Cool sequencer coming from Dove Audio!!

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JohnLRice

Cool sequencer coming from Dove Audio!!

Post by JohnLRice » Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:20 pm

It's not done yet and there are no clear pictures or detailed specs but from what I can see and assume, it's going to be GREAT in only 3U! :party: :goo:

Image

Image

Short Instagram demo:


Longer Berlin School jam :sb:
[video][/video]

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bwhittington
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Post by bwhittington » Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:34 pm

That looks pretty cool. Assuming little ol' me can get my head around a module with 'modes,' I might be interested in one.

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Post by Putte » Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:23 pm

Displays showing pitch (built in quantizer?), volume and perhaps something more? Could it be that switch changes what the knob does, which in turn shows in the display?

JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:39 pm

Putte wrote:Displays showing pitch (built in quantizer?), volume and perhaps something more? Could it be that switch changes what the knob does, which in turn shows in the display?
That's what I'm assuming. Quantization and maybe gate length and ratcheting? :hyper: Listen to the long demo and at least basic gate doubling can be see and heard being turned on and off.

OOHHH, she just posted an update on Instagram:


Quantizer - YES (or at least you assign the actual note, not sure if non-quantized is available? :hmm: )
Step Length - YES (multiple selections like 1/4, 1/8, 1/16, 1/32)
Ratcheting - YES (off, double, triple)
Gate Level - Nope :hihi: This was a misunderstanding on the Instagram video

Plus a new feature to resize the display to only show the currently edited parameter so it's much easier to read. :tu:

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Post by PaulaM » Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:42 pm

JohnLRice wrote: Quantizer - YES (or at least you assign the actual note, not sure if non-quantized is available? :hmm: )
It will be an option.
JohnLRice wrote: Step Length - YES (multiple selections like 1/4, 1/8, 1/16, 1/32)
also triplets and dotteds, so pretty much everything from 1/1 to 1/32.
JohnLRice wrote: Ratcheting - YES (off, double, triple)
would be rude not to really.
JohnLRice wrote: Gate Level - Nope :hihi: This was a misunderstanding on the Instagram video
This is the Second CV output (CV-B) level, from 0 to 10V, again, this will be able to be quantized as an option, personally I like using the second channel for waveform selection on my WTF or Waveplane oscillators, or filter cutoff.

All these change when you press the "knob Function" switch, a box highlights the current selected parameter.



Other features currently implemented;
* note skip
* gate A on/off (Allows you to add a rest, though CVs change)
* Legato mode
* Gate B on/off
(the above are selected by pushing the "Switch Function" switch, again a box highlights which is currently active and the step switch LEDs also change to match.

* saving and loading to micro-SDCard
JohnLRice wrote: Plus a new feature to resize the display to only show the currently edited parameter so it's much easier to read. :tu:
a few people asked about that at Synth DIY, and I had a spare hour one evening so I added it.

The rotary encoder under the tempo was for a menu, along with the OLED display under that, but it doesn't work for me. So these will be probably be going and be replaced by a good old rotary switch.

Paula
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JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:05 pm

Thanks for all the details, Paula! :tu: I realize that it's far from finished at this point so I'll apologize in advance for additional questions that I've been wondering about. I'm fine with a response of "I'll let you know more when it's closer to being done" :hihi: :oops:

1) what are the A and B In/Out jacks for?

2) are there different directional patterns available like forward, reverse, and pingpong etc etc? (maybe that's what the three button holes, screen and encoder knob were intended for?)

3) I don't see external clock or reset input jacks?

4) Are the two empty holes at the bottom right that are labels IN/OUT for 5 pin DIN MIDI or something else?

5) and of course I'm curious about what the capabilities will be for the USB and SC connectivity! :hyper:

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Post by PaulaM » Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:14 pm

JohnLRice wrote:Thanks for all the details, Paula! :tu: I realize that it's far from finished at this point so I'll apologize in advance for additional questions that I've been wondering about. I'm fine with a response of "I'll let you know more when it's closer to being done" :hihi: :oops:
Thanks, I'll do my best, some I may not yet know :)
JohnLRice wrote: 1) what are the A and B In/Out jacks for?
Good question :)
Input wise, My thinking was they could be used for manual clock and start/stop lines, or perhaps as CV in for something like Tempo, their function is kind of fluid at the moment.
Outputwise, TBH, I have no idea yet, given there is already 2 CVs and two Gates, maybe two more CV outputs is excessive?
Again they could be CVs, or perhaps clock out, start/stop... At this stage I have no idea, I just had two spaces on my panel I wanted to fill.
JohnLRice wrote: 2) are there different directional patterns available like forward, reverse, and pingpong etc etc? (maybe that's what the three button holes, screen and encoder knob were intended for?)
there will be, but not yet implemented.
The three buttons under the 9th display were for menus, but I'm going to remove them, the display and the rotary encoder and replace it with a 6 way switch to keep things simpler.
JohnLRice wrote: 3) I don't see external clock or reset input jacks?
See InA/InB, plus there are a number of other sync options that I'm working on, including MIDI and Sync 24.
JohnLRice wrote: 4) Are the two empty holes at the bottom right that are labels IN/OUT for 5 pin DIN MIDI or something else?
See above.. 5 pin MIDI or Sync 24.
JohnLRice wrote: 5) and of course I'm curious about what the capabilities will be for the USB and SC connectivity! :hyper:
the SD slot is for a micro SDCard, sequences are saved and loaded from this which is a standard FAT32 format and the files are in text. Makes sharing/backing up easier (this is already working)

USB, hmmm, well, I'm hoping to add USB MIDI, not sure how do-able that is at the moment. I'm having a few issues with it conflicting with other processor resources.
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Post by JohnLRice » Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:54 pm

PaulaM wrote:
JohnLRice wrote:Thanks for all the details, Paula! :tu: I realize that it's far from finished at this point so I'll apologize in advance for additional questions that I've been wondering about. I'm fine with a response of "I'll let you know more when it's closer to being done" :hihi: :oops:
Thanks, I'll do my best, some I may not yet know :)
JohnLRice wrote: 1) what are the A and B In/Out jacks for?
Good question :)
Input wise, My thinking was they could be used for manual clock and start/stop lines, or perhaps as CV in for something like Tempo, their function is kind of fluid at the moment.
Outputwise, TBH, I have no idea yet, given there is already 2 CVs and two Gates, maybe two more CV outputs is excessive?
Again they could be CVs, or perhaps clock out, start/stop... At this stage I have no idea, I just had two spaces on my panel I wanted to fill.
Thanks again for all the details! :nana:

I do think that a Start/Stop input and Reset input jacks are very important for sequencers, especially with medium to large systems where multiple sequencers might want to play with each other in sync etc. A master clock out like you mentioned can also be important.

But, I was just thinking you might be able to implement one or more variations of a third set of CV+Gate outputs! :hyper: Here's some initial ideas:

Channel Combine: A+B CV or A-B CV output on one jack with Gates OR'd or AND'd output on another jack?

Shift Register with selectable shift: Lot's of ways to go with this but basically I'm thinking you could take either the A or B set of CV+Gate (or even one of the combined scenarios mentioned above) and apply a shift register delay on the two outputs? The addition of a 8 position rotary switch (no delay through 7 clocks delay) would allow easy selection of the shift delay on the fly. Or I suppose if a rotary switch isn't feasible, a single center-off toggle switch could select three different shift values?

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Post by kcd06 » Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:03 pm

I'm getting some serious "Intelligel Metropolis" vibes (built in ratchet for each step, assignable step duration, etc. but with superior control over the CV output from each step, removable sequence memory and usb connectivity) from these demos. Is that a reasonable comparison or am I off base as per normal?

For me, having something like a Metropolis in 5u would be very cool, would mean not needing to transit from the normal plugs to the annoying and fragile 3.5mm size. Also would mean that I spend yet more money and the "pulsating brain ruling from the center of the underverse" that is my modular grows a bit larger...
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Post by kindredlost » Sat Aug 31, 2019 7:48 pm

I too am VERY VERY interested in this sequencer. The ratchet control looks very nice. I have a Metropolis and use various means to affect hocketting with the usual MU step sequencers but having this ease of function is well worth the price of entry for me in a compact step sequencer. Please keep us informed as you develop this for the marketplace.

EDIT: I noticed in the video that the push button lights go off when a stage is enabled. This seems counter-intuitive. Am I wrong? (wouldn't be the first time)

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Post by kindredlost » Sat Aug 31, 2019 7:59 pm

...and THANK YOU! JLR for posting this update to MW. You are a prince!

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Post by josaka » Sun Sep 01, 2019 3:17 am

brownling sequencer direction?

swing? per step?
or offfsets ?

hold steps?

:)


from 3:30 in this video. :)
[video][/video]

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Post by PaulaM » Sun Sep 01, 2019 4:31 pm

JohnLRice wrote: But, I was just thinking you might be able to implement one or more variations of a third set of CV+Gate outputs! :hyper: Here's some initial ideas:

Channel Combine: A+B CV or A-B CV output on one jack with Gates OR'd or AND'd output on another jack?
do-able
JohnLRice wrote: Shift Register with selectable shift: Lot's of ways to go with this but basically I'm thinking you could take either the A or B set of CV+Gate (or even one of the combined scenarios mentioned above) and apply a shift register delay on the two outputs? The addition of a 8 position rotary switch (no delay through 7 clocks delay) would allow easy selection of the shift delay on the fly. Or I suppose if a rotary switch isn't feasible, a single center-off toggle switch could select three different shift values?
have to admit, you lost me..
Can you explain or demonstrate on a video?
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Post by PaulaM » Sun Sep 01, 2019 4:34 pm

kindredlost wrote: EDIT: I noticed in the video that the push button lights go off when a stage is enabled. This seems counter-intuitive. Am I wrong? (wouldn't be the first time)
ummm, not sure what you mean..
The buttons have four modes;

1) gate A on/off, they light when a gate is on.
2) Gate B on/off, they light when the gate is on.
3) Legato on/off, they light when a gate is on.
4) Skip on/off, they light when skip is on

I suspect what you're referring to is "Skip on", when turning off skip would make the light go out and the step would be heard.
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Post by PaulaM » Sun Sep 01, 2019 4:38 pm

josaka wrote:brownling sequencer direction?
can be done, yes.
josaka wrote: swing? per step?

potentially, this could be done.
josaka wrote: or offfsets ?
Sorry, I don't follow, can you explain?
josaka wrote: hold steps?
Again, I don't follow, what would a hold step do?
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Post by JohnLRice » Sun Sep 01, 2019 7:26 pm

PaulaM wrote:
JohnLRice wrote: Shift Register with selectable shift: Lot's of ways to go with this but basically I'm thinking you could take either the A or B set of CV+Gate (or even one of the combined scenarios mentioned above) and apply a shift register delay on the two outputs? The addition of a 8 position rotary switch (no delay through 7 clocks delay) would allow easy selection of the shift delay on the fly. Or I suppose if a rotary switch isn't feasible, a single center-off toggle switch could select three different shift values?
have to admit, you lost me..
Can you explain or demonstrate on a video?
An ASR (Analog Shift Register) and digital shift register emulations are basically like multiple sample and hold circuits connected in series with only one accessible CV and gate/clock inputs but all CV outputs are available. Each time a clock input is detected the first S&H grabs the externally input CV level but the second S&H grabs the current output of S&H 1 and S&H 3 grabs the current output of S&H 2 and so on. Basically time delayed outputs of the original.

Here's a short thread on shift registers:
viewtopic.php?t=141837

Most shift registers in the modular world always shift on every clock but when Synth Tech introduced the E102 Quad Temporal Shifter it was a game changer since the number of clocks it took to cause a shift could be manually or CV controlled. Here's the page for the module and links are there for the docs:
http://synthtech.com/eurorack/E102/

I made a LOT of demos for the E102, here's my first test, audio only, and it's just a simple 16 step sequence being shifted and controlling 3 very simple voices:
https://soundcloud.com/johnlrice/e102-first-test

And FWIW heres a video tutorial I made:
[video][/video]

SO . . . my thought was that it might be relatively simple for your sequencer to provide a parallel output of the A or B set (or added or subtracted set of both) but with selectable delay (1 to several clocks). It could be very useful for a third voice and also often more interesting for modulating filters of the other voices etc etc?

JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:05 pm

JohnLRice wrote:Channel Combine: A+B CV or A-B CV output on one jack with Gates OR'd or AND'd output on another jack?
uhhhm, wait a minute, this idea might not be the best for the CVs since often it would produce notes that are too high or too low, at least if it is just simply adding or subtracting voltages? Any two notes that are the same would produce zero or volts if one is subtracted from the other, two midrange melodies added together might produce voltages in the 6 to over 10 volt range and a higher note subtracted from a lower not would produce negative voltages. :hmm:

Maybe I'm over thinkng it? I feel tired at the moment . . . .

How about note averaging? A+B/2 should either produce a note in-between A and B or the same note if A=B?

And OH, did we talk about CV transposition yet?

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Post by PaulaM » Mon Sep 02, 2019 1:40 am

ok, I follow the shift register, and yes I could do that.

Transposition is also planned (via MIDI or one of the CV inputs).

one thing I'm keen to avoid is too much menu diving, so if it's not going to simple to add without hidden button pushes or menus, it won't be added.

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Post by sbuge » Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:41 am

allready this is looking SO interesting .. So cool&powerful sequencer.

Just wanna be sure: is the unquantified cv output fully continous (or is it digital?)

Does it support random steps?

Any idea of the price? 400£ , 500£ , 600£ , ... , 1000£ ?

OH and: built in ratchet for each step is YES YES YES


thanks Paula for doing this!

JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:59 am

PaulaM wrote:one thing I'm keen to avoid is too much menu diving, so if it's not going to simple to add without hidden button pushes or menus, it won't be added.
:yay: :tu: I'd much rather have less features if it means keeping the interface simpler! I get much more enjoyment out of patching several more simple straight forward modules together to get a complex result than trying to remember how to use a massively complex single module.

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Post by sbuge » Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:51 am

:agree:

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Post by josaka » Mon Sep 02, 2019 10:23 am

josaka wrote:
or offfsets ?

Sorry, I don't follow, can you explain?

josaka wrote:

hold steps?

Again, I don't follow, what would a hold step do?
offsetting notes is basically swing per step.. the zaquencer does it.. effectively you can move any note forward or back.. creating push or pull.. offseting notes plus swing is very powerful.. also some nice grooves would be good there is a reason the mpcs are so popular.. :) (also nothing in 5u does this.. most sequencers have no feel )

hold steps are note repeats.. as seen on M185 then licenced for the metropolis.. (called pulse count on the metropolis..) nothing in 5u does this..
also.. (not sure the grp does.. it does ratchets)

[video][/video]
and from 1 min..
[video][/video]

slides..?

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Post by sbuge » Mon Sep 02, 2019 11:02 am

hold steps are note repeats.. as seen on M185 then licenced for the metropolis.. (called pulse count on the metropolis..) nothing in 5u does this..
also.. (not sure the grp does.. it does ratchets)
How does this is different than ratcheting with variable step length?
If you have four step sequence step1,step2,step3,step4 and you want hold step 2 three times so you get: 1,2,2,2,3,4. You can do this with hold feature - but also this is doable with ratcheting: you just put the length of the step 2 three times longer than other steps and then put the ratcheting feature to 3x1/3 lenght of that step? You get exactly same sequence: 1 ,| 2,2,2 |, 3,4 .

Or am I missing something here? Of course with hold this is easyer to do.

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Post by PaulaM » Mon Sep 02, 2019 12:49 pm

sbuge wrote:allready this is looking SO interesting .. So cool&powerful sequencer.

Just wanna be sure: is the unquantified cv output fully continous (or is it digital?)
I'm not sure I follow, sorry..
It's a DAC, so digital but outputs a voltage, as such it's digital but there are 4096 steps, so you shouldn't notice them.

sbuge wrote: Does it support random steps?
you mean for order instead of forward/backward?
yes it can.
sbuge wrote: Any idea of the price? 400£ , 500£ , 600£ , ... , 1000£ ?
Not sure until I finish the hardware.

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Post by sbuge » Mon Sep 02, 2019 3:23 pm

Jep You followed just right.

So the smallest CV amount is 10 Volts / 4096 = 0.00024414062 Volts. I think I can live with this :hihi:

Thanks for the answers.

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