Suggestions for first sequencer

[Javert]

Hi all,

I started putting my eurorack together about 6 months ago and I currently have...

Pamela's New Workout
Make Noise STO & Maths
Mutable Instruments Plaits, Veils & Kinks

Over the coming weeks and months I'm hoping to expand a little and get things like the 2hp Pluck, Morphagene, Erbe Verb, 4ms DLD & Basimilus Iteritas Alter.

With the above in mind I thought I'd also better consider a sequencer rather than just creating random sequences from PNW.

I initially wanted to do all the sequencing from within the rack using something like the Varigate 8+, Voltage Block, Rene or Marbles but I'm now considering the Beatstep Pro due to its low price and apparent ease of creating stuff. I'm not that interested in the Hermod though as it reminds me too much of sequencing on my computer.

I'd be looking to make slow generative stuff but want to make sure I've got enough outs to cover all my voices, which is why I was looking at the Voltage Block.

Any sequencer thoughts or ideas would be most appreciated.

Thanks.

[luketeaford]

Apparently, people struggle with pitch sequences from the voltage block. I read through the entire mega thread and it doesn't seem to be a big enough issue to deter me from buying one (but it will be a year from now).

In the mean time, Rene is an easy sequencer to recommend. It can do two channels of cv and two channels of gate, not to mention how immediate, performable, and open ended it is. It's handy in generative patches because there are so many ways to manipulate its sequence and the touch pads always take priority, so if things get out of hand, you can find your way back to something by using it as a keyboard. 10/10. Perfect module for me. There is one small gripe that I think is legitimate: if your quantizer does not begin on C, the notes can appear out of order. The work around is to just learn the scales and modes of C. (Not a big deal for me)

[mdoudoroff]

I certainly agree that Rene is a good choice, particularly as a module (as opposed to an external sequencer). It’s very modular-minded.

You might want to look through this list:
http://doudoroff.com/sequencers/

Not every sequencer is listed there, but all the heavier duty ones are (the sort that would compete with a Beat Step Pro). A good starting point for researching a complex topic.

[Agawell]

BSP is a really good choice (especially since the 2.0 firmware) I use mine quite a bit (although sometimes just as a po;yrythmic clock to drive a random sequence) although I do also sequence my drm1mk2 and control lumen on my macbook with it

as you get more voices/sound sources you will want to get some plumbing modules (buffered mults, precision adders, logic etc links, kinks and disting work well for me here)

marbles is also a really interesting module - I'm looking at it in the near(ish) future (probably no 3 or 4 modules down the line so probably towards the end of the year)

alternatively there are modules out there that will do all these things in one (eloquencer etc) but they are much more complex to get started with I think

[hemeroscopium]

Look at Stillson Hammer - playable. 4 tracks, very immediate.

[melodydad]

You might like to take a look at Transistor Labs sequencer Stepper Acid as a first sequencer. lots of features, intuitive to use and a rock solid clock. Manufactured not far from you! Mattech has them back in stock right now.

[Javert]

Thanks for the link and suggestions.

Am aware of the Stepper Acid and Stillson Hammer but not fully looked into their capabilities.

Do people generally run / use multiple sequencers? I'm still fairly new to eurorack and will need to work out how to manage 5 or 6 voices (for when I add the Pluck, Morphagene & BIA)

It's my birthday soon and am hoping my wife will let me buy myself something. Think a sequencer would be the best step forward rather than a reverb or delay.

[FrogStar]

Many people use multiple sequencers even when only sequencing a single voice. Combining sequencers through a switch allows for things like transposition and melody variation. The big challenge w/ sequencers is keeping things interesting over time.
Here’s a great video from Mylar Melodies discussing the process:

[FarmerPhilip]

This would be a good place to plug what I suspect is Mylar Melody's favorite sequencer: Intellijel's Metropolis. It isn't cheap but I don't think there is a sequencer out their that is much more playable or intuitive.

[melodydad]

Thanks for the link and suggestions.

Am aware of the Stepper Acid and Stillson Hammer but not fully looked into their capabilities.

Do people generally run / use multiple sequencers? I'm still fairly new to eurorack and will need to work out how to manage 5 or 6 voices (for when I add the Pluck, Morphagene & BIA)

It's my birthday soon and am hoping my wife will let me buy myself something. Think a sequencer would be the best step forward rather than a reverb or delay.

I have at least six sequencers - more if you count the Turing Machine and Noisering! However, I rarely use them together as I haven't figured out a way to patch a satisfactory 'global reset' to start multiple sequencers on 'step 1' and in any case I multitrack sequences in ProTools so this is not an issue.

I would start with one and see how you go.

I must say that Sequencer + Pluck is great fun!

[lisa]

Rene is an easy sequencer to recommend. It can do two channels of cv and two channels of gate, not to mention how immediate, performable, and open ended it is.(...) 10/10.

I have a slightly different take on this. I don't think that it's always that immediate. It's quite menu heavy but lacking a screen so it might be a bit hard to know how to make changes to the settings without the manual available. And it takes several touches just to change direction of the sequencer, for instance.

Also, two channels of CV sure , and they can be used independently but not in a very immediate way. It's not like you can twiddle with them simultaneously or even go back and forth like you can on many digital sequencers.

[nolongerhuman]

For what it's worth I've had:

Rene, Metropolis, Varigate 8+, Varigate 4+, Stepper Acid, Eloquencer, and a Voltage Block.

Rene for me was fun, loads of strange accidents. Difficult to use in any "normal" way (for me) it was more of a CV experimentation device than anything else. Pretty fun, too big for me.

Metropolis was probably the most "musical" but only 8 step. Ultimately those 8 steps became too limiting.

Varigate 8+ and 4+ have the same issue, and that is essentially you never have any idea what's going on from channel to channel. There are indicators but in particular for pitch CV, dialing in anything from channel to channel, I always end up having to zero every slider and start again when switching back from track to track. If you have the space the 8+ is pretty great for triggers, but for CV I don't care for it. Also, an almost total lack of CV control.

Voltage Block is pretty great when you get used to it's quirks. Reminds me a bit of a limited version of an Elektron sequencer, but I am not using it for pitch CV. Having sequenced, time modulation CV is great so that's how I use it.

Eloquencer I found very close to sequencing in Ableton. Too close considering I have Ableton sitting right here, I saw no reason to dedicate rack space. Also, strange omissions. No slide for example.

Stepper Acid was fun and immediate, but also large, and again, an almost total lack of CV control.

After all these sequencers, I ended up going with a Beatstep Pro which has it's own limitations, but ultimately, it takes no rack space, it's cheap, it has multiple gate outs, pads, a tempo read out, and can be a MIDI/CV converter.

If you have tons of rack space I could see having a whole row of sequencers, but I don't nor do I want to open that can of worms.

Take from that what you will. I make largely structured, western scale based music, and Eurorack is just one of quite a few synths used more as an SFX and rhythm box than anything else. If I was trying to put together entire songs in euro I'd likely want something different.

[cg_funk]

Thanks for the link and suggestions.

I have at least six sequencers - more if you count the Turing Machine and Noisering! However, I rarely use them together as I haven't figured out a way to patch a satisfactory 'global reset' to start multiple sequencers on 'step 1'

OMG I am very new to modular, and this is quickly become my biggest frustration...
I have a clock divider, a clock rotator, DFAM 8 step sequencer and a Tonnetz.
So basically 4 modules that need to be reset in different ways, and the DFAM needs to be manually advanced to the 8th step to reset and switched back to RUN (up to 10 button presses!).

....maybe I should just embrace that which I cannot control, modular is mostly random happy accidents anyways.

Anyways, multiple sequencers is a sure fire way to make your sequences sound less boring! The alternative is getting a fancy digital tracker module, or connecting to a larger dedicated sequencer/or computer.

[kwaidan]

If you have dry hands, Rene can be extremely difficult or even impossible to operate correctly. Run a search, and you will find several threads about problems with its touch pads.

Running several sequencers from a single clock shouldn’t be a problem, especially if each unit has reset.

With an analog sequencer, you will probably need to buy a quantizer to correct pitch.

If you have Ableton with Max4Live, you can find a few programs that emulate sequencers—from basic eight step ones with knobs to Rene and even Metropolis, which is based on the Roland M185.

Defective Records sells a software emulation of the M185. They also make an emulation of the Klee Sequencer, which is an enteresting DIY sequencer available in Eurorack. Both programs can be demoed.

[lisa]

If you have dry hands, Rene can be extremely difficult or even impossible to operate correctly. Run a search, and you will find several threads about problems with its touch pads.

Hm. I've not once had this problem.

Do people generally run / use multiple sequencers?

I think so, yes. Generally you could ask the same thing about most types of modules and the answer would be yes. After all, this is the community where you can ask which module is best out of two and people will tell you to get both.

10% of my my modules are pure sequencer modules and another 10% can be used as sequencers too. I think that's fairly normal.

[Javert]

Many people use multiple sequencers even when only sequencing a single voice. Combining sequencers through a switch allows for things like transposition and melody variation. The big challenge w/ sequencers is keeping things interesting over time.
Here’s a great video from Mylar Melodies discussing the process:

Thanks. Not watched that video for a while, so will have to go back through some of his video's again I think.

I'd really like to be able to do everything in the rack, which is why I didn't really want to get an SQ-1 or Beatstep Pro, but the Beatstep Pro is looking more and more enticing. I also didn't really want any more devices with screens, but if that's what makes a sequencer better then maybe that'll be the way to go - I might take a look at the Eloquencer but don't know what it's like for melodies.

I have plenty of rack space left as my current modules only take up about a quarter of my Mantis case, however, planning everything out on Modular Grid (my current plan is actually based on using Marbles & Stages rather than any of the earlier modules I listed) I still have about 30hp left.

[luketeaford]

I have a slightly different take on this. I don't think that it's always that immediate. It's quite menu heavy but lacking a screen so it might be a bit hard to know how to make changes to the settings without the manual available. And it takes several touches just to change direction of the sequencer, for instance.

Also, two channels of CV sure , and they can be used independently but not in a very immediate way. It's not like you can twiddle with them simultaneously or even go back and forth like you can on many digital sequencers.

Yes, good points! There are certain things it's awkward to do with Rene which is why I'm interested in other sequencers, too-- I also use a Voltage MultiStage and will buy a Voltage Block next year. I also have Brains/Pressure Points and a sequential switch. All of them have their advantages and disadvantages, but in my experience Rene is the best and most flexible as a normal sequencer.

It's possible with Rene to make your own behaviors with it. If you want to change direction without touching the menus, I'd put it in addressing mode and switch between the addressing CVs.

I should also mention I have Rene in a shared system where you have maths, pressure points, wogglebug, etc right by so that is helping with the immediacy to be certain!

[Javert]

Am actually now tempted along the Pressure Points / Brains / Sequential Switch route. I think I'd rather create everything 'in the moment' rather than having some form of save function to create pieces over a longer period of time.

I also really need to get a Quantizer.

So much stuff that I want to get

[lisa]

My go to sequencer isn’t really a sequencer. It’s the WMD Arpitecht. Arpeggiator and quantizer. Great fun and easy to use. No menu.

luketeaford Good input.

[Rastalien]

I can recommend Rene too. I have it now for a while and after a short learning period it has a great functionality and it is fun to use.
I think later on I will go for a Polyend SEQ what looks like the thing for me.

[Javert]

I really like the idea in modular that you don't necessarily need a sequencer in order to create a sequence of notes. I'll certainly get one (maybe two or three) true sequencers but I'll also make sure I have other modules capable of creating melodies.

I really wanted to make sure there wasn't a single 'must have' sequencer that was analog and capable of controlling pretty much everything I have / am going to get.

[cptnal]

I'm currently having a blast with this combo: PP+Brains, a switch, and a uScale, which can transpose within your scale (rather than just changing the root note and transposing everything else with it). OK, not "A" sequencer, but the beauty is that when you're not feeling very sequencery it can be broken down and its constituent parts used in other ways. (FWIW, I also have my eye on a René.)

This is after having been sequencer-free for a long time (I fell off the wagon!). But having travelled that path I can tell you there's a lot of fun to be had with the humble sample and hold.

And one of the many things Stages can do is be a sequencer. Again, use it as one if you need it, use it for something else if you don't.

[peripatitis]

Sequencing is indeed a problem. I ended up with a teletype and i find it to be the most "modular" sequencer of all. Of course it resides to one side of the extreme (code).

[kwaidan]

I really like the idea in modular that you don't necessarily need a sequencer in order to create a sequence of notes. I'll certainly get one (maybe two or three) true sequencers but I'll also make sure I have other modules capable of creating melodies.

I really wanted to make sure there wasn't a single 'must have' sequencer that was analog and capable of controlling pretty much everything I have / am going to get.

You may want a Cirklon:

Cirklon Sequencer

There’s a waiting list!

[spukhaft]

I would go with a Beat Step Pro. I have a Division 6 dual sequencer, but its honestly a toy.

My go to is the Beat Step or an old Roland MC-303. I on't care for the notion of being a eurorack purist. If it can be done more effectively, and for less $ outside the rack, then I got that route. And yeah, that most certainly includes effects.