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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Sequencing decisions determine the growth of your modular
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Modular Synth General Discussion  
Author Sequencing decisions determine the growth of your modular
stephenmendes
We all eventually grow our modular synths.

This post is for the newbies to this forum

I hope this video gives you some ideas or maybe assists in some way to help you decide on your next modules.

It really does depend on the type of music (or noises hihi ) you want to make.

Musicians will probably prefer MIDI sequencers...... those doing trance, new age genres .... or those who like random self-playing patches..... will probably be better served with 8, 16 or 24 step 'analog' sequencing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUmRucURrgY
ersatzplanet
If your musical taste stray away from the classic Tangerine Dream style ostinato repeating phrase, the path of MIDI makes everything MUCH more easier. You can of course use step sequencers and row/column sequencers to do music with pauses and rhythm that is not constant and all 1/4, 1/8, or 1/16th notes, but it takes much more time programming rows to control step time and such. With MIDI it can be as simple as just playing it on the keyboard.

Analog sequencers have the advantage of live editing, which can be mimicked on MIDI sequencers depending on the software used. For me the best world is the combination of both analog and MIDI sequencers. I use MIDI for the main phrase and use analog sequencers to transpose and modify them in real time. There are some complex pieces that can be made when the event count on the MIDI and the analog sequencer differ and they take multiple loops before they repeat. The fun is the combination of the both.
Pelsea
The biggest mistake you can make when assembling a synthesizer is to restrict your musical possibilities. I think it is vital to include both styles of control on anything larger than a monosynth. Traditionally minded musicians will find new inspiration in sequencers and arpeggiators (see John Adams, Phillip Glass) and off the chain experimenters can discover the joy of direct instrumental expression.

I am including both capabilities in my 10U euro system despite the fact that it is principally laptop driven or controlled with voltage output contraptions.
DeepSeaDriver
I'm more of a song-writing style player, rather than generative but I still like to delve into that stuff in modular.

I started with a beatstep pro, and it was great, but two voices was limiting.
If I had just graduated to something like the Pyramid and a Midi>CV interface I probably would have just stopped there as far as song-style sequencing goes, but nooo, I decided I wanted my sequencer in the rack.
I got a Z8000 and a Trigger Riot. Not sure why, totally against what I was looking for. Both amazing, but not what I was looking for.
I got a varigate 8. Fun, but fiddly, hard to keep track of presets and chaining.
Then I got an eloquencer. Now we're getting close. Really great percussion sequencer, the probability features are awesome, if a little no-frills (elektron is the standard here.) Still hard to keep track of presets and chains, 16 steps isn't enough to not be samey, lots of shift+button and menu diving if you wanna get deeper with it.
I added a rene 2 for some reason, and while that set up is fun, I still end up in 16 steps of boredom.
Finally I got a nerdseq, and that should finally do it.
Extremely powerful, many less limitations. Not enough trigger outputs to do voices and drums in one rack, but the sampler bit helps for now, and the trigger expander should take care of it.
Takes some getting used to, but it's really the gold standard if you want to write music that goes from point A to point B.
Dave Peck
Keep in mind there are plenty of synthesists who never, or very rarely, use any kind of sequencer at all.
Parnelli
Sequencing can be a money pit for sure! My own adventure started with a Korg SQ1, but I wanted more, so I purchased a Trigger riot, loved it. Messed with it for quite a while still not fully understanding what I wanted, saw a video for a SE Charcot Circles and picked it up, still don't use it, it just doesn't work reliably in the dry environment I live in without wetting your fingers for every change you want to make.

Next I picked up a Circadian Rhythms and I really like that a lot, especially running the drum modules. Then I picked up a Z-8000 and really liked that a lot, and in the mean time I purchased a number of logic modules like Plog, 4ms clock multiplier, and some gates and such, and have been having a blast with those so much that I haven't hardly touched the Trigger riot or Cicadian Rhythms in damn near a year.

My next adventure direction is going to be tying it all together, which will include making the CR the master it was meant to be and have the 8 channels run different aspects of logic for a sort of hybrid timing system. There are so many ways to go, and I took off without fully understanding what I wanted to accomplish musically, so I created a monster. Now I just have to learn how to sew it all together...
dooj88
Dave Peck wrote:
Keep in mind there are plenty of synthesists who never, or very rarely, use any kind of sequencer at all.


i guess i'm technically a synthesist since i'm here, but i'd not dare stand under the umbrella of the greats you're probably referring to.

but yes, my last sequencer just got ejected for being a...




...rectangle? no, what i mean is i finally understood why i hardly use them.. melody and sequence are the last thing i put into a patch.. they are only there to carry it forward. i spend 90% of the time making sure the sounds compliment/oppose each other perfectly. so it just sat there taking up space making me feel guilty for not using it more.

sure, i could have used it for other modulation duties, but i have sources that are so much more interesting (chaos module + S+H + JAG). you want a straightforward sequence? fine, give me an 2 envelopes, an attenuator a mixer and a quantizer. for me, it's all about tone/timbre/texture.

i'm sure i'll come back around eventually because i can't ignore essential building blocks forever, but for now it's in storage.
cptnal
dooj88 wrote:
Dave Peck wrote:
Keep in mind there are plenty of synthesists who never, or very rarely, use any kind of sequencer at all.


i guess i'm technically a synthesist since i'm here, but i'd not dare stand under the umbrella of the greats you're probably referring to.

but yes, my last sequencer just got ejected for being a...




...rectangle? no, what i mean is i finally understood why i hardly use them.. melody and sequence are the last thing i put into a patch.. they are only there to carry it forward. i spend 90% of the time making sure the sounds compliment/oppose each other perfectly. so it just sat there taking up space making me feel guilty for not using it more.

sure, i could have used it for other modulation duties, but i have sources that are so much more interesting (chaos module + S+H + JAG). you want a straightforward sequence? fine, give me an 2 envelopes, an attenuator a mixer and a quantizer. for me, it's all about tone/timbre/texture.

i'm sure i'll come back around eventually because i can't ignore essential building blocks forever, but for now it's in storage.


I hear ya. I spent a long time thinking the same way, but nowadays I'm more of a mind that they're a pretty basic building block. The kind of utility it's good to have at hand. I've found some good patches that use them in ways other than the obvious.

Here's something I made which is a variation on the Entropical Paradise patch:

https://freesound.org/people/cptnal/sounds/455930/
dooj88
cptnal hey, that's really pretty! i haven't heard of that patch before, i'll have to give it a try. which means i'm going to power up my old skiff for a 5th row Dead Banana though i did have a good time using the stillson hammer's cv inputs to self modulate various steps.

i also remember seeing some great ideas in Mr Elsea's book. i think i may need sequencer study day.
starthief
I came to modular from 13 years of in-the-box music making and piano roll MIDI.

For my first year (approximately) in modular it was all about sound sources and modulation. I either used MIDI in the DAW, or occasional generative stuff.

In the second (approximate) year I explored sequencing options in modular, hybrid options where I worked with MIDI-sequenced gates, and did a lot more with drones and manual control.

What I find is there's no single right answer for me. I use DAW piano rolls about 40% of the time. Or I build algorithmic rhythms in Teletype and let them drive Marbles and don't worry about melody per se. Or I dial in unquantized riffs with knobs or sliders. Or I don't sequence anything but maybe clock some parts. Whatever seems to be called for at the time.
Blairio
My background is using my 'DAW' as virtual tape recorder / midi sequencer. When I started in modular I quickly realised that to get the kind of sequencing and logic firepower I wanted with eurorack sequencer modules would cost a small fortune.

So I invested in some random cv and trigger source modules, an XOAC Moskwa sequencer module, and a standalone Korg SQ1 module, and did the rest in the DAW. Sometimes Reaper drove everything, other times Numerology - a great sequencer programme.

The downside to relying on the DAW to do the sequencing 'heavy lifting' is that you will need a few channels of midi >> cv/gate conversion. MI Yarns will give you 4 simultaneous converters, but equally a lot of standalone mono synths and modules can do this too. For instance the DE series from Doepfer, and the Arturia mini & microbrutes. Basically any synth that takes in midi and has cv/gate outputs will do the conversion.
cptnal
dooj88 wrote:
cptnal hey, that's really pretty!


Guinness ftw!

(Hint: p. 111)
soon_come
I’ve been using a Digitakt and CV.OCD lately when I don’t wanna deal with the computer, and it’s been fantastic. Wish I had discovered the combo sooner... but I love running midi clock out to the modular and doing some magic there in parallel or on the signal from the Digitakt.

TBH it’s been so much fun sequencing midi this way, the sampler on the Digitakt has taken a back seat for me. hmmm.....
TheMentat
DeepSeaDriver wrote:
I'm more of a song-writing style player, rather than generative but I still like to delve into that stuff in modular.

I started with a beatstep pro, and it was great, but two voices was limiting.
If I had just graduated to something like the Pyramid and a Midi>CV interface I probably would have just stopped there as far as song-style sequencing ...


Funny... I’ve done the exact same thing! I’m very content with the Pyramid for now though.
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