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Sequencing differences: Bassline vs x0xi0 vs 303
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> General Gear Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next [all]
Author Sequencing differences: Bassline vs x0xi0 vs 303
lionelfischer
Focusing on just the sequencing methods for each one, what are the differences? Is one clearly better for live performance stuff? Is it all a matter of personal taste?

Acidlab Bassline vs. x0xi0 (bcbox) vs original 303
Luka
303 sequencer is a nightmare to program
xoxbox is fantastic
computer controlled
The Acidlab Bassline is the nightmare to sequence. You use a rotary switch to enter your notes. The 303 is easy, just a bit cumbersome. The x0x is a dream.
suitandtieguy
Bassline or Bassline 2?
lionelfischer
suitandtieguy wrote:
Bassline or Bassline 2?


bassline 2 is what i meant
lionelfischer
anyone familiar with the xoxio? is it all the devilfish has and more? or are they different?
Luka
not the same

i havent heard a devilfish in person, from memory devilfish increases something in the filter or envelope by 66.6%. i think it includes octave switching as well which xoxIO doesnt have.

xoxIO is great. all bcbox's mods are top notch
the distortion and overdrive sounded great
computer controlled
The x0xi0 is just a mod for the x0xb0x. It's some CV/Gate ins and outs, and a nice overdrive circuit. I had one on my first x0xb0x, nice mod! That is part of a larger mod. But it isn't a full x0xb0x kit. Just a series of mods.
Luka
considering you can get xoxboxes for 500 or so now i wouldn't consider anything else for a 303 style box. it is the best hands down and the cheapest.
computer controlled
Luka wrote:
considering you can get xoxboxes for 500 or so now i wouldn't consider anything else for a 303 style box. it is the best hands down and the cheapest.


Pretty much!

thumbs up
computer controlled
I have slight fancies of selling my 303 sometimes. But it would take large amounts of cash, or a killer trade to get it from me =o]
phono1337
computer controlled wrote:
I have slight fancies of selling my 303 sometimes. But it would take large amounts of cash, or a killer trade to get it from me =o]


dream on Larry, you know its never going to happen, unless your ears and fingers dropped off in a freak illness or something lol
computer controlled
Hehe applause
Limey
confirming the cumbersome and quirky editing of the TB303 due to the fact that the buttons are lowqual and produces some serious contactbounces. making it difficult to program just one C#-note or one decayed step.
The xoxbox on the other hand, like said. a dream to program.
lionelfischer
i read that x0xi0 does everything a devilfish 303 does and more

* is this true or different beasts
dequalsrxt
i personally much prefer the tb-303 sequencer to the x0x. i like the independence between note and gate value.
acidphakist
I own a stock x0xb0x, a fully bcbox-modded x0xb0x and a Devilfish.

I had the x0xb0x first and obviously that's how I learned to program my acid. It took me awhile to love the tb-303 sequencer, but the fact that notes, then gate, then octave/slide/accent are entered is where the "happy accident" of acid comes in. I never managed this on my x0xb0x.

The fully bcbox-modded x0xb0x does far more than a Devilfish. For starters, it includes a second oscillator. It also has an AD and an ADSR envelope available, plus switchable filter overdrive, osc sync, FM, and routing for the envs to the VCA and VCF.

The Devilfish mod was not as striking as I expected it to be, but half of the value in Fishing your 303 is that Robin replaces the pots and tactile switches and even goes so far as to refurbish wears in color around the knobs. No more scratchy scratchy, no more bouncy bouncy.

Before I owned my tb-303 I refused to hear a difference between the x0xb0x and the Roland. To most people, the differences are invisible or, at the most, unimportant. The best way I can describe them is: the tb-303's square wave is unbelievably "sweet' and neither of my x0xb0xes sound anything like it. Furthermore, the 303 handles itself in a "tighter" way at extreme res and cutoff settings...the x0xb0x feels more "sloppy" and bombastic. I find I have to compress and EQ my x0xb0xes to bring them into line, whereas the 303 walks the line perfectly.
computer controlled
If your x0xb0x Square Waves sound nothing like your 303, then something is wrong. Mine sound exactly the same.
acidphakist
computer controlled wrote:
If your x0xb0x Square Waves sound nothing like your 303, then something is wrong. Mine sound exactly the same.


Consider that I have three x0xb0x square waves. None of them are as "sweet" as the 303.

I know you know your acid, so I won't call your hearing into question.
darenager
Much as I love the x0xb0x, I still way prefer the 303, it takes a lot of work IMHO to get an x0xb0x sounding as good as any 303, believe me I have done it, the square wave is not the whole story either, and you really do need them side by side to discern the differences that ARE there, but a/b ing and it is obvious, silk and nylon.

Having said this doing the 945 transistor mod (thanks for highlighting it mr phono!) goes A LONG way to help an x0x get the squarewave right.

But I think it seems to be a bit of pot luck with x0xb0x kits, after all there are quite a lot of components with varying tolerances, I have built a few now and noted that some were way off, whilst others were a lot closer (all from adafruit, and initially built as standard). My current one has a lot of correct parts and it sounds just like my 303's, subtly different as all my 303's are, but still like a 303.

I think if it were the case that an x0xb0x was as standard just as good as a 303 then prices would have dropped a bit on 303's, truth is they (x0x) are mostly around 80-90% there.

It is also worth noting that once you are overdriving or distorting a 303 or x0xbox the subtle differences are pretty much non-existant, again IMHO.

I like both sequencers, but prefer the 303's, the x0x wins on realtime stuff and editing, but the 303 has triplets, tap mode, and I like the separation of pitch/timing better mostly.

I also prefer the look, compactness and battery power of the 303, x0x has come a long way since the pactec cases, but still a bit bulky and ugly in comparision. But then the spacing of the knobs, and size of them make the x0x a joy to tweak.

I really hope x0xb0x continues to develop, new PCB layout, battery option, refined OS etc. Not really a fan of devilfish or BC box mods, I think they take away part of the beauty of the simple synth, much better just to go modular externally I think.

This is all subjective and my own opinion, but if I did not believe it then I'd sell my 303's in a heartbeat - its about acid not nostalgia/collectability.
FWIW I wouldn't sell my current x0xb0x either.
acidphakist
darenager wrote:
its about acid not nostalgia/collectability.


Amen. If I wanted to be a hipster I'd buy a Buchla or a Serge.

But I'm just here to make acid.
PrimateSynthesis
computer controlled wrote:
The x0xi0 is just a mod for the x0xb0x. It's some CV/Gate ins and outs, and a nice overdrive circuit. I had one on my first x0xb0x, nice mod! That is part of a larger mod. But it isn't a full x0xb0x kit. Just a series of mods.


Is there a description of these mods anywhere?

I googled but didn't find anything.
PrimateSynthesis
Limey wrote:
confirming the cumbersome and quirky editing of the TB303 due to the fact that the buttons are lowqual and produces some serious contactbounces. making it difficult to program just one C#-note or one decayed step.
The xoxbox on the other hand, like said. a dream to program.


While that's often true, I replaced all the switches on one of mine, and added some plastic film to seal out dust.

The ALPS buttons are actually high quality, or at least they don't bounce unless they are dirty.

The other one I bought NOS (with the box and everything) and so far, even after all these years, all the buttons still work fine.
acidphakist
Some info here
PrimateSynthesis
acidphakist wrote:
Some info here


Thanks, that is some info, but not the kind of information I had hoped would be available about modifications to an open source project.
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