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Have you ever envisioned your own sound synthesis?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Production Techniques  
Author Have you ever envisioned your own sound synthesis?
Homepage Englisch
Apologies if this is in wrong forum, but I'm not really sure where to put it.

So, you dabbled in different synthesis techniques through the years: subtractive, addictive, FM, PD, sampling, granular, vector, Karplus-Strong, LA, spectral, physical modelling. And combinations. With any possible means of producing it, hardware and software. Have you ever wondered "there must be more than this" and "invented" your own? Perhaps not adequately practically formulated it, with detailed coding or circuit boards, but have the general idea in your head or waveforms scribbled on paper? Care to share your ideas?

(I have a few: one is the variant of physical modelling, one is something I called "Quadrant-controlled oscillator" and one is based around just-tuned intervals appearing in different phenomena such is soft sync, but let's see how this thread develops.)

I'm fairly sure somebody smarter than me will pop in and say such-and-such thing already exists, but let's try.
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
Homepage Englisch wrote:
"Quadrant-controlled oscillator"


I'm curious. Can you elaborate? If it's interesting enough, maybe I can figure out how to do it with actual electrons and such.
MindMachine
Yes.
Homepage Englisch
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch wrote:
Homepage Englisch wrote:
"Quadrant-controlled oscillator"


I'm curious. Can you elaborate? If it's interesting enough, maybe I can figure out how to do it with actual electrons and such.


Okay. Imagine a waveform on a xy coordinate system. Crest is in 1st quadrant, trough is in 4th, zero crossing is at (0,0). For any parameters you have an option to do it on crest and trough separately, but there's also an option to link them, for symmetry. There's an "amplitude amount" for both sides, and it's bipolar, hence you can reflect the trough from IV to III quadrant, effectively full-wave rectifying. Not sonically interesting yet, but useful for LFOing and FMing some QCO's parameter with another QCO. Nothing earth-shattering yet. Now, imagine a set of a points (for the sake of simplicity, 4) in each quadrant that define waveform's shape and they can be freely moved at (x,y) to determine the shape and perhaps even the curvature. Basically, a dumbed-down version of "draw your own waveform" which uses some tools find in graphic (vector) software. I don't know if such thing exists, if it does, everything I posted here is rubbish because someone already implented it in a better way. There are a few more tricks in the sleeve, a (hopefully) unique takes on clipping/distorting/wavefolding and in unique "pwm" application, but if you're interested, let me know, I'll send you a PM.
mt3
Homepage Englisch wrote:
I have a few: one is the variant of physical modelling, one is something I called "Quadrant-controlled oscillator" and one is based around just-tuned intervals appearing in different phenomena such is soft sync, but let's see how this thread develops.


Post sound samples.
SlayerBadger!
Homepage Englisch
mt3 wrote:
Homepage Englisch wrote:
I have a few: one is the variant of physical modelling, one is something I called "Quadrant-controlled oscillator" and one is based around just-tuned intervals appearing in different phenomena such is soft sync, but let's see how this thread develops.


Post sound samples.
SlayerBadger!


I can't post samples if those techniques exist only in theory. I guess I could draw a waveform in DAW and then slowly re-draw changes, although it's quite a tedious task.
felixer
Homepage Englisch wrote:
I guess I could draw a waveform in DAW and then slowly re-draw changes, although it's quite a tedious task.

well get to work then. stockhausen worked two years at 'kontakte' under very difficult circumstances. no reason why you couldn't do the same.
get scribbling!
Homepage Englisch
felixer wrote:
Homepage Englisch wrote:
I guess I could draw a waveform in DAW and then slowly re-draw changes, although it's quite a tedious task.

well get to work then. stockhausen worked two years at 'kontakte' under very difficult circumstances. no reason why you couldn't do the same.
get scribbling!


Oh, scheisse, Herr Stockhausen!

Ok then. cool Will post the results here!
felixer
what about him? the most brilliant composer of the 20th century. can't stand the smell of talent/genius, can you? kontakte is still one of the best electrnic works around. and you can stuff all your dance-music where the sun doesn't shine.
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
felixer wrote:
what about him? the most brilliant composer of the 20th century.

That's really stretching it.
moremagic
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch wrote:
felixer wrote:
what about him? the most brilliant composer of the 20th century.

That's really stretching it.
he never denied it hihi
Homepage Englisch
felixer wrote:
what about him? the most brilliant composer of the 20th century. can't stand the smell of talent/genius, can you? kontakte is still one of the best electrnic works around. and you can stuff all your dance-music where the sun doesn't shine.


I love Stockhausen. But let's assume, for the sake of the argument that I don't. So I can't stand the smell of his talent and genius? What kind of assumption is that? Why?

I get it that same people are really passionate about art they love. But really, relax. No need to get upset. Nobody was insulting Stockhausen.
Dcramer
Ok, I’ll bite.

1. First my synthesis pipe dream:
Like a frequency domain Theremin, one uses gestures to construct and deconstruct timbres/samples thumbs up

And...

2. A bespoke, over priced, sock retail outlet with rather challenging elevator music:
Stockinghausen...
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lolspew
grex
i dont think this is a new type of synthesis ...but i have always wanted a true physical modeling soft-synth ...like where you had a room or area that you could fill with different objects of varying materials and have them collide into each other ...like setup a row of glass dominoes or throw a bowling ball into a tub of jello .
addendum
Homepage Englisch wrote:
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch wrote:
Homepage Englisch wrote:
"Quadrant-controlled oscillator"


I'm curious. Can you elaborate? If it's interesting enough, maybe I can figure out how to do it with actual electrons and such.


Okay. Imagine a waveform on a xy coordinate system. Crest is in 1st quadrant, trough is in 4th, zero crossing is at (0,0). For any parameters you have an option to do it on crest and trough separately, but there's also an option to link them, for symmetry. There's an "amplitude amount" for both sides, and it's bipolar, hence you can reflect the trough from IV to III quadrant, effectively full-wave rectifying. Not sonically interesting yet, but useful for LFOing and FMing some QCO's parameter with another QCO. Nothing earth-shattering yet. Now, imagine a set of a points (for the sake of simplicity, 4) in each quadrant that define waveform's shape and they can be freely moved at (x,y) to determine the shape and perhaps even the curvature. Basically, a dumbed-down version of "draw your own waveform" which uses some tools find in graphic (vector) software. I don't know if such thing exists, if it does, everything I posted here is rubbish because someone already implented it in a better way. There are a few more tricks in the sleeve, a (hopefully) unique takes on clipping/distorting/wavefolding and in unique "pwm" application, but if you're interested, let me know, I'll send you a PM.



As you almost said yourself already, it's called vector synthesis. Check out the Sequential Circuits Prophet VS from the 1980s.

You reinvented a classic! Congrats! :-)
felixer
there is software from IRCAM for prepared piano. it let's you insert various objects into your virual strings. for sale but their policy is strange: seems you must first become a member before you can order anything. and it's not cheap.
there is also PIANOTEQ (also french) who make several program geared to piano (but also going into wurlizer/rhodes territory and bells/cimbalo sounds). there is a simple live version but also more elaborate ones with many parameters. sounds great. not exactly what you are describing, just sounds. so you'll have to do the playing in some other way. maybe arduino? i'm pretty sure you could make a nice programm with 'bouncing midi notes' cool

and yeah, i'm pretty sensitive when it comes to stockhausen. esp when i see the word shit used in the same sentence. i would't know who else has changed music as drastically as he did. and he just kept going. not to be distraced by the critics. maybe cage but he never did the range of stuff stockhausen did. Xenakis? great but the same thing: a fairly small range of music. Maderna did some beautiful stuff but prob died too young. Boulez is very good but kept on rewriting his own things and never got any further. anybody else?
so i'm standing by my original saying: stockhausen is the most important composer of the 20th century.
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