MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index
 FAQ & Terms of UseFAQ & Terms Of Use   Wiggler RadioMW Radio   Muff Wiggler TwitterTwitter   Support the site @ PatreonPatreon 
 SearchSearch   RegisterSign up   Log inLog in 
WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Serge or Buchla (or other) alternatives to the Fenix 3?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Buchla, EMS & Serge  
Author Serge or Buchla (or other) alternatives to the Fenix 3?
deltaphoenix
Hi All,

Not new to Serge or Buchla, I have had both (and have a couple of 73-75 Serge panels being built) but I am looking for a good sequencing partner for my Fenix 2 since Fenix 3s are hard to come by.

Seems to me that Serge offers the easiest path with several sequencers options, gate sequencer, programmers. Would need to run the outputs through a CV Processor in order to get them to the needed 0-8v range.

In the Buchla world, I would think that the LEM Spider could be cool. Definitely a different sequencing paradigm but it seems like the 252e would patch back and forth easier due to the CV ranges being similar.

Any other thoughts, opinions or sequencing alternatives to consider?

Fenix 3 specs:
Fénix III (Sequencer)
1 LFO board
3 Sequencer boards
1 CV expander boards (with potmeters)
3 gate expander 1 boards (with switches)
1 gate expander 2 boards (with switches)
1 Banana to 3,5 mm minijack connectors
 
LFO board has a LFO with divided outputs, delayed outputs, duplets and triplet’s outputs, attenuators, gate buffers, glide modules, quantizer, gate to S-trigger and a midi sync input (you can choose the internal clock or the midi sync).
Sequencer board is a standalone 16 steps sequencer without LFO. This board is internal connected to the main LFO and the Run/Stop and Reset input. Each sequencer board can be used as a standalone 16 step sequencer when using an externe clock. This board has control inputs (like clock, step length, mute, Run, CV to step).  These inputs overrules the internal connected functions and CV Outputs with a CV input. Internal is a skip function available controlled by the switch expander.  The direction of the sequencer be set normal, random and left/right.
Expander boards are connected to a sequencer board. The expander board will run sync with the sequencer board.  There are 3 types of expander boards.
A CV expander board. This add an extra 16 CV step sequencer (can also be set at 2 x 8 steps).
A gate expander 1 board with 16 switches and 2 gate outputs and 1 PW input. This board can also be used for the skip function of the sequencer board)
A gate expander 2 board with 16 switches and 1 gate outputs and 1 PW input and 1 mute input.
 
Kent
The 252e is super cool but I would not have it as my primary sequencer in hardware. That’s a shame to say about an item that is rather expensive. I’d throw a 250e and 251e in a boat or a 250e and 252e if you don’t need so many channels. One nice thing with a 252e as the Master is the the other e-series sequencers will slave to its tempo automatically (or not, should one desire).

What about the Verbos sequencer coupled with a 252e? It would be more direct and easier to grok and you’d have the kookiness of the 252e alongside it.

I do think that some of the ratcheting effects from the 252e could be replicated rather easily in the 251e. However, seeing as how I’d only thought of that last night, I have yet to try it.

And why not something like a Cirklon?
deltaphoenix
Oh man, then I will want a preset recall, then an LPG Function Generator, and....

Yeah, I love the 250e never really used the 251e but I think I could like it - the ER-301 sequencer in Euro seems to be similar.

Verbos (is it 247v?) + 252e would be cool. The Fenix's 8 step sequencer would mix well with that combo. Where to find a 247v though...

I thought about a Marf as well.
aethyr
Having owned serge, buchla and fenix; tkb all the way. thumbs up
pelican
Any sequencer with cv will work, doesn’t have to be banana
J3RK
pelican wrote:
Any sequencer with cv will work, doesn’t have to be banana


Along these lines, have you thought about maybe using an A4? I suppose it depends heavily on whether or not you like Elektron style sequencing. However, the A4 has really nice CV and Gate abilities. They're quite configurable, they have high resolution outputs, and are fairly easy to use. Just a thought.

Otherwise the TKB sounds like a good option, maybe the older 200-series Buchlas like the 245, 246, 248, etc.?
deltaphoenix
I get that I can use any cv sequencer, I have format converters, etc.

I have a few other pieces of banana gear, I like the thought of a banana “ecosystem “. Also, I am wishing I had a Fenix 3 & part of its attractiveness is the sequencing the sequencer stuff that happens when everything is bananas. I am looking at the modified Swamp panel in the BST, that could be a good option.

If I were to go with something else and use a format jumbler,I might go with a Synstrom Deluge. Looks fun.
Tropic Al
deltaphoenix wrote:
I get that I can use any cv sequencer, I have format converters, etc.

I have a few other pieces of banana gear, I like the thought of a banana “ecosystem “. Also, I am wishing I had a Fenix 3 & part of its attractiveness is the sequencing the sequencer stuff that happens when everything is bananas. I am looking at the modified Swamp panel in the BST, that could be a good option.

If I were to go with something else and use a format jumer,I might go with a Synstrom Deluge. Looks fun.


Deluge is great. Big update looming so the sequencing side of things will be even better. Its a great sounding easy to use sampler too plus you can load the next song whilst the current one is playing and then seamlessly transition from one to the next.
aethyr
I also own an a4 mkii and it is sort of a swiss army knife. If i want 4 voice polyphony or 2 mono synths and 2 drum sounds or any config in between plus cv/gate sequencing and extra envs and lfos going out.. I think of it as sort of a modern xpander. Plus i have a tkb so i am biased. Get both
chrisso
aethyr wrote:
Having owned serge, buchla and fenix; tkb all the way. thumbs up


Same here.
With all the different standards, plus Buchla being banana and tiny-jax, I think the easiest marriage is Serge and Fenix.
bwhittington
Wasn't there a banana version of the DET3 Archangel? Seems like that would be cool with a Fenix. TKB action with a few more features and a better price, plus a slightly more compatible aesthetic.
cebec
TKB is a great controller and sequencer but I would suggest the STS Sequencer panel, instead. Much more fun and flexible on it's own, in my opinion.

The two together (TKB/Sequencer panel) would be even better...
wavecircle
cebec wrote:
TKB is a great controller and sequencer but I would suggest the STS Sequencer panel, instead. Much more fun and flexible on it's own, in my opinion.

The two together (TKB/Sequencer panel) would be even better...


The Sequencer panel is one of my all time favourites. I have actually had LW make me one with extra mods. I had the Fenix 2 and 3 but didn't actually get on with the sequencer that well. I don't know, I just find the Serge more immediate. You also have the functionality of a 4 step TKB on that panel, well almost....
ear ear
Have you looked through the Fenix III manual? You could get 3 x 16 steps of the CGS 59 sequencer/programmer built up (i.e. with three separate clock inputs) with the skip switch mod and some CGS 09 VC dividers, but I don't know how complicated it would be to add the comparator ladder for CV stage addressing like the FIII has (or the MARF and Archangel), or what you'd do for the delay function. The FIII also has the yellow output jacks -- are these for wire ORing, like the CGS 89 gate sequencer? On second reading the manual seems to be describing TKB-style pulse trains? One other thing in the manual I don't get completely is the bit at the end of page five about different designs of EG responding to voltage level or to sharply rising edges. It seems to be implying that the Fenix EGs can respond to complex stepped voltages but don't trigger off triangle waves?
deltaphoenix
Some good ideas.

I thought there’s 1 or 2 banana Arcangels in the world. Would love to have the chance to pick one up. Don’t see many of these period.

I like TKBs, I am on the lookout for one.
The Sequencer panel is awesome. I think there is one for sale but out of my price range currently.

I keep going back to the modified Swamp panel. It is like half a TKB and some nice supporting/handy functionality as well.

@ear ear yes, you are right but I am not a builder.
ritchiedrums
Guess I am Way out of The Loop Here!

You can't custom order the Arcangel now?? seriously, i just don't get it
ear ear
deltaphoenix wrote:

I keep going back to the modified Swamp panel. It is like half a TKB and some nice supporting/handy functionality as well.

@ear ear yes, you are right but I am not a builder.


Run your question by tojpeters, who designed that modified SWAMP.
deltaphoenix
So, for now, I am going to use stuff I already have (since I decided to put together a 200e Skylab). I have a 16 step ARP reproduction sequencer, my Deluge has 4 Gates and 2 CVs out. I also have some Euro.

I will report back on my results.
jondent
In my humble opinion I think the TKB or a serge sequencer is most compatible with the fenix II.
I have a Fenix II, Fenix III, a serge and Buchla system.
The serge and fenix are a better fit in regard to voltage scaling, triggers etc.
Plus Buchla split CV & audio ... bananas for CV, tinys for audio.
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Buchla, EMS & Serge  
Page 1 of 1
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group