MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index
 FAQ & Terms of UseFAQ & Terms Of Use   Wiggler RadioMW Radio   Muff Wiggler TwitterTwitter   Support the site @ PatreonPatreon 
 SearchSearch   RegisterSign up   Log inLog in 
WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Empirical Circuits Dual Latch
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules  
Author Empirical Circuits Dual Latch
tonymatte


The Dual Latch rolls two SR flip-flops into a 2hp form factor, created to provide a means of toggling hold/freeze inputs on digital modules with a single trigger source. A trigger sent to an up arrow input will set the corresponding output high, while a trigger sent to a down arrow will set it low. The input's with gold up and down arrows will flip the state when a trigger is received.

More info available on its MG page here.
batch
This is really cool.
lohacker
Very nice and useful, I've already seen some clips on your Instagram and I'm interested to try it out. I like also the sergesque panel graphics! Bravo! thumbs up
huffnPuff
I got one of these, it’s a cool little module. It’s very pretty and it remembers so I don’t have to cool

It fits with the way I’m going: replacing complex modules with basic building blocks and doing away with software-based modules all together.
huffnPuff
I schooled myself in flip flops here: http://www.circuitstoday.com/flip-flops

The Dual Latch has two SR flip flops (with an additional toggle input), the most basic type of FF. You can patch one yourself from logic gates like so:



You can patch more advanced flip flops (clocked SR, clocked Data) using logic gates and the flip flops in the Dual Latch.

There’s a full featured dual flip flop module from Omiindustriies, but it’s DIY only and 8hp.
huffnPuff
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flip-flops

cool
tonymatte
Thanks guys, really appreciate the positive responses!

And thanks huffnPuff for digging up some useful info on SR flip-flops. I always try to explain them to people unfamiliar with flip-flops as sort of trigger controlled gates, but that seems to create a confusion of its own. It's probably best to just learn what they really are and how they fit in with other logic modules to create more complex or useful behavior.
huffnPuff
I find it interesting that memory, in its simplest most basic implementation is a feeback patch. Makes you reflect about reflection... hmmm.....
tonymatte
Yeah! Of course the memory on the Dual Latch is volatile, since it's only a CMOS chip at the core. So buying a whole bunch of these won't allow you save patches through power cycles or anything space age like that.. Which was never the point of the module. I often reach for mine at the end of a patch session to get some sort of dramatic change going on, works well with a slew limiter like Function!
huffnPuff
I think I need another DL?

I’m using the awesome NLC Divide & Conquer for counting things, but it doesn’t have a reset input. A second DL (four flipflops in total) would allow me to count from 0000 to 1111 and also SET or RESET each bit whichever way I want, right?

Unless someone knows of a CMOS clock divider with a reset input? I’d like to be able to do this in hardware.
tonymatte
If I'm thinking about it correctly, since the set and reset inputs override the toggle inputs you could use two DL's to do that but you would need to send your reset signal to all resets simultaneously for it to reset all of them at once. If you just send it to one it will only will only temporarily inhibit any flip-flops that come after it.
huffnPuff
Sure, I was thinking of multing the reset signal to all the sub-units. In fact, using flipflops this way allows me to set the initial state to any arbitrary value - setting and resetting individual bits any way I please.
tonymatte
Just a little patch idea for those who have acquired a Dual Latch! I've been having fun using one with a slew limiter and comparator combo as a pulse stretcher for variable beats and stuff.

Send a trigger from something to a Set input then, using a stackable, send the Gate out from the Latch to your slew input. Set Fall to immediate, and send the output from the slew to a comparator looking for about 4 volts. Then patch the comparator output to the Reset input on the Latch and adjust Rise time to change the pulse length. The Gate out is split with a stackable so you can use it!
huffnPuff
OK, so here's a funny one: both my copies were working the other way around! A trigger to the down arrow would turn the output on?

And then I realized both modules were mounted up side down.
tonymatte
Yeah that can happen! hihi The symmetry can make things confusing, the LEDs should be on the right half of the front panel.
starthief
huffnPuff wrote:
OK, so here's a funny one: both my copies were working the other way around! A trigger to the down arrow would turn the output on?

And then I realized both modules were mounted up side down.


Inverting the logic by inverting the module, I like it hihi
huffnPuff
The thing is, since the outputs are marked with an exclamation mark !, also used to denote logic inversion, I thought in a moment of confusion that it was the way the module was designed.

But I remember patching it before (reorganizing my case) and it worked as expected... WTF????

zombie

Anyway it's a very useful module.
Footkerchief
Does this work at audio rate as a suboscillator?

edit: NM, module description already says yes!
batch
Making any more? I have two, but would like another 2-4.
natureclubcassettes
huffnPuff wrote:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flip-flops

cool


illuminating
reodjectz
Are these available anymore? Would love some for my 1U-free case.
Johnnyfive
reodjectz wrote:
Are these available anymore? Would love some for my 1U-free case.


I'm also keen to get one of these if they are still around (or if another production run is planned)
sko87pro
Johnnyfive wrote:
reodjectz wrote:
Are these available anymore? Would love some for my 1U-free case.


I'm also keen to get one of these if they are still around (or if another production run is planned)


+2 Yes, I'd like to get this also.

Love a good latch, I always say
mosorensen
I have a Pico Logic, but I use it mostly as two SR flip-flops for "time quantizing" random triggers (e.g, from a Krell patch). Connect the clock to "set" and the random trigger to "reset". After the trigger fires, the SR flip-flop outputs a gate exactly on the next beat of the clock. This module would be perfect for that.
gummyboy
wow..I want one too
sko87pro
I’ve left a message on Reverb.com to ask the Empirical folks if they’ll make another batch of the Dual Latch. Hopefully they’ll post here... fingers crossed
tonymatte
Hi everyone, my apologies for being so unresponsive. Truth be told I got a job about a year ago and have been so busy that this little company I wanted to start went by the wayside, and I can't remember the last time I signed into Muff's! But it's exciting to me that after all this time people are still enjoying the DL and now some new people want them. I'd like to be able to take care of the people who really want them enough to seek me out like this so I'm looking into ways of having several made and assembled for me. I just don't have the time to assemble them myself anymore. I can't make any promises but if you're truly interested in one let me know here so I can get an idea of how many I'd need, if I can make it happen I will get back to you all and start taking orders. Fingers crossed!

-Tony
B0bcat
I'd take one please smile

EDIT: make that two Chugging Beers
sir stony
That's an ideal addition, I usually never need full logic, but a flipflop (or even two) in minimum rack space is just the right tool to have. I'd like two, please. cool
I might also be able to help you making a batch.
sko87pro
Hi Tony, yes I want 2 please.

Thanks for jumping onto the thread.
gummyboy
I want one!!!
tonymatte
well that's seven so far which already sounds worth it to me, not counting everyone who commented it the past asking for one (or 2). I've asked for a quote with Slingshot assembly who I've never used before. I've never had boards assembled at all before I've always just put them together myself. sir stony any help would be appreciated at this point, just looking for any affordable and reasonably fast way to get this going!
batch
Have you considered offering them as DIY?
maltemark
Would be interested as well
ArboriaAuralist
I consider the one unit I have indispensable and would definitely buy another!

Modular "computing" for life. cool
Johnnyfive
I'm definitely keen on getting one (assuming you're able to ship to UK)!
tonymatte
I've shipped to the UK before with no issues so I should be able to, pending this all works out. Nice to hear how much current owners like them, I knew the module was cool when I made the first one but I didn't know if people would see how useful they could be. I'm surprised there aren't more advanced latch modules from the bigger guys hmmm..... I find they can really help 'orchestrate' a patch. batch I have considered this but it would definitely be a build for advanced diyers and I wouldn't know where to begin with providing support or docs. I would be willing to sell some bare boards and panels that I believe I have lying around, but I wouldn't be able to provide much more that a BOM with them.. And maybe a few helpful tips.
B0bcat
awesome that this is really going to manifest! Thanks a bunch! I don't want to unnecessarily complicate the production process but I'd also like to express interest in silver panels, or at least panel files so that they could be ordered if people are as obsessive about their all-silver systems as I am. Of course the current dark panel design is nice too smile
sir stony
Tony, did you see my pm..? hmmm.....
tonymatte
It's been about a week since I asked for an 'instant' quote from Slingshot assembly and they still haven't gotten back to me seriously, i just don't get it So I've gone ahead and took inventory and I actually have enough parts to make several units, this has got me thinking I should just fire up the soldering iron this weekend and flesh some of these out. So that's more than likely what I'll do, I'll let you all know how it goes!
sko87pro
Hurrah! Great news!
tonymatte
Sorry to leave everyone hanging again, but I've managed to find time to get 5 put together and tested. They are available rn on my Reverb shop (Empirical Circuits) or you can just message me your shipping info here and I'll get back to you with total cost $70 + shipping and where to send Paypal funds. Thanks for being patient, I plan to build more in the near future and can hopefully work out a less laborious and faster method of doing so.

-Tony
B0bcat
Fantastic! Got my order in Rockin' Banana!

Thanks a lot!!
sko87pro
Hi there,
I sent you a PM.
tonymatte
Hello everyone, I sincerely apologize to anyone who didn't get to order in time but the 5 I listed on Reverb sold within a few hours which was shocking to say the least. To bad they couldn't have sold like that 2 years ago meh I shouldn't be cynical, I happy they've become something people want so I've gone ahead and ordered parts to make 15 more. I'm working out a system to help me streamline the building process so hopefully I'll have these built within 2 weeks from now. This time I will go through my messages and take care of the people who have already reached out to me first. Again I'm very sorry to anyone that didn't get a DL this time especially to sko87pro who was the guy that originally tipped me off to the recent buzz about the DL. I'll try to keep everyone here up to date!
Paranormal Patroler
I'm keen on one if you still have a few left. Just sent you a PM. Thanks!
maltemark
tonymatte: Is there any specfic requirement for trigh length/voltage in the up/down inputs? I just received mine here in Sweden. Not getting any reaction from triggers sent from Maths, Trigger riot (set with a few different trig lengths) or squarewave from synchrodyne, and neither from a pittsburgh timerunner. LEDs not lightning, and not registering any voltage on the flipflop outs either.
Paranormal Patroler
maltemark wrote:
tonymatte: Is there any specfic requirement for trigh length/voltage in the up/down inputs? I just received mine here in Sweden. Not getting any reaction from triggers sent from Maths, Trigger riot (set with a few different trig lengths) or squarewave from synchrodyne, and neither from a pittsburgh timerunner. LEDs not lightning, and not registering any voltage on the flipflop outs either.


Have you checked the power connection? Sounds like a faulty unit to me. No chance that large a number of modules won't work with it.
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules  
Page 1 of 2
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group