Repaying for a already purchased software license?

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Leverkusen
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Repaying for a already purchased software license?

Post by Leverkusen » Fri Aug 30, 2019 10:32 am

I just got an email informing me that a software distributor changes their license service to iLok and I have to pay 5 USD to cover the costs of that change.

It feels a bit irritating since I already payed for the software some years ago and I wonder if this is common practice? I mean, it's not that I want to upgrade to a new version of it and I frankly could live without their new license provider. :hmm:

Is it just how software works today? Pay again or you cannot use it anymore? Is that legal?

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Post by CF3 » Fri Aug 30, 2019 10:45 am

Yeah, not sure who exactly we're talking about here, but I just had it happen to me also. :despair:

This is the first time I've actually seen this. Personally, I'm not going to pay it. Not a fan of the whole iLok thing either. It's unnecessarily complicated for some cheap software.

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Post by cretaceousear » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:05 am

In many countries that would be against Trading Stanadards - you bought the product in good faith. They cannot demand more money for continued usage of the same product.
Not until the next upgrade anyway..
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Post by Leverkusen » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:56 am

CF3 wrote:Yeah, not sure who exactly we're talking about here, but I just had it happen to me also. :despair:

This is the first time I've actually seen this. Personally, I'm not going to pay it. Not a fan of the whole iLok thing either. It's unnecessarily complicated for some cheap software.
I got used to iLok over the years, at least since it is not mandatory anymore to use a physical USB dongle. But this move doe snot feel right to me. Indeed I am not sure if I will pay it too.

The procedure is that you have to buy the new version of the plug-in, then use your existing serial number as a discount code and pay about 5% of the full price.

They say it is "necessary to cover our costs in dealing with this unplanned transition". That's downright ridiculous - or at least they seem to think think I am... :despair:

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Post by Funky40 » Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:56 pm

Leverkusen wrote: The procedure is that you have to buy the new version of the plug-in, then use your existing serial number as a discount code and pay about 5% of the full price.
This sentence seems then the more accurate one vs. other sentences in your post and seems to answer all your questions by itself.
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Post by rowsbywoof » Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:08 pm

So, I'm willing to bet this is in response to Expert Sleepers having to get off Digital River, due to DR going bye-bye. I upgraded all of my plugins for about $15, give or take. I originally bought them three to four years ago, so $15 for some updated versions, especially so I never have to use that damn Expert Sleepers licensing tool (which always gave me problems) was worth it for me. Plus I use the plugins enough that I don't really mind. iLok is definitely not that much of a pain, you don't need a physical iLok and can just use the software licensing tool.

If it's a huge hardship for you, which, I mean, it's only $5, but if it's really a hardship I'd just email Expert Sleepers and let them know and try and work something out.

Same thing will be happening with all software that used Digital River, for example Scrievner had this happen recently, too, and folks using the PC version of that are being asked to buy a new version to help offset development costs and the new license... So, it could be worse.

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Post by GGW » Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:54 pm

PSP Audioware just sent me a note that I can get the next upgrade for free that includes a requirement to install Pace. I keep all my software legal, but I'm not into the Pace thing, so I guess I'll use the current version and that will be the end of further PSP business. There are so many great plugins that I won't miss a few.

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Post by Kent » Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:59 am

rowsbywoof wrote:So, I'm willing to bet this is in response to Expert Sleepers having to get off Digital River, due to DR going bye-bye. I upgraded all of my plugins for about $15, give or take. I originally bought them three to four years ago, so $15 for some updated versions, especially so I never have to use that damn Expert Sleepers licensing tool (which always gave me problems) was worth it for me. Plus I use the plugins enough that I don't really mind. iLok is definitely not that much of a pain, you don't need a physical iLok and can just use the software licensing tool.

If it's a huge hardship for you, which, I mean, it's only $5, but if it's really a hardship I'd just email Expert Sleepers and let them know and try and work something out.

Same thing will be happening with all software that used Digital River, for example Scrievner had this happen recently, too, and folks using the PC version of that are being asked to buy a new version to help offset development costs and the new license... So, it could be worse.

How dare you?! Why react proportionally to a minor inconvenience and move on with your day? Righteous indignation over supporting a small manufacturer is far mote seductive!

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Post by Monotremata » Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:37 pm

Yeah this is an outrage!!! This means I ended up paying $65 instead of $60 for it after all..

I knew I should've just spent a few hundred instead and bought some Eurorack converter and gotten rid of some choice modules to make room for it!

I demand justice!!! Or a free ES-8 and well call it even! :guinness:

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Post by Leverkusen » Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:08 pm

I think both of you are exaggerating a bit. There is no outrage and I did not name expert sleepers for the reason to possibly discuss this without stupid reactions. :despair:

I still think it is irritating to charge a customer for something that is solely their companies issue. I won't make a lot of use of the iLok functionality the "new software" has. It's their decision to pick a license service provider.

One might think I already supported the manufacturer by buying a license instead of searching the internet for a "free" version.

It's not that they have asked me for a supportive donation but they sent me an email stating that action is required and I have to pay them money. Supporting them is not the core of our relationship, that's why they want me to pay for their support.

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Post by UltraViolet » Sat Aug 31, 2019 4:06 pm

I agree that you shouldn't have to pay more to continue to use the software. If you need to pay to upgrade to a new version that would be OK, but you shouldn't have to pay to keep using the old version. If something broke the old version, then it should be the company's responsibility to fix it (free upgrade), not yours (pay $5). I understand that small companies don't have lots of money to spend, but it is always good business to put your customers first.

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Post by rowsbywoof » Sat Aug 31, 2019 4:11 pm

UltraViolet wrote:I agree that you shouldn't have to pay more to continue to use the software. If you need to pay to upgrade to a new version that would be OK, but you shouldn't have to pay to keep using the old version. If something broke the old version, then it should be the company's responsibility to fix it (free upgrade), not yours (pay $5). I understand that small companies don't have lots of money to spend, but it is always good business to put your customers first.
I’m pretty certain they don’t get a ton of freebie licenses to give. That’s the problem. The licensors require payment to issue a license, hence the fee. There is no free lunch.

For some developers, this expense may be too much to bear. It’s pretty shit for them, too, I would imagine. I’m sure a lot of Devs would rather just issue you a new license and be done with it, but that could be a much larger expense than you might imagine.

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Post by CF3 » Sat Aug 31, 2019 9:47 pm

Snarky bullshit aside....

The $5 bucks (or whatever) doesn't bother me. Just be upfront about it.
Don't be all "you can migrate your old serial number to a new iLok-based license", but neglect to mention it will cost actual money.

I pay for upgrades all the time. No worries. If its gonna cost money, just say, "hey, this will cost money". I was actually a little confused to what exactly I was supposed to do honestly. :hmm:

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Post by thetwlo » Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:28 pm

Yup, that's on them, not you. Simple.

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Post by thetwlo » Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:34 pm

Guess, you didn't buy Speakerphone. FUCK THEM. forcing users to buy a buy ilok. v2+??

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Post by ngarjuna » Sun Sep 01, 2019 4:40 am

cretaceousear wrote:In many countries that would be against Trading Stanadards - you bought the product in good faith. They cannot demand more money for continued usage of the same product.
Not until the next upgrade anyway..
Yeah except...this never happened. ES is charging $4 to update to the latest version (the Pace update); there is no cost to continue using the licenses you already purchased. But let’s not allow the facts to stand in the way of a good mob.

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Post by cretaceousear » Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:58 am

ngarjuna wrote: let’s not allow the facts to stand in the way of a good mob.
OP does not state it's an optional upgrade or sidegrade.
No need to invoke any mob. :sadbanana:
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Post by UltraViolet » Sun Sep 01, 2019 1:14 pm

cretaceousear wrote:
ngarjuna wrote: let’s not allow the facts to stand in the way of a good mob.
OP does not state it's an optional upgrade or sidegrade.
No need to invoke any mob. :sadbanana:
Maybe the OP should clarify this. Don't want the mob to burn down the wrong castle! :lol:

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Post by Leverkusen » Sun Sep 01, 2019 2:49 pm

Yep, there is a note now on the license transition page that it's only mandatory for future support. I have not seen it there before.

The notification was: New licensing scheme - action required - limited time offer (...) Please visit our Licensing Transition page to find out what action you need to take. Note that the opportunity to migrate your licenses to the new scheme ends July 2020.

On the license transition page it was then revealed that the action to take is buying a discounted "new" version. So in the end it's more of an continuous update fee.

I understand that this is a hassle for them, maybe if the email had not be worded as if it was a mix of an offer and a necessity. I tend to react a bit peeved on euphemistic marketing.

Stil don't get the mob/burning down the castle thing though.

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Post by criticalmonkey » Mon Sep 02, 2019 9:40 pm

i don't mind the cost - keeps a small business going, and certainly cannot complain about the quality of their product

it isn't planned obsolescence or some crap that most the tech industry is thriving off of
and ilok has so many options for ways to use it now that it got over the fixed usb dongle, it's probably the only reasonable option for smaller companies

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Post by lionel » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:29 am

I've paid

I like this soft and the good customer's support
I can understand why they decide to ask their customers to support them too

Anyway, if you don't get it, you can still use your soft(s) in older version(s)
I want to be able to update them in the future (5$ is ok, and they don't make money with it...)

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Post by DJMaytag » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:46 am

Leverkusen wrote:The notification was: New licensing scheme - action required - limited time offer (...) Please visit our Licensing Transition page to find out what action you need to take. Note that the opportunity to migrate your licenses to the new scheme ends July 2020.

On the license transition page it was then revealed that the action to take is buying a discounted "new" version. So in the end it's more of an continuous update fee.
Limited time DISCOUNT. If you want upgrade after July 2020, you'll have to pay full price. If you don't want to pay the $4 and instead want to pay full price of $59, by all means wait until August 2020, but you can continue to keep using Silent Way 2.7 indefinitely. There's no requirement for any action on your part if you want to keep using 2.7.

#facts
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Post by DJMaytag » Mon Sep 09, 2019 10:56 am

How many of us have bought a DAW or a VST and had to pay an upgrade fee to 2.0, 3.0, etc? You're not paying for software you already bought, you're paying for an upgrade. The OP's title is misleading.
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