote:
And ....... how it's going?


pretty good, thanks hyper

it all works exactly as i'd hoped. i also bought the silent way suite. I tried with cv toolkit mini but couldn't get a rock solid clock into pams, demoed silent way cv sync and it worked straight away so added that to the credit card too.

its actually inspired me to pull out a few modules and sell them - wmd pro output and clouds - so i can grab a couple more noise modules - mantis iteritas and kermit - and maybe a quadra but im not sure i really need that with silent way. i just haven't quite got my head around that yet - i've been too busy jamming, need to knuckle down and learn it really.

but i'm really happy with the es-6/es-3/focusrite/silent way combo thumbs up
Riggar
Many thanks for update!

I'm still exploring the ES-8 route - using PC/Ableton combo usb'd to ES-8 as the basic engine to modular - pretty standard approach. The audio out (mono/stereo/multi options) from modular to amp/speakers/recording setup using a spare PC.
darkgr33n
Riggar wrote:
Many thanks for update!

I'm still exploring the ES-8 route - using PC/Ableton combo usb'd to ES-8 as the basic engine to modular - pretty standard approach. The audio out (mono/stereo/multi options) from modular to amp/speakers/recording setup using a spare PC.


Glad you got it working. Good thinking on the spare PC!, that's one way to avoid using asio4all and trying to do aggregate devices wink
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