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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

I mean come on really, it's 2019!
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Production Techniques  
Author I mean come on really, it's 2019!
calaveras
How long have we been laboring without any real solution for an editor librarian? There seems to be an ever increasing number of midi synths, and all of the MIDI synths, effects and drum machines created over the last 35 years.
And everyone is just using sysex dumps and device specific editor/librarians?


Come on there has to be some coder nerds who spend all their 6 figure income on synth nerding.
sizone
coffeshopped's ios editor is -slowly- getting a reasonable number of synth families supported. the ala carte pricing for the editors and that it's only on ios I think kinda prevents it from being -the- universal editor though.

midiquest is still around, still updated, still unbearably ugly and basically unusable, but still around.

I guess the consolation is that pretty much all new kit has a dedicated editor and that some of them are pretty fuckin' good.

still, one of us needs to break into apple and liberate the sounddiver codebase.
BenA718
Have you tried Patch Base? I am using it for my JV synths and my MOPHO and it works great. I use Dexed for my DX7s.
Rex Coil 7
calaveras wrote:
How long have we been laboring without any real solution for an editor librarian? There seems to be an ever increasing number of midi synths, and all of the MIDI synths, effects and drum machines created over the last 35 years.
And everyone is just using sysex dumps and device specific editor/librarians?


Come on there has to be some coder nerds who spend all their 6 figure income on synth nerding.
... supply and demand ... seriously, i just don't get it
calaveras
Rex Coil 7 wrote:
... supply and demand ... seriously, i just don't get it

That is what puzzles me. With all the niche things that get traction on kickstarter. And the wide variety of projects on github. How has this not happened?
It seems it would not be too hard to put together a modern Unisysn or Sounddiver. the front end is a cinch. I could cobble together something with my rudimentary knowledge of Xcode.
The hard part of course would be implementing all the different models out there. Maybe you could crowd source?
I really have no idea how hard it is to implement the backend coding of midi CC, NRPN and SYSEX. But it can't be too hard to do?
morgulbee
calaveras wrote:
Rex Coil 7 wrote:
... supply and demand ... seriously, i just don't get it

That is what puzzles me. With all the niche things that get traction on kickstarter. And the wide variety of projects on github. How has this not happened?
It seems it would not be too hard to put together a modern Unisysn or Sounddiver. the front end is a cinch. I could cobble together something with my rudimentary knowledge of Xcode.
The hard part of course would be implementing all the different models out there. Maybe you could crowd source?
I really have no idea how hard it is to implement the backend coding of midi CC, NRPN and SYSEX. But it can't be too hard to do?

Part of the supply/demand equation is the supply of programmers who own a particular synth who are willing to spend their time coding within such a framework, and know the intricacies of the synth well enough to build a usable editor.

I was part of a coding effort way back in the early 90's in MS-DOS/Amiga/Atari ST days. Several of us developed a cross-platform editor/librarian called GLIB (you can still find it and it still sorta-works but it's ugly as hell in these modern times). It only supported a handful of synths: less than a dozen, basically just the ones that the three or four of us owned. And only one of the coders did the editor part for his synths. I just coded the librarians for mine because that's mainly what I needed. I was fine using the front panels for programming my old beasts given the complexity of coding an editor properly. Maybe today with modern GUIs and a better-designed framework it would be easier, or maybe harder. Some particular synths are probably very straightforward, some nightmarishly complex.

It's certainly doable, but are there enough synth-owning developers out there with the skills, time, and motivation to make it successful?
PrimateSynthesis
Having used Unisyn for years under System 7, and trying SoundDiver briefly under OS X on a G4, I have to say they were both pretty buggy. Then again, most MIDI/DAW software (eg. Cubase, Logic) at the time was buggy as well.

It's hardly my realm of expertise. Although I'm thinking making librarian software wouldn't be too much of an undertaking, but would still need access to all of the synths it supports in order to test it thoroughly. Editing software would not only take a massive amount of time to write a GUI for every synth, but the programmers would need access those synths just to get started. Many of those old MIDI synths are now very expensive.

The other thing to consider is what killed Unisyn and SoundDiver is that they weren't OS or hardware independent. According to their webpage, MOTU still sells Unisyn, but it won't run on an Intel Mac.
commodorejohn
I think you could probably do pretty well with Python (well-supported on every major OS and many minor ones, plus there are libraries for MIDI and several different GUI toolkits - Tk in particular is very simple to work with in Python.) Creating a UI for each individual synth doesn't necessarily have to be very difficult either; it's just a matter of creating an intuitive arrangement of standard controls. Of course, it wouldn't likely be all that pretty, but as long as it's usable and free, who cares?
phats
Omnisphere seems to be pretty well integrated with hardware
jorg
The bugginess of MIDI management any more complex than notes and clocks is one of the factors that drove me to modular. The patch is truly a patch. I can see exactly how it works (if I am patient). When I am done making a unique sound with it, I destroy it. No patch library.
calaveras
I totally agree about how awful midi can be. I also have a whole modular set up. And some old cv gate analogs. But I keep acquiring more 80s-90s midi gear. Not just synths. My reverbs and even my mixer are all MIDI capable. It is a pain getting stuff in sync sometimes. And the latency is pretty bad considering the data stream is acoustic coupled modem fast. But I am also trying to really exploit my current gear and not buy more stuff!
Maybe I’ll get off my ass and go back to learning how to code. Start a github repo and stuff.
CF3
I feel your pain on the current state of editor/librarians in 2019 waah

I'm still running a copy of SoundDiver on an old G5 in the studio. Works well enough, but obviously I'd love to ditch the G5. I've tried Sound Quest multiple times and just can't get along with it. I even have a working copy of Unisyn. A modern version of SoundDiver would be my fantasy.

There are many awesome, modern editors for individual synths out there. Including stuff like Ctrlr, TouchOSC, Midi Designer Pro, Lemur, tons of ipad editors, etc... Just no all-in-one solution (except Sound Quest d'oh! ).

Not really sure if there's much of a demand TBH, except for individual ones for specific synths (like SoundTower does). Besides the high cost (see: Sound Quest MY ASS IS BLEEDING ), the general level of MIDI knowledge nowadays seems quite low. The bar has really been lowered by manufacturers too. Modern MIDI spec is horrible for the most part (see: most new samplers, sequencers or synths created in the last 15 yrs... not gonna name names).

I still hold out hope an adventurous synth lover cracks SoundDiver open w00t
Panason
MIDI 2.0 coming soon in 2033 when nobody cares.
leeski
maybe just get a library of editors which work along with the synths you have in these modern operating systems?

What would you use for CZ1000 & Sequential Max, perhaps something could be done with max/msp??

sound diver was cool.
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