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Does my Wah Have true bypass?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Guitars, Basses, Amps & FX  
Author Does my Wah Have true bypass?
sonic
Does my Crybaby classic have true bypass? Dunlop says it does.

What do you guys think?
felix
It's practically impossible to tell from the picture, but it does look like there is a 3PDT footswitch in there, which is really all that is required for true bypass.

I doubt Dunlop would lie about it. Those in the know with pedals would find out pretty quickly if it was not.
Kent
Truth be told, the whole "True Bypass" thing can often be a big deal about nothing. If you have to open the damn thing in order to ascertain with your eyes what you can't hear with your ears; then the point is relatively moot.

Having some buffering can be a good thing when dealing with a mess of cables.
sonic
Yeah your right i guess. Ive had this wah for years and always wonderd if it was or not. Mostly because of how loud it was. And thought the switch was supposed to blue.
flts
Isn't that red thing in the middle a Fasel inductor? I think the footswitch is only partially visible in the top of the picture.
Kent
It's an inductor of some type. And yeah, the switch is the 6 of 9 visible solder points at the tippy top of the photo.
felix
sonic wrote:
Yeah your right i guess. Ive had this wah for years and always wonderd if it was or not. Mostly because of how loud it was. And thought the switch was supposed to blue.

Do you mean that you expected the 3PDT footswitch to be blue colored? There's two common 3PDT switches used by pedal manufactures. The ones colored blue are made by electro-harmonix and the black ones are made by fulltone. The fulltone ones are a little more expensive and are supposed to last longer and have a lower failure rate. The colors have no indication on true bypass.

All true bypass means is when the pedal is bypassed that the input connection is wired *directly* to the output connection, which is what the 3PDT footswitch does. "Buffered" means that even when bypassed the input signal is going through a "buffer" before it hits the output.

Like Kent mentioned...there's good reasons for and against buffering. Some people swear by the sound of certain buffers, others want only true bypass. It's more or less a pointless debate about which is "better". If you like how it sounds, then you like how it sounds.

The one hard fact that can be made for buffering is also one that Kent mentioned. When you have a long chain of pedals (and therefore a long length of cable/signal path) the strength of the signal from the guitar/bass/etc can decrease dramatically (exponentially in fact) as the cable length increases. It can make the guitar (or other passive source) start to sound "weak". Buffering reduces that and can eliminate it all together.

Beavis Audio has a good basic article on buffers if you are keen to learn more. It's a lot less complicated that it's made out to be. A buffer is just a simple "voltage follower" if you know what that is.

http://www.beavisaudio.com/techpages/Buffers/
A Dingleberry Monstrosity
you can tell if you have an ohm meter.
sonic
flts wrote:
Isn't that red thing in the middle a Fasel inductor? I think the footswitch is only partially visible in the top of the picture.



its a fasel
heres a better shot of the footswitch and inductor

felix wrote:
The ones colored blue are made by electro-harmonix and the black ones are made by fulltone.


Its not like a fulltone kind either.

[qoute="Kent"]Having some buffering can be a good thing when dealing with a mess of cables.[/qoute]

thats a realy good point. I do use alot of cable.


The beavis audio article has me rethinking my opinion about buffers.
Kent
Wow! That's the first time that I've seen SMD (Surface Mount Devices) on a wah pedal.

Wah pedals are special devices. They work as resonant filters that are built around an inductor (the Faselâ„¢ Branded one in this case) and a variable resistor (Potentiometer). If there isn't a buffer, some wah designs can get all fuckered up when placed before vs. after some effects pedals. This is especially noticeable with the classic Jimi Hendrix setup of Vox wah and Fuzz Face. The wah's sweep and overall sound can be altered due to a change in the load that the pedal is 'seeing' on its output. The Fuzz Face has a low input impedance which then screws up the whole circuit of many wah pedals. Check out this diagram. You can see that the potentiometer (R10 y'all) is directly connected to the output of the pedal. This means that the wah pot is directly connected to the input impedance of whatever is there on the other end. Low impedance Fuzz Face input? Then it all goes goofy and the wah can literally self-oscillate. Jimi Hendrix used this to good effect and the Beassie-Beassie Boys sampled a good example of it in "Pass The Mic" off of Check Your Head. Right after they pass the mic to the muthafuckin' MCA, yo.




Oh, yeah... and that could well be a 'true-and-far-superior-to-every-known-thing-on-earth-except-handjobs-f rom-girls-in-fuzzy-sweaters bypass switch'. It all depends upon how it is wired.
sonic
felix wrote:
there is a 3PDT footswitch in there



Its a DPDT switch and from what ive red its also true bypass.

I had always thought that only the blue 3PDT ones were capable of true bypass d'oh!
flts
http://www.stinkfoot.se/andreas/diy/articles/bypass.htm

Quoted from there:

""You need a 3PDT switch if you want true bypass and a status LED."

Wrong again. Did you think it was true? If so, you're in good company. Even Mike Fuller seems to believe this one. Here's a quote from the Fulltone site:

"If your pedal has an LED and doesn't have a 9 pole switch, it ain't True-Bypass."

And you'd think he'd know better... He probably does, but he's a businessman, and the "9 pole switch" he's referring to is of course his own triple-pole, double-throw (3PDT) switch. Kinda funny that he slags other manufacturers for using catch phrases like "virtual bypass" etc, and at the same time makes a claim of his own that is untrue... Granted, for me the easiest way to add an LED to the switching system would be to add a third row on the switch and run it from there. But the truth is that you don't even need to redesign the whole circuit to accomodate an LED to indicate on/off status. Even an "aftermarket" true bypass mod with LED can be done with a DPDT. It's called the "Millennium bypass" and was invented by R.G. Keen. Read all about it here (scroll down a bit in the article and you'll find it), and here you'll find even more stuff, this time about the "Millennium 2". Personally, I wouldn't bother with it, though. The amount of components and effort needed to make it work is not worth it, IMHO. Especially when you consider that a 3PDT switch is only $3 more than the Carling 316PP at Small Bear... I'd definitely recommend you to go for a 3PDT switch if you absoutely need to add an LED. But that still doesn't make Mike's statement true!"

So basically, if there's no LED to be switched to indicate whether bypass is on or not, you can do with DPDT, and even if there's a LED, you can use other means if you really want to. And in any case, any 3PDT switch will do.
felix
Ah I see. In the first picture I thought I was seeing the top half of the switch cutoff from the frame, but that's not the case. I just assumed it was a 3PDT.

And yes, you don't need a 3PDT to make something true bypass, it can be done with a DPDT as well. It's just simpler/easier to do it with a 3PDT and have an LED indicator which is why you see most handmade pedals done this way.
synthetic
I just bought a used Crybaby and it's stuck in nothing-but-bypass. :( The switch is bad in addition to some other problem. Does anyone know where to buy a replacement?
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