ACL Sinfonion

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Der Mann mit der Maschine
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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:26 am

cioaudio wrote: Splendid. Looking some way ahead, will the serial protocol for master/slave connection be an open protocol?

The reason I ask is that it appears the Sinfonion is one of the only devices of a system that fully understands tonaliity and it may be useful for non-Sinfonion devices to be slaves to a Sinfonion.
Hi, the protocol is very simple and I gladly will make this open when somebody wants to implement it on another device. There are just two possible stumbling blocks here:
  • 1. In order to keep the amount of transferred data minimal (i.e. have a short latency) the protocol does not transfer the actual scale but just the degree and mode number. So any potential slave needs to have the exactly same scheme of degrees and modes like the Sinfonion - at least in memory
  • 2. Any future change in the Sinfonion - e.g. new scales - would essentially break the protocol and make things incompatible
Besides from that I have had the idea myself. There could be a couple of interesting applications - like sequencers, melody generators, other quantisers and so on that could join in the "Sinfonion network"...

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titanlegions
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Post by titanlegions » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:12 am

You could consider a "sync scale settings" as a separate transfer protocol that must be manually initiated on both devices. Then it would only need to be done if there is any update to the scales and you maintain the minimal data of the original protocol.

Of course, that would require a future proof representation of the scales and settings of some kind I guess, so you still have a potential problem there, but it might be easier to deal with that way.

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Der Mann mit der Maschine
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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:33 am

Hi,

here is another improvisation with two Sinfonions. This time it's a bit overkill, since almost all voices play a C. :eek:

https://soundcloud.com/dermannmitdermas ... sations-12
Last edited by Der Mann mit der Maschine on Tue Nov 26, 2019 4:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by StoneAgeOfTheFuture » Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:13 am

Supermathi
Great job on the new track! I can't wait to use my incoming Sinfonion to help make huge soundscapes. Thanks for posting that piece.
Last edited by StoneAgeOfTheFuture on Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by titanlegions » Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:59 am

Sounds awesome!

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Delivery date slippage

Post by cioaudio » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:13 am

musicstore have just revised my delivery date from end April to beginning June. Probably can't read too much into this since I think the original date was a complete guess. But maybe there are lots of preorders or production isn't ramping as quickly as hoped.

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Der Mann mit der Maschine
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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:22 am

[video][/video]

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titanlegions
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Post by titanlegions » Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:42 am

Ah dude, you make such lovely clear videos.

A question, when you are sequencing a slaved device, do the button settings get mirrored, or can they operate independently? Also the same question about the chord settings such as spread?

Hope the pick and place machine is running well. How did the VCA construction go?

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Post by pixelforest » Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:49 am

Supermathi wrote:Hi,

here is another improvisation with two Sinfonions. This time it's a bit overkill, since almost all voices play a C. :eek:

https://soundcloud.com/zarkuun/improvisations-12
secret hidden track from the bladerunner 2049 score? might as well be! would love to see video of this.

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Post by giftculture » Mon Apr 01, 2019 1:03 pm

Is there a way to back up songs from the sinfonion in case it is filled up?

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Post by -S.L- » Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:21 am

how funny is that I had the Freeze function in my head, and I have never touched a Sinfonion yet ! :party:

when can we get that module ???? :deadbanana:

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:16 am

giftculture wrote:Is there a way to back up songs from the sinfonion in case it is filled up?
Sorry, right now not. I could be possible in a future version, maybe....

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Der Mann mit der Maschine
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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:19 am

titanlegions wrote:A question, when you are sequencing a slaved device, do the button settings get mirrored, or can they operate independently? Also the same question about the chord settings such as spread?
Ah. Good question! A slave of a sequenced Sinfonion will always be in "live" mode - i.e. the buttons will never be sequenced here. This is a restriction but It seems to me the easiest way to do this. Otherwise the slave would also be forced to use the sequenced mode and store the button settings in its own sequences - while ignoring the actual roots and scales there. That seemed very confusing to me.

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Post by mdoudoroff » Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:42 am

Another magnificent video with Episode 5! Very exciting.

So, in an attempt to better understand, I so far see three main approaches to using Sinfonion:


1 — Rely entirely on the chord progression sequencer for song structure

You program a song with up to four parts, clock Sinfonion, and it does its thing.

Switching parts is manual or CV-based (1 octave—1 volt—per part).

Song reset trigger is needed to restart everything from the beginning (manual gate or from assignable jack)

Question: is there no trigger output available when Sinfonion changes parts?

If you want to go crazy and your song needs more than four parts, you can span multiple “songs”, in which case you have to handle song switching, either by switching songs manually (turn knob) or use CV (1 semitone per song). Above still applies.

Question: Can you cue a song switch for the end of the currently-playing part, or is a song switch instant, but beat-quantized?

Question: Does switching songs effectively reset to 1A of that song?


2 — Externally sequence the Sinfonion chord progression sequencer

Sinfonion chord progression sequencer is stopped. Part (and song, if needed) are selected manually or via CV, per above. Part step is advanced by gate (manual or CV trigger).

Song reset needed to restart everything from the beginning (manual gate or from assignable jack)


3 — Manual usage and/or externally sequence the Sinfonion WITHOUT the chord progression sequencer

Sequencer is disabled, and you play the UI and/or employ CV as you like.

----

Did I miss any other approaches?

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Thu Apr 04, 2019 7:05 am

mdoudoroff wrote:Another magnificent video with Episode 5! Very exciting.

So, in an attempt to better understand, I so far see three main approaches to using Sinfonion:


1 — Rely entirely on the chord progression sequencer for song structure

You program a song with up to four parts, clock Sinfonion, and it does its thing.

Switching parts is manual or CV-based (1 octave—1 volt—per part).

Song reset trigger is needed to restart everything from the beginning (manual gate or from assignable jack)

Question: is there no trigger output available when Sinfonion changes parts?

If you want to go crazy and your song needs more than four parts, you can span multiple “songs”, in which case you have to handle song switching, either by switching songs manually (turn knob) or use CV (1 semitone per song). Above still applies.

Question: Can you cue a song switch for the end of the currently-playing part, or is a song switch instant, but beat-quantized?

Question: Does switching songs effectively reset to 1A of that song?


2 — Externally sequence the Sinfonion chord progression sequencer

Sinfonion chord progression sequencer is stopped. Part (and song, if needed) are selected manually or via CV, per above. Part step is advanced by gate (manual or CV trigger).

Song reset needed to restart everything from the beginning (manual gate or from assignable jack)


3 — Manual usage and/or externally sequence the Sinfonion WITHOUT the chord progression sequencer

Sequencer is disabled, and you play the UI and/or employ CV as you like.

----

Did I miss any other approaches?
Hi Martin,

here are some answers:

1. There is no trigger (yet) at the point of a song part switch. Would be easy to do, however...

2. Song switching is only immediately. The scheduled switching is just with in a song (between the parts).

3. There are various ways of manually switching chords. One way is this: create a song part and treat it just as a "collection" of chords. The during your performance you open the SONG page and choose chords by pressing the according buttons. In my live rig I have combined this with an external mini keyboard for selecting the root note. Currently I mainly improvise chord progressions. But last year I've played a couple of gigs with prepare progressions. I love the fact that both is possible.

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Post by bkbirge » Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:22 am

Supermathi wrote: 1. There is no trigger (yet) at the point of a song part switch. Would be easy to do, however...
That would be quite useful I think.

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Post by mdoudoroff » Thu Apr 04, 2019 10:09 am

I can definitely see a song part trigger being useful to advance a sequencer or sequential switch. Worse, I imagine uses for a trigger n beats prior to the change to trigger a fill or transition.

:hide:

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Der Mann mit der Maschine
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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Sun Apr 07, 2019 4:16 am

[video][/video]

This time it's the arpeggiator :bananaguitar:. Please enjoy, subscribe and comment :hail:

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Post by mdoudoroff » Sun Apr 07, 2019 10:53 am

Another fine video! The Arpeggiator is so approachable that I expect it will be one of the first aspects of the Sinfonion I dig into.

The 1.2.1 manual draft section 9.4 references a “SYNC button”. Is that instead a menu setting?

I don’t see much info on arpeggiator CV support in the manual draft. Can we CV stuff like reset, direction, pattern, begin, and range?

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Post by -S.L- » Mon Apr 08, 2019 6:05 am

tha'ts where the expander is coming handy :mrgreen:

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Mon Apr 08, 2019 6:42 am

-S.L- wrote:tha'ts where the expander is coming handy :mrgreen:
Oh, CVs are assignable anyway. Adding a few more options should be easy :)

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Tue Apr 09, 2019 4:34 pm

Hey guys,

I've just created an update of the user manual. It now contains a couple of new diagrams and updated screen shots.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ya6P0 ... MrUE9NsQ41

If you find any typos, grammatical problems, weird explanations or other crap please drop me a note.

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:36 am

Hey guys,

thanks for your plenty of feedback. I've fixed quite a bunch of typos with your help. Here is a revised version of the manual:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1IH7Dm ... pbm7D9K9HH

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Post by cioaudio » Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:40 am

I've really appreciated reading an updated manual but one reason I had to read it so many times was because I had a mental block on what the DEGREE control did.
It is perhaps unfortunate that in the introduction it is merely described as selecting chord quality. I suppose this is effectively yet another synonym for scale/chord. The word quality does not appear again in the document which does not help tie terminology together.

It isn't really fully explained until the Major mode is described on page 61. Iin some modes where a full cadence is involved the DEGREE control will actually select scale degree, at least at some positions.

It is also explained quite late in the manual about the equivalence of scales and chords, again this is arguably problematic when using different synonyms interchangeably prior to that.

So my understanding is that there are too many scales/chords to be selected from a single control so MODE selects a specific liist of related chords/scales, DEGREE then selects a specific chord/scale from that list.

If that is correct the manual could perhaps be clearer about their relationship a little earlier.
If that is incorrect the manual could perhaps be clearer about whatever I misunderstood :)

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Post by Der Mann mit der Maschine » Tue Apr 16, 2019 12:09 pm

Hi all,

thanks you all for finding typos in the manual. I've created an updated version (with the same content):

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1zK741 ... o6rt9Zug_R

If you don't mind missplaced commas and other typos don't need an update.

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