Sidechaining... LIVE

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Sidechaining
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Location: New Zealand

Sidechaining... LIVE

Post by Sidechaining » Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:58 am

I am setting up a live band to play original music of the weird in between electronic / pop / indie variety. To capture the glossiness of those genres, but also as a genuine compositional tool, I'm employing a few tricks:
  • Sidechain compression / ducking (and other sidechaining)
    Effects sends for multiple people
    Shared modulation sources
    Triggering synths with other instruments
All of the above is without (very deliberately to keep the liveness):
  • Clicktracks
    Midi
    Laptops
    Sequencers/arps
Basically, as there is hardly any info on achieving most of the above for a live band, I'm wondering if other people are interested in this and then i will go to the bother of documenting it!

lemonlemon
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Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:41 am

Post by lemonlemon » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:06 am

Hi there,

I just joined the forum, actually because this topic is exactly what I'm trying to figure out myself at the moment. I like to incorporate recent sounds and production techniques, but without depending on clicks, seqs or arps. (Well, maybe arps..)

Looking at hardware, there actually is a sidechain pedal. I don't know much about it. A friend uses it in a live techno band to lock his kick to the synth or synth bass (either ducking it or opening the synth signal when he plays the kick).

Here's the pedal:
https://www.raingerfx.com/product/deep- ... dechainer/

Some thoughts I had myself about such an undertaking:

The more I dive into EDM and the gadgets used there, I recognise that in general tracks are just being played back (as in: press 'start'..) and the performance aspect is the manipulation of those tracks. Most of those effects are dynamic, changing through time, morphing from one into the other. As soon as two or more aspect of a sound are manipulated independently, it gets interesting. (Having just one LFO in charge of an effect is less interesting because to me it's predictable.)

As a musician, I am already tied up in creating those tracks (playing keys etc). So creating the sounds AND manipulating them at the same time is quite tricky.

I'm a keyboarder. At the moment, I rely on effect units with expression pedals. I find Meris pedals excellent as you can move every single knob at the same time with just one pedal. Even better, you can decide the positions of the knob for the pedal's minimum and maximum position and turn the expression pedal into a wild ride through many parameter, even inverse them. You cannot even do this with your hands.

I haven't really gotten into connecting signals or modulation sources. One step at a time..

Cheers,
lemonlemon

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gentle_attack
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Location: Wash DC

Re: Sidechaining... LIVE

Post by gentle_attack » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:39 pm

Sidechaining wrote:I am setting up a live band to play original music of the weird in between electronic / pop / indie variety. To capture the glossiness of those genres, but also as a genuine compositional tool, I'm employing a few tricks:
  • Sidechain compression / ducking (and other sidechaining)
    Effects sends for multiple people
    Shared modulation sources
    Triggering synths with other instruments
All of the above is without (very deliberately to keep the liveness):
  • Clicktracks
    Midi
    Laptops
    Sequencers/arps
Basically, as there is hardly any info on achieving most of the above for a live band, I'm wondering if other people are interested in this and then i will go to the bother of documenting it!
If you're syncing synths, you have to have a master clock (preferably not like Ableton because it is not a stable MASTER). The drummer is going to want to have a clicktrack.

There is a band called The Disco Biscuits who are kind of a rock fusion band with a lot of electronic sounds... their drummer (does have a laptop also) has a Boss FS-5U that he can tap in any tempo on, which makes a master midi clock, sent to the synth player who used midi to clock about a dozen boards, effects, and Ableton. I think the bass and guitar players just use regular old tap tempo to sync to the clock for basica delay sounds. I believe their drummer did not want to use a click track but once they gave it a shot, felt like it was huge asset in the end.

If you are not syncing things with Midi or at least with clocks, everything is going to fall out of sync EXTREMELY quickly. It just doesn't work.

---
There are tons of compressors out there with basic sidechain functionality. An FMR "Really Nice Compressor" or RNC is a very inexpensive one tons of people use, it even has an input to run your kick or bassline (whatever that may be, and controls the compression of the main input. How easy is that?

---
All the other stuff you're talking about like modulation, is going to depend completely on what gear you are using.

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selfdestroyer
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Location: Fresno, CA USA
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Post by selfdestroyer » Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:11 pm

Not sure if this is the right direction but when I used to do SC compression live I used a Alesis Nanocompressor in a effects loop on a Mackie mixer and would get an output from my MPC 2K to trigger the SC... most of the time it would be a kick drum of course.

The Alesis nanocompressor is great since its cheap and pretty harsh sounding like most of the wonky beat based hip-hop and Dutch/Swedish house sidechaining.

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