ER-101 vs NerdSeq

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Tomorrow Sounds Good
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ER-101 vs NerdSeq

Post by Tomorrow Sounds Good » Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:40 am

I’m stuck between choosing these two modules , I can’t afford both .

Does anyone own both or owned either ?

They both look great on all the videos I’ve watched but I can’t decide . Leaning towards ER-101 but any input would be greatly appreciated! :tu: :tu:

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mdoudoroff
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Post by mdoudoroff » Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:53 am

These are wildly different products, so you might get better feedback if you mention your priorities and concerns.

Also, without the ER-102, the ER-101 has no CV inputs—are you planning to get the ER-102, also, if you buy the ER-101?

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Post by sendepause » Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:03 am

Never uses an er-101 but had my eye on it for while. But I did switch recently from a eloquencer to an Nerdseq and i'm very happy.

although the concept is pretty different, i think from what i know from my research, you can do pretty much everything an er-101 can do. Given or taken a few things. Also the feedback you get from the screen, play-ability of prepared patches for live use is awesome. CV in's are a plus and the sample slots are a bonus.

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Post by mdoudoroff » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:33 am

I had an ER-101/102 for some time. I found it tedious to work with, and excruciating once sequences grew longer than a small number of “steps”. It didn’t take long before I was avoiding the thing.

The ER-101 is more of a stage sequencer than a step sequencer, since each ER-101 “step” can be any number of clock pulses instead of being a temporal grid on which you hang CV values. It’s not divorced from the clock in the way Control Forge is, though, it’s completely dependent on a (external) clock. But you have to configure each track’s relationship to that clock, and the sequencing process is more like creating a list of variable-duration notes (containing variable duration gates) to appear on a staff (in your head—there’s absolutely no other way to visualize your sequences than in your mind’s eye). The pattern feature of the ER-101 is a way to try to make lengthy sequences more manageable, but I’d call it a crutch.

By contrast, the NerdSeq process is far more self-evident, since the temporal grid is there and visually presented on a screen.

Both modules have significant learning curves.

If you’re considering these, you should also probably be taking hard look at both Vector, USTA, and the new Metron/Voltera combo. New sequencers from Erica and Endorphin.es are also on the horizon.

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Post by jmax313 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:48 am

Albeit I think the NerdSeq is very easy to use out of the box for simple sequence/track building, when you start diving into the sub menus and FX options, it can start to get a bit dense.

Im very happy with my NerdSeq though, have had it for a few months now and the best part is the firmware is continuously upgraded and some things in the works are the 16 CV expander option, I2C integration with ER301, etc.

No comment on 101 as I have not used it.

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Post by jjterbeek » Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:49 am

I own a Nerdseq with 16 trigger expander. Super sequencer for more intentional music production.

In my case: i am building as set with more random and looping functions. I use the MI Marbles for that. And the Nerdseq for designed music.

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Post by brandonlogic » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:00 am

Also, nerdseq has launchpad integration now.
Launchpad pro connected directly to the midi expander here.
Usb expander coming soon.
And yes, very excited about the i2c expander for direct control of the er301 with no patch cables.
[video][/video]
Last edited by brandonlogic on Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Tomorrow Sounds Good » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:01 am

Thanks for the replies . I’m looking for a sequencer to do melodic parts and want my notes / triggers to be off grid. The ER-101 looked to be the best for that but it seems NerdSeq might be able to do it?

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Post by brandonlogic » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:05 am

Tomorrow Sounds Good wrote:Thanks for the replies . I’m looking for a sequencer to do melodic parts and want my notes / triggers to be off grid. The ER-101 looked to be the best for that but it seems NerdSeq might be able to do it?
Nerdseq lets you use ‘groove’ microtiming to push steps forward or back but it won’t go completely off the grid. But you can set A higher clock multiplication and with the groove too, you can make it sound off the grid even though it’s really not... But the er101 isn’t entirely off the grid either since it’s tied to clock pulses and clock settings?

One sequencer I’ve heard is good for off the grid stuff is Hermod.
You can record midi in timing unquantized

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Post by hinterlands303 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:12 am

I tried both and didn't really gel with either even though they are objectively great sequencers. I couldn't handle the per step window workkflow of the ER-101/102 even though I really wanted to like the sequencer. It is incredibly beautiful and actually quite nice to work with; I just couldn't handle not being able to visualize the sequence.

The Nerdseq is also very nice but one of the main things I wanted to do with these two sequencers - variable step/stage length - is a bit trickier on the Nerdseq than I anticipated. It's done with the groove column, but it isn't a main feature of the sequencer workflow unlike the Er-101. Also I wasn't crazy about the way it handled gate lengths and I also had a lot of trouble with the hexidecimal system. The lack of scales was also a drawback - although not unworkable.

I recently picked up a Frap Tools USTA and I'm really liking it so far. It can't do everything the ER-101/102 and Nerdseq can do but it covers the main thing I was looking for - independently variable stage and gate length - with the added bonus of having knobs to tweak. I'm just digging in but I'm definitely finding it easier to get something going on the USTA than the other two.

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Post by brandonlogic » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:32 am

hinterlands303 wrote:I tried both and didn't really gel with either even though they are objectively great sequencers. I couldn't handle the per step window workkflow of the ER-101/102 even though I really wanted to like the sequencer. It is incredibly beautiful and actually quite nice to work with; I just couldn't handle not being able to visualize the sequence.

The Nerdseq is also very nice but one of the main things I wanted to do with these two sequencers - variable step/stage length - is a bit trickier on the Nerdseq than I anticipated. It's done with the groove column, but it isn't a main feature of the sequencer workflow unlike the Er-101. Also I wasn't crazy about the way it handled gate lengths and I also had a lot of trouble with the hexidecimal system. The lack of scales was also a drawback - although not unworkable.

I recently picked up a Frap Tools USTA and I'm really liking it so far. It can't do everything the ER-101/102 and Nerdseq can do but it covers the main thing I was looking for - independently variable stage and gate length - with the added bonus of having knobs to tweak. I'm just digging in but I'm definitely finding it easier to get something going on the USTA than the other two.


With the nerdseq, the ‘step’ (note) last’s long as until you put another note somewhere down in the 64 step sequence. If your only enter one note, it will be 64 ‘steps’ long(or longer if chaining sequences). So I’m not sure why you would need variable step length? Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.

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Post by guigui » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:02 pm

brandonlogic wrote: Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.
Hmmm, that's interesting. Could you confirm that?

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Post by guigui » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:10 pm

mdoudoroff wrote:New sequencers from Erica and Endorphin.es are also on the horizon.
Are you referring to Endorphin.es Ground Control or is it another sequencer?

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Post by SavageMessiah » Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:35 pm

I was in the same position recently, trying to choose between these two. I ended up going with the er-101/102 (I wouldn't want it without the 102) because it seemed like a better fit for the problems I was trying to solve - mainly imposing some order on ideas that come up when noodling around, and being a platform for generative weirdness. Honestly I don't think there's a sequencer in eurorack that would do better, so if you're interested in that sort of thing then it's probably what you want. I haven't created a sequence from scratch on the 101 yet. I use the realtime recording to capture me noodling around on tetrapad, or something that came up on marbles or whatever, clean up the timing, copy the pattern, and use maths to produce variations and the like. With parts and groups you can put some pretty cool functions under CV. It's a workflow that I've liked so far. Not being able to see more than one step at a time is definitely a pain, though.

If being off the grid is your goal you're not going to get better option until someone puts a piano roll interface in a module or something lol. Having almost arbitrary control of the length and timing of events up to the resolution of your clock is pretty sweet.

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Post by brandonlogic » Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:48 am

guigui wrote:
brandonlogic wrote: Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.
Hmmm, that's interesting. Could you confirm that?
It dosnt look like its in the firmware yet. i thought i remembered seeing somewhere that it would be eventually. i could be wrong.
there is an option for 'show decimal values' but i'm not sure what it does. Does not seem to be making any changes when turned on or off.

but hexadecimal really isnt an issue. its easy an intuitive to understand. and you normally dont even need to know exactly what the hex value actually is, its just a value, know whats high and whats low and thats it.

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Post by b9 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:43 pm

SavageMessiah wrote:I was in the same position recently, trying to choose between these two. I ended up going with the er-101/102 (I wouldn't want it without the 102) because it seemed like a better fit for the problems I was trying to solve - mainly imposing some order on ideas that come up when noodling around, and being a platform for generative weirdness. Honestly I don't think there's a sequencer in eurorack that would do better, so if you're interested in that sort of thing then it's probably what you want. I haven't created a sequence from scratch on the 101 yet. I use the realtime recording to capture me noodling around on tetrapad, or something that came up on marbles or whatever, clean up the timing, copy the pattern, and use maths to produce variations and the like. With parts and groups you can put some pretty cool functions under CV. It's a workflow that I've liked so far. Not being able to see more than one step at a time is definitely a pain, though.

If being off the grid is your goal you're not going to get better option until someone puts a piano roll interface in a module or something lol. Having almost arbitrary control of the length and timing of events up to the resolution of your clock is pretty sweet.
now I really want an ER 101/2

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Post by VM » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:40 pm

NerdSeq user here, very happy with it, though I don't do anything that is deliberately off-grid. For amorphous drones and ambience it handles everything I need without any expanders, in a 7U performance case.

If you like spreadsheets and having a grid visual in front of you at all times, i'd recommend it.
Current curator of Perth Ambient.

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Post by Mend » Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:41 am

ER-101/ER-102 user. Really really love it. The only negative is that it's not super immediate. Sure you can use MATH to generate random notes. But it's not very playable, like a Metropolis. But since you're already leaning towards Nerdseq or ER-101 I'm guessing you don't mind a little editing.

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Post by hinterlands303 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 2:26 pm

brandonlogic wrote:
guigui wrote:
brandonlogic wrote: Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.
Hmmm, that's interesting. Could you confirm that?
It dosnt look like its in the firmware yet. i thought i remembered seeing somewhere that it would be eventually. i could be wrong.
there is an option for 'show decimal values' but i'm not sure what it does. Does not seem to be making any changes when turned on or off.

but hexadecimal really isnt an issue. its easy an intuitive to understand. and you normally dont even need to know exactly what the hex value actually is, its just a value, know whats high and whats low and thats it.
Except when using the groove setting - where you have to know exactly what the number is otherwise everything gets thrown off. And the groove column will always have hexadecimal values because the column only has room for one digit.

Anyway, as I said it's a great sequencer but it had a few things which kept me from being able to use it the way I wanted. It's actually quite similar to an Elektron sequencer in a number of ways which is why I decided to pass it along - I already have an Octatrack and a Machinedrum which I can use for this style of sequencing.

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Post by brandonlogic » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:03 pm

hinterlands303 wrote:
brandonlogic wrote:
guigui wrote:
brandonlogic wrote: Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.
Hmmm, that's interesting. Could you confirm that?
It dosnt look like its in the firmware yet. i thought i remembered seeing somewhere that it would be eventually. i could be wrong.
there is an option for 'show decimal values' but i'm not sure what it does. Does not seem to be making any changes when turned on or off.

but hexadecimal really isnt an issue. its easy an intuitive to understand. and you normally dont even need to know exactly what the hex value actually is, its just a value, know whats high and whats low and thats it.
Except when using the groove setting - where you have to know exactly what the number is otherwise everything gets thrown off. And the groove column will always have hexadecimal values because the column only has room for one digit.

Anyway, as I said it's a great sequencer but it had a few things which kept me from being able to use it the way I wanted. It's actually quite similar to an Elektron sequencer in a number of ways which is why I decided to pass it along - I already have an Octatrack and a Machinedrum which I can use for this style of sequencing.
Image
Ok, found out what the decimal option is. It is in the firmware.
It adds this box on the side that shows exactly what the hex value is, where ever the cursor is.
So yeah, it’s a non issue now.

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Post by guigui » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:49 pm

brandonlogic wrote:
hinterlands303 wrote:
brandonlogic wrote:
guigui wrote:
brandonlogic wrote: Also, I believe there is an option now to turn hex values off.
Hmmm, that's interesting. Could you confirm that?
It dosnt look like its in the firmware yet. i thought i remembered seeing somewhere that it would be eventually. i could be wrong.
there is an option for 'show decimal values' but i'm not sure what it does. Does not seem to be making any changes when turned on or off.

but hexadecimal really isnt an issue. its easy an intuitive to understand. and you normally dont even need to know exactly what the hex value actually is, its just a value, know whats high and whats low and thats it.
Except when using the groove setting - where you have to know exactly what the number is otherwise everything gets thrown off. And the groove column will always have hexadecimal values because the column only has room for one digit.

Anyway, as I said it's a great sequencer but it had a few things which kept me from being able to use it the way I wanted. It's actually quite similar to an Elektron sequencer in a number of ways which is why I decided to pass it along - I already have an Octatrack and a Machinedrum which I can use for this style of sequencing.
Image
Ok, found out what the decimal option is. It is in the firmware.
It adds this box on the side that shows exactly what the hex value is, where ever the cursor is.
So yeah, it’s a non issue now.
That's nice! Thanks a lot, man!

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Post by hinterlands303 » Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:24 pm

brandonlogic wrote:Ok, found out what the decimal option is. It is in the firmware.
It adds this box on the side that shows exactly what the hex value is, where ever the cursor is.
So yeah, it’s a non issue now.
Nice! Yeah that would definitely make a difference.

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Post by richie » Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:54 am

You can check out the in depth tutorials made by sonicvoltage for a look into the work flow:

[video][/video]

[video][/video]

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Post by SavageMessiah » Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:38 pm

This video shows the er-101 being used "in the wild" as it were. I thought it was pretty helpful to see it outside of the context of a tutorial video.

[video][/video]

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