Time for more VCA's, looking at Moon and Corsynth.

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Synth Con Meo
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Time for more VCA's, looking at Moon and Corsynth.

Post by Synth Con Meo » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:07 am

Ok since my thread about what modules to get for my empty 22-MU cabinet and sticking with MU sized I've added some modules. One being a STG Wave folder, Corsynth C105 VC Noise/Lo-Fi MkII and C102 VC LFO. I've also ordered a Krisp1 OCTO (because of JIL as usual) and a Krisp1 MOSPhaser so now I have some more sound modifying modules. And a also have couple more Dotcom modules on the way.

I currently only have (2) Q108 VCA's but obviously like most modules you can't have enough VCA's. So I've been kind of looking at the Moon 502D Dual VCA which seems nice (again thanks JIL) but I've also been looking at the Corsynth C107 Quad VCA/Mixer which on the surface looks like the most useful being a Quad VCA plus a mixer. And of course also the Corsynth C108 Duel VCA which seems nice too. One difference I see between the C107 and C108 other than the C107 having (4) VCA's is the Linear/Exponential switch which the C107 is just Linear. Which from what I've read up on that Thalassa explained Linear is used with both VC and Audio and Exponential is used more to compensate the Audio response if you just have Linear EG's.

So I am looking for some feedback from more experienced users about these VCA's, and maybe others I haven't mentioned.

Thanks

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BTG
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Post by BTG » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:12 am

I have or had all the above and the Corsynth dual is my favorite since it has different curves. That said, if you adjustable envelopes like in the Corsynth vc ad then it doesn’t matter as much. However most of my envelopes are fixed shape so the dual vca is handy.

JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:53 am

Thanks for the kind words, sorry for the G.A.S.! :oops:

I do like the Moon 502D a lot and I have two that are currently in service as my main VCAs in my main modular system in a section that is setup to do 4 voice poly patches when I'm in the mood or need:
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It's nice that it includes tons of handy features that make it very versatile. The only odd thing is that while the linear mode works as you might expect, the exponential mode requires that the Fixed CV knob be turned up quite a bit to get things working well. :hmm: :despair: This can be tricky since too much will cause some bleed and not enough will only give you a weak/soft output. :roll: I usually use the exponential setting though because when set well it can sound delightfully punchy/snappy! :love:

Now, all that said, Synth Con Meo you are giving ME GAS! :omg: I hadn't thought of this before but . . . .since I have the Krisp1 OCTO and now the Marienberg Sine Phase VCO . . I'm thinking that it might be pretty awesome to have the SSL 1510 Octal Linear VCA!
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Also Doug is working on an envelope expander for it:
viewtopic.php?t=211356

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Thalassa
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Re: Time for more VCA's, looking at Moon and Corsynth.

Post by Thalassa » Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:25 am

Synth Con Meo wrote:I've also been looking at the Corsynth C107 Quad VCA/Mixer which on the surface looks like the most useful being a Quad VCA plus a mixer.
Between the two, I tend to use much more the C107. The four mixers included in the module make it much more versatile than have just 4 independent VCAs. Two replicate the functionality of the C107 you would need 4 VCAs , 4 mixers and a multiples.

For example you are using two VCOs and you want to parallel filter them but one of your filters only has one input. You can connect the VCOs to the VCA 1 and 2 , and the output 1+2 patch it to the filter. The output of the VCA 1 and VCA 2 you can patch it to filter that has a built in mixer. The filter outputs patch them to the VCA 3 and VCA 4. At the output 3+4 you will have your VCOs parallel filtered and mixed or if you prefer you have each filter at the output of the VCA 3 or VCA 4 :)

The exponential mode in the C108 I use it when I'm looking for a more percussive response or I just switch to exp and I like what I hear :)

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Thalassa
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Post by Thalassa » Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:44 am

JohnLRice wrote: The only odd thing is that while the linear mode works as you might expect, the exponential mode requires that the Fixed CV knob be turned up quite a bit to get things working well. :hmm: :despair: This can be tricky since too much will cause some bleed and not enough will only give you a weak/soft output.
Check if the module has a trimmer to set the minimum exponential gain. I have one in my C108 and the behavior that you are describing is what would happen if the exponential gain was set too low. If the VCAs are set to unity gain with Fixed CV to the maximum you shouldn't hear any volume drop when you switch from linear to exponential.

JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:41 am

Thalassa wrote:
JohnLRice wrote: The only odd thing is that while the linear mode works as you might expect, the exponential mode requires that the Fixed CV knob be turned up quite a bit to get things working well. :hmm: :despair: This can be tricky since too much will cause some bleed and not enough will only give you a weak/soft output.
Check if the module has a trimmer to set the minimum exponential gain. I have one in my C108 and the behavior that you are describing is what would happen if the exponential gain was set too low. If the VCAs are set to unity gain with Fixed CV to the maximum you shouldn't hear any volume drop when you switch from linear to exponential.
Thanks, I'll give that a look. 8-)

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gregae
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Post by gregae » Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:52 am

I have the C107 - it's a great module and gets used frequently in my patches. Now this thread has me wondering if the C107 could be modified to add a switchable exponential response, like the the Dotcom Q108 VCA. Looks like there's just enough space below each CV IN jack to add a switch for this. A possible mod Thalassa, or a version 2 update? :hmm:

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Thalassa
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Post by Thalassa » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:34 am

gregae wrote: A possible mod Thalassa, or a version 2 update? :hmm:
While it could be possible to add the switch to the front panel I don't think that I will ever make that mod. It will implicate to redesign the whole module and add the additional exponential circuitry to each VCA. The result would be a more cramped and expensive module ( four new switches, trimmers, bigger PCB, more components ). Also mixing with a linear pot in exp mode is not so nice...

But thanks for your feedback , I'm always open to suggestions :)

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burdij
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Post by burdij » Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:03 am

I do have a couple too:

Dual VCA

Image

Quad VCA

Image

Both with initial gain control and attenuverter CV level controls. Uses the 2164 Blackmer type VCAs for low distortion. The quad amp also incorporates a panning function for each pair of inputs and has a mono/stereo mixer built in.

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Synth Con Meo
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Post by Synth Con Meo » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:06 pm

burdij wrote:I do have a couple too:

Dual VCA

Image

Quad VCA

Image

Both with initial gain control and attenuverter CV level controls. Uses the 2164 Blackmer type VCAs for low distortion. The quad amp also incorporates a panning function for each pair of inputs and has a mono/stereo mixer built in.

Grove GMS-712MU Dual VCA

Grove GMS-714 Qual VCA
Thank you burdij for replying. This gives me more options to consider. Sometimes though too many options is worse than not enough. I always seem to second guess my self all the time with any decision I make. It looks like I can't really go wrong with any one of the VCA's mentioned so far. I just need to kind of make up my mind of which one(s) to get and try out. Chances are as my system grows I'll end up with most of them anyway.

And yes as John mentioned I'm going through a GAS attack right now. It's actually about time as far as my 5U system is concerned. It has been stagnant and ignored actually for the last couple of years. And of course watching any of his Videos get's the brain going.

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kcd06
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Post by kcd06 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:58 pm

The Corsynth C107 Quad VCA/Mixer is a great module and I almost can't not use mine. Another module with potential is the SSL Segwencer which allows some interesting twists on mixing sources.

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trentpmcd
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Post by trentpmcd » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:24 pm

I have the C107 and love it. I use it on every patch, often for multiple things ,for instance mixing CVs with 1 and 2 and using 3 and 4 as stand alone VCAs. If I need exp for something, I'll use my Q108 for that one, but linear is fine most of the time. One of my favorite modules.

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Post by Faustgeist » Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:00 am

I'll chime up for the quad VCA from Analog Craftsman. Oddly their web site does not have the module listed but Noisebug has them for sale.

Efficient design on 1U panels may be too 'fiddly' for some, but I have no issues. Also the ability to blend between linear and Expo sold me right away.

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Seeking the esoteric and funky in 5U/COTK/MOTM and MODCAN B, send me a message if you are selling gear and thanks!

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