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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Thinking about selling my ER 301, help me not to
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next [all]
Author Thinking about selling my ER 301, help me not to
Jaypee
It's very handy having this modular-module but there is not a single thing it can do better that I can do with other modules.

If I use it for simple FX chain....It'd better to use proper FX pedals/modules/plug-in

I used a lot of karplus strong...it sounds ok, but no better than my previous D0. I'm sure a Delay1022 would work

I wanna keep a very high end modules capable of a lot combined together.
Don't like the drums/percussion and others 1 sound=1 module.


Here is my rig at the moment:




Anyone sold it for this reason?
x2mirko
I agree that it's not going to be better than a reverb pedal if all you do is put audio through it and run it into the reverb unit that comes with it. But that's sort of like saying Max isn't useful because cverb~ doesn't sound as good as an Eventide pedal. It's a generic DSP module and thus is mainly useful if you have use cases for building your own DSP chains. It can do a lot of things you can't do with any other modules (other than maybe the Percussa module), but "reverb" doesn't fall into that category.

If you find that it's hard to engage with it to build more complex things, it's probably not for you, at least for now. The current state of documentation certainly isn't very inviting to someone who isn't already into tinkering with DSP to begin with, so I can definitely see why one might feel this way. I think that this sort of usage will improve over time as more units are developed and particularly as the lower layers will be exposed for the community to develop units on their own, but that may still be a long while from now.
Jaypee
x2mirko wrote:
It can do a lot of things you can't do with any other modules (other than maybe the Percussa module), but "reverb" doesn't fall into that category.


Thanks!
Like what?
Maybe I just need a different approach to this module.
brandonlogic
Jaypee wrote:
It's very handy having this modular-module but there is not a single thing it can do better that I can do with other modules.



Load up long wave files, like field recordings and mess around with the sample units, like manual grains, grain stretch, etc. pretty sure it can do that better than your other modules, dosnt look like you even have any other sampler modules? Having a sample player in the rack that you can manipulate with cv directly is a great thing, and the 301 is possibly the best for it.
bemushroomed
For modules you have to mess around with a lot, placement is of course the most important aspect. It must be placed so that you can easily and very comfortable work with it. If it's placed like in your image then yeah, it's not gonna be fun.

All the modules i work with a lot (bitbox etc) is placed in a skiff on my table, directly in front of me, they're facing upwards and i can work with them for a long time comfortably.
x2mirko
Just something I thought of right now that you could definitely not do with some other module: Create a beat-synched multitap delay where each of the delay chains doesn't just play back the audio, but instead feeds an audio buffer that feeds a granular voice which is being sequenced by a chain of shift registers (clocked at the same rate), such that you get a canon of granular voices that shift through a sequence of both timbral and melodic changes in sync.

I haven't tried this, so it may well sound absolutely terrible, but the idea seems like fun to me. Might build this tonight.

But more generally: There's a lot of things regarding working with audio-streams in a dynamic and modular way that are hard to do with other modules. You could use different LFO shapes to scroll through an audio buffer or use the new feedback mechanic in 0.4 to address an audio buffer with the last sample you just read out of it (if you're into glitchy sounds). You could build an ambient track just out of multiple loopers reading audio data out of each others buffers and playing back at different speeds with the results being mixed together in the end - play a few piano notes into it and watch them slowly get ground to pieces.

There's very few limitations on the possibilities if you're willing to put the legwork in and think creatively about what you could do.
mdoudoroff
[deleted] meh
bc3
IMO if you have to question why you need the 301 then you might not need the 301. Possibly it is not lining up with your personal workflow? As I am sure you know it is a deep machine that sometimes cannot provide that instant gratification other modules can. Good news is that if you decide to sell I'm sue you will have no trouble finding a buyer. cool
johny_gtr
I think you can sell 301 for the price of new without any problems.
I just (pre-ordered) it yesterday and see this unit as a multi-sampler looper with many manipulation on the loops, especially for live performances.

I can't say are 301 FX top notch or not but whole euro worlds is more about new and fresh things than audiophile grade sound. In that case MU system and old rack devices can be better choice.
brandonlogic
when in doubt go back and watch the very first er-301 video before it was released, the one that got us hyped for it https://vimeo.com/172415551
I seriously recommend focusing on sample manipulation with internal and external modulation. At the core of it that's what the 301 is all about imo. the other stuff, delays, reverbs, etc are nice bonuses.
nectarios
What is the waiting time as of now? I am planning on ordering one soon.
Hovercraft


This is the Morphophone, built in Pierre Schaeffer's GRM studio. At some point, someone thought--what if we have a giant tape loop with a write head, erase head, and 10 adjustable read heads--each feeding into a bandpass filter? The ER-301 is for artists that think like that. The power isn't isn't in replicating other modules--although you can do that. The power is in translating your own concepts and architectures into sound.
Southfork
It’s a great module for filling in gaps especially in a live rig, for example I needed a sidechain compressor, didn’t have one so made one on the er301, or made a multiband fixed filter bank. Another great ability it has is dealing with huge volume tasks, want a polyphonic synth with 32 voices, no problem, need 64 granular voices layered and triggered independently etc.

Granted it’s only as good as the time you’re going to spend on it it’s a pretty blank canvas. In fact I agree with the OP, even if I spend months designing a complex VCO or reverb, delay or granular mangler there are modules out do a better job and made by more qualified people. if you have the money and hp that is.
Jaypee
Thanks for your message. mdoudoroff too bad you deleted your message, I always like your contribution on MW (and Soundcloud!)

@brandonlogic
Speaking about sampler...I wanted to use it for drums, but ER 301 is unusable because of the latency.
I'm sure Assimil8or is a killer for this use.

Will re-watch videos yeah...maybe I need to get inspiration...will check on Instagram, always some nice videos here...
Maybe I didn't have the "wow factor" since I have it. neither saw it on videos/demos.

About sampling manipulation yes, you're right!
Will do a session with er 301 tonight.

And I don't mind programming it. I do like it.


bemushroomed

My rack is a mess on MG, not in real life, ER 301 is just in front of me smile

Yeah I know selling this module is very easy, I'm not rushed.

Please, no PM, I haven't take any decision...yet!


Thankssssss!
brandonlogic
Jaypee wrote:

@brandonlogic
Speaking about sampler...I wanted to use it for drums, but ER 301 is unusable because of the latency.


It is totally useable for drums, you just have to drop a delay unit in your trigger inputs by about 1ms so that it receives the slice selection cv slightly before it receives the play trigger/gate. its not enough latency to be an issue at all IMO.
Jaypee
brandonlogic wrote:
Jaypee wrote:

@brandonlogic
Speaking about sampler...I wanted to use it for drums, but ER 301 is unusable because of the latency.


It is totally useable for drums, you just have to drop a delay unit in your trigger inputs by about 1ms so that it receives the slice selection cv slightly before it receives the play trigger/gate. its not enough latency to be an issue at all IMO.


I meant the latency between gate received and sound at the output


https://forum.orthogonaldevices.com/t/latency-questions/506
brandonlogic
Jaypee wrote:
brandonlogic wrote:
Jaypee wrote:

@brandonlogic
Speaking about sampler...I wanted to use it for drums, but ER 301 is unusable because of the latency.


It is totally useable for drums, you just have to drop a delay unit in your trigger inputs by about 1ms so that it receives the slice selection cv slightly before it receives the play trigger/gate. its not enough latency to be an issue at all IMO.


I meant the latency between gate received and sound at the output


https://forum.orthogonaldevices.com/t/latency-questions/506


interesting, i use it for drums all the time and hasnt been an issue for me
Southfork
brandonlogic wrote:
Jaypee wrote:
brandonlogic wrote:
Jaypee wrote:

@brandonlogic
Speaking about sampler...I wanted to use it for drums, but ER 301 is unusable because of the latency.


It is totally useable for drums, you just have to drop a delay unit in your trigger inputs by about 1ms so that it receives the slice selection cv slightly before it receives the play trigger/gate. its not enough latency to be an issue at all IMO.


I meant the latency between gate received and sound at the output


https://forum.orthogonaldevices.com/t/latency-questions/506


interesting, i use it for drums all the time and hasnt been an issue for me


Latency is badly noticeable, especially when you start sending sequencer channels to different modules and the the 301.
Jaypee
the problem is not the latency on its own, but if you play with other modules the latency is there

Is 8ms (or so) noticeable? of course!
nectarios
Didn't know the latency was that much.
brandonlogic
is it always 8ms? some people in that thread are saying 4 ms some say 8...
nectarios
brandonlogic wrote:
Jaypee wrote:
the problem is not the latency on its own, but if you play with other modules the latency is there

Is 8ms (or so) noticeable? of course!


is it always 8ms? some people in that thread are saying 4 ms some say 8...

Down to sampling frequency from what I read. 8ms at 48k, 4ms at 96k.
Jaypee
Even 4ms is way too much if you make 'techno' music.

Groove needs to be tight.
brandonlogic
i guess when i use the 301 for drums, its the only drum source in the patch so i never really had an issue with the latency. also- i dont make techno hihi
pointed
I agree with OP that the interface is absurdly deep which means that getting ones dough out of the ER-301 is a matter of commitment, and if one lacks this, it will not be your go-to.

It does things that are not otherwise possible/likely in Euro, and it is not done yet, so I'm holding on to seee where it goes.

That said, the well-established threshold of human perception is 100ms. If you think you are noticing a 4-8ms lag I suggest you discontinue your methamphetamine habit immediately and seek professional help.
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