Jack Of All, Master Of None!?

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ReturnCodeZero
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Jack Of All, Master Of None!?

Post by ReturnCodeZero » Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:37 am

Sooo, My rack does things great individually (e.g a nice synth line OR some abstract drums), however I kinda feel like I need to make it all gel together a bit better, you know? Any ideas?

Image

To be clear I am aiming to make abstract techno along these lines, with a bit more of a dubby kinda vibe.



Rack is clocked via midi from either Ableton or Korg ES-1 to M32, then out via gate to multiple to the clock divider and other sources. I then have multiple outs going to a Mackie 1402 VLZ3 with a Lexicon mpx100 as an aux send. Also using the dub JR mk2 on an aux send.

Any input here much appreciated! Thanks in advance.

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Agawell
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Post by Agawell » Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:24 am

can you post a link to the a actual modular grid rack - some of those modules look like they might be ladik but I have no idea what they are from the picture

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mildheadwound
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Post by mildheadwound » Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:53 am

Right away I’m gonna say dedicated clock divider/multiplier. They really tighten the sound.

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Post by msegarra » Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:11 am

Just from what I’ve experienced I’d say a nice mixer like wmd performance mixer really helped me figure out how to put it all together

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Post by R.U.Nuts » Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:21 am

msegarra wrote:Just from what I’ve experienced I’d say a nice mixer like wmd performance mixer really helped me figure out how to put it all together
The mentioned Mackie 1402 is much nicer IMHO :hihi:

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Re: Jack Of All, Master Of None!?

Post by R.U.Nuts » Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:23 am

ReturnCodeZero wrote:Sooo, My rack does things great individually (e.g a nice synth line OR some abstract drums), however I kinda feel like I need to make it all gel together a bit better, you know? Any ideas?

Image

To be clear I am aiming to make abstract techno along these lines, with a bit more of a dubby kinda vibe.



Rack is clocked via midi from either Ableton or Korg ES-1 to M32, then out via gate to multiple to the clock divider and other sources. I then have multiple outs going to a Mackie 1402 VLZ3 with a Lexicon mpx100 as an aux send. Also using the dub JR mk2 on an aux send.

Any input here much appreciated! Thanks in advance.
You mentioned how you clock your system, but how do you sequence it?

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Post by onurkalaycioglu » Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:08 pm

I think you need more modulation sources and more vcas, and some smooth random or chaotic voltage generator would help. I think a the Xaoc zadar could definitely tie things together more(but depends on your work flow, more immediate serge style slope generators could work too) , as for a vca there’s a lot of choices, a NLC sloth or triple sloth could be a good solution for the chaotic smooth voltage vs getting a wogglebug for the smooth and woggle, when you already have the Turing machine.
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Post by Ceri JC » Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:13 pm

onurkalaycioglu wrote:I think you need more modulation sources and more vcas, and some smooth random or chaotic voltage generator would help. I think a the Xaoc zadar could definitely tie things together more(but depends on your work flow, more immediate serge style slope generators could work too) , as for a vca there’s a lot of choices, a NLC sloth or triple sloth could be a good solution for the chaotic smooth voltage vs getting a wogglebug for the smooth and woggle, when you already have the Turing machine.
This. Triple Sloth with the outputs through something that can scale and offset the signal; I like Feedback's smArTT Verter. For dubby stuff slow, almost imperceptible, changes over each iteration of the loop works well. Most modules' sweet spot isn't wide enough for signals from full - to full +. Sloth and something to tame the range is ideal.

I'd get some cheap shaker/hh modules (or maybe a Pico drum) to complement that rig and let you do synths and drums at once. BIA tends to be a bit harsh for dub, if you're switching skin type and/or pitch range whilst it's playing (great for that nice "all in one industrial drum kit" it does so well, though ;)).

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Post by cptnal » Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:22 pm

To me right now everything looks like a matrix mixer, but especially in terms of "gelling". You can sculpt and route audio and CV (or mix both together), and nothing gels a patch more than feeding it back on itself.

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Post by bedhed3000 » Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:48 pm

It seems like people like to use a lot of modulation with the BIA, so yeah you definitely need more to use that module to its full potential, not to mention Loquelic. Maybe a Voltage Block or Mutable Stages is what you need, plus about 6-8 channels of attenuverters and a few VCAs.

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Post by nicholasyu » Sat Aug 10, 2019 1:59 pm

bedhed3000 wrote:It seems like people like to use a lot of modulation with the BIA, so yeah you definitely need more to use that module to its full potential, not to mention Loquelic. Maybe a Voltage Block or Mutable Stages is what you need, plus about 6-8 channels of attenuverters and a few VCAs.
This! I think external attenuators are really the key to those modules. Many of their controls seem to have multiple "inflection points" if that makes sense, where sweeping through the full range kind of morphs through 3 or 4 distinct sounds. But they don't have attenuators. So I put a Befaco A*B+C next to them and it really helps!

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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:45 pm

Agawell wrote:can you post a link to the a actual modular grid rack - some of those modules look like they might be ladik but I have no idea what they are from the picture
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/403711

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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:46 pm

mildheadwound wrote:Right away I’m gonna say dedicated clock divider/multiplier. They really tighten the sound.
Something like Pam's New Workout? Cheers

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Re: Jack Of All, Master Of None!?

Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:47 pm

R.U.Nuts wrote:
ReturnCodeZero wrote:Sooo, My rack does things great individually (e.g a nice synth line OR some abstract drums), however I kinda feel like I need to make it all gel together a bit better, you know? Any ideas?

Image

To be clear I am aiming to make abstract techno along these lines, with a bit more of a dubby kinda vibe.



Rack is clocked via midi from either Ableton or Korg ES-1 to M32, then out via gate to multiple to the clock divider and other sources. I then have multiple outs going to a Mackie 1402 VLZ3 with a Lexicon mpx100 as an aux send. Also using the dub JR mk2 on an aux send.

Any input here much appreciated! Thanks in advance.
You mentioned how you clock your system, but how do you sequence it?
Sequenced with the M32, Turing and ARP.

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ReturnCodeZero
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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:56 pm

onurkalaycioglu wrote:I think you need more modulation sources and more vcas, and some smooth random or chaotic voltage generator would help. I think a the Xaoc zadar could definitely tie things together more(but depends on your work flow, more immediate serge style slope generators could work too) , as for a vca there’s a lot of choices, a NLC sloth or triple sloth could be a good solution for the chaotic smooth voltage vs getting a wogglebug for the smooth and woggle, when you already have the Turing machine.
Ok, thanks. I'll check those out.

In terms of VCA's, not really sure how I could utilise them in this set up? Probably just the way I approach patchin though. Any specific examples of how I could use them? (Disting has a VCA so could try this out before committing). Thanks.

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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:57 pm

Ceri JC wrote:
onurkalaycioglu wrote:I think you need more modulation sources and more vcas, and some smooth random or chaotic voltage generator would help. I think a the Xaoc zadar could definitely tie things together more(but depends on your work flow, more immediate serge style slope generators could work too) , as for a vca there’s a lot of choices, a NLC sloth or triple sloth could be a good solution for the chaotic smooth voltage vs getting a wogglebug for the smooth and woggle, when you already have the Turing machine.
This. Triple Sloth with the outputs through something that can scale and offset the signal; I like Feedback's smArTT Verter. For dubby stuff slow, almost imperceptible, changes over each iteration of the loop works well. Most modules' sweet spot isn't wide enough for signals from full - to full +. Sloth and something to tame the range is ideal.

I'd get some cheap shaker/hh modules (or maybe a Pico drum) to complement that rig and let you do synths and drums at once. BIA tends to be a bit harsh for dub, if you're switching skin type and/or pitch range whilst it's playing (great for that nice "all in one industrial drum kit" it does so well, though ;)).
Had a very quick look at the triple Sloth, not quite sure exactly what it is/does!?

Thanks for your response.

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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:59 pm

bedhed3000 wrote:It seems like people like to use a lot of modulation with the BIA, so yeah you definitely need more to use that module to its full potential, not to mention Loquelic. Maybe a Voltage Block or Mutable Stages is what you need, plus about 6-8 channels of attenuverters and a few VCAs.
Voltage block has caught my eye, also Branches. Going to do some more research. Thanks

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Post by Manresa » Sat Aug 10, 2019 9:49 pm

ReturnCodeZero wrote:In terms of VCA's, not really sure how I could utilise them in this set up? Probably just the way I approach patchin though. Any specific examples of how I could use them? (Disting has a VCA so could try this out before committing). Thanks.
VCAs allow you to modulate the modulator. i.e. use an envelope to modify the strength of an LFO. Many also act as mixers and/or simple attenuators, and can provide some distortion if overdriven (and VCAs with gain can be used to overdrive other modules later in the signal chain).

So if you added more modulators, and more VCAs, you can change the parameters on your existing modules (like all those timbre parameters on the Noise Engineering oscillators) in complex and musically interesting ways.

ReturnCodeZero wrote:Had a very quick look at the triple Sloth, not quite sure exactly what it is/does!?
Source of chaotic (unpredictable but not random) control voltages at slow, very slow, and glacial speeds.

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Post by ReturnCodeZero » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:54 am

Manresa wrote:
ReturnCodeZero wrote:In terms of VCA's, not really sure how I could utilise them in this set up? Probably just the way I approach patchin though. Any specific examples of how I could use them? (Disting has a VCA so could try this out before committing). Thanks.
VCAs allow you to modulate the modulator. i.e. use an envelope to modify the strength of an LFO. Many also act as mixers and/or simple attenuators, and can provide some distortion if overdriven (and VCAs with gain can be used to overdrive other modules later in the signal chain).

So if you added more modulators, and more VCAs, you can change the parameters on your existing modules (like all those timbre parameters on the Noise Engineering oscillators) in complex and musically interesting ways.

ReturnCodeZero wrote:Had a very quick look at the triple Sloth, not quite sure exactly what it is/does!?
Source of chaotic (unpredictable but not random) control voltages at slow, very slow, and glacial speeds.
Ok, thanks. Will experiment with the dieting VCA.

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