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Self generating patches....tips and ideas ?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Modular Synth General Discussion Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 25, 26, 27, 28, 29  Next [all]
Author Self generating patches....tips and ideas ?
cptnal
Oh, no - sequencers are cool. Look at the Entropical Paradise patch for example. SlayerBadger!
gis_sweden
colb wrote:
Here's a completely different take on generative.

Great. I think we can accept nonmodular stuff too.

colb wrote:
Heh, part of the reason I want a Morphagene is to load a bunch of this stuff into it smile

I sold my Phonogene the other day!
But I agree. I want to sample this! My sampler is a Roland SP-404SX. Bought it some weeks ago. I had a 404. Sold it. Misstake.
gis_sweden
Watching NED vs SWE and rearanging.
As I'm writing this NED scores (100 min)

Synth goal
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/926258

Status:


Have a case + modules to sell...
I'm in THAT phase in my modular life. What next? zombie
screaming goo yo Buy, buy, read, muffwiggler 1000 posts
screaming goo yo screaming goo yo Buy, evaluate, make music, muffs 150 posts
screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo evaluate, sell, rearrange, resize, refine, muffs 20 posts
screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo ?
colb
cptnal wrote:
Oh, no - sequencers are cool. Look at the Entropical Paradise patch for example. SlayerBadger!


Very nice, thanks for the pointer.
gis_sweden
Okay first patch on rebuilt synth (see picture above).
No smoke w00t
https://freesound.org/people/gis_sweden/sounds/476136/
Some sort of Krell it is.
It is electronic...
cptnal
gis_sweden wrote:
Okay first patch on rebuilt synth (see picture above).
No smoke w00t
https://freesound.org/people/gis_sweden/sounds/476136/
Some sort of Krell it is.
It is electronic...


I temporarily downsized a few months ago during the transition to my new case and didn't know where to start, so good work! thumbs up
colb
tardishead wrote:

I'll wait to see a patch diagram if you can
thanks for sharing

I know you've since worked it out, but I notated the patch today before tearing it down, so here it is:



And here's the modular grid link
(not sure if this works without login?)
nouri_leiner
jenamu6 wrote:
7thDanSound wrote:
One thing though that I find is key -be careful not to overmodulate stuff! Like mentioned earlier, "within constraints". That's key IMO. Otherwise you quickly end up with just noise more or less.


Yep been in the more or less lots a times.

Use cv mixers.... I like to take 1 out of the Wogglebug and 1 out of my sequencer......put them in a mixer and use that cv to go to a quantizer, instant tonal semi random melodies.
And use attuenators ofcourse

But.....I suck at dowing the very slow evolving things.....my attention span is...wow look at that?


I can relate to that...
cptnal
Had to post, I'm so hyper

I finally nailed what I call the Klobucar patch:



Actually a bit unfair posting it here because, other than the comparators, the key piece of kit is an addressable 1-in-4-out switch, which I guess few people have. I never did until I recently bought a SSM, and I remembered this video made use of one. It always seemed to me hellish complicated, but this time everything clicked. I won't post any output (yet) because it's still new and not much different to Dinko's examples. But if you have the resources it's well worth a go. w00t

To make it proper generative (in the self-playing sense) I'm modulating the parameters he's changing by hand. Now that I have the basic patch down it's time to explore the deeper possibilities...
gis_sweden
cptnal wrote:
Had to post, I'm so hyper
I finally nailed what I call the Klobucar patch:

This is a great video from Klobucar. I wish I had his patience... And a oscilloscope. One of the functions I kept im my new set up was a comparator. I use it in this first patch in two weeks (summer and vacation). I just completed a patch I had in mind. I started patching yesterday with synth turned off. I think I'm happy with my new set up. Maybe I have to add some VCAs (0hp + passive + DIY). But I have some "hidden" VCAs. I almost feel like soldering again... spinning

https://freesound.org/people/gis_sweden/sounds/476902/
cptnal
gis_sweden wrote:
And a oscilloscope.


Indeed. Once I sketched the patch out in MG it looked a lot simpler than I thought. The fiddly part is calibrating the comparators (I used a multi-meter).

One of the ideas in this patch I feel like chasing further is mixing the outputs of comparators, logic gates, etc... and using the result to drive something CV-addressable. In this case it's a switch, but it could as easily advance a sequencer, or... something else. hmmm.....
tardishead
cptnal wrote:
Had to post, I'm so hyper

I finally nailed what I call the Klobucar


Yeh very cool patch. Every time I try and watch the video it puts me to sleep Doh!
What does the addressable switch do? I thought he was using it as a visual aid to show what the comparators were doing? Why do the voltages have to be exact?
I worked out how to do the 3 different windows on my serge triple comparators. Cool thing in itself!
cptnal
As I understand it, the switch is passing copies of the master clock to each of the voices (s&h for pitch, envelope trigger) depending on the none/one/both voltage coming from the mixer. The voltages don't have to be exact as such, but knowing what they are allows you to control how much CV falls into which range. You may want the voices equally balanced, or to favour one or other.

His style is very soporific. I fell asleep at work once watching the video on noise. Dead Banana
tardishead
cptnal wrote:

His style is very soporific. I fell asleep at work once watching the video on noise. Dead Banana


Yeh it’s like some kind of endurance test which I fail badly!
tardishead
Any chance we can see your patch sketch
cptnal
tardishead wrote:
Any chance we can see your patch sketch


Sure. It's tailored to my rig of course...

tardishead
anything more hi res? A link maybe?
I am 5u so I would have to look up what these modules do
Sleipnir
tardishead wrote:
cptnal wrote:

His style is very soporific. I fell asleep at work once watching the video on noise. Dead Banana

Yeh it’s like some kind of endurance test which I fail badly!

Nothing at all in comparison to watching poor Raul. I've fallen asleep with my head on the desk after a couple of his. Mr. Green
OnTopic: Just put in a Ladik J-110 Derivator and J-120 Comparator. Definitely going to play with this, though I don't have the aforementioned switch. I wonder if a MI Stages could do it? It has a switch mode/patch, but never used it. I have a few 151-style switches, but not the same. Maybe try to fudge it with a Verbos Multistage in Strobe mode, with the individual gate outs into a quad vca?
cptnal
The trick is the switch has to be CV addressable, which I don't think you could get away with in Stages. Like I said, I don't think there's that many of them around. The only addressable switches I've seen other than the SSM are four-in-one-out buffered, obviously intended for pitch. The Derivator is great fun, although I recently realised that (who woulda thunk it?) Maths does slope detection too! Doesn't have steady and moving gates though, so Derivator wins in that respect.

tardishead, life (the other one) becons, so I'll see if I can spend some time on it tomorrow. thumbs up
cptnal
tardishead wrote:
anything more hi res? A link maybe?
I am 5u so I would have to look up what these modules do


OK, here goes in a generic stylee...

Take a moving voltage and offset/attenuate to a range from zero to a maximum that's easily divisible by three (I used 4.5V)
This goes into two comparators. The first's threshold is set to a third of the value above, the second to two thirds (So mine are 1.5V and 3V)
Send the comparators' gate outs to a mixer
Attenuate each to give a 1V output

So now we have an output at the mixer of 0V if the incoming voltage is in the first range (no gates high), 1V if it's in the second (one gate high), and 2V if it's in the third (both gates high).

Send the mixer's output to a CV-addressable switch and attenuate such that 0V selects the first output, 1V the second, and 2V the third
Send a clock pulse to the switch input. Now when our incoming voltage is in the lower range, switch channel one has the clock, and so on for channels two and three.

That's the control part of the patch. Now the pitch part...

Take a copy of our incoming voltage and send to a sample and hold, clocked with the same one as above
Send a copy of the sample and hold output to three quantizers (or via a sample and hold if your quantizer doesn't have a trigger in)
Take each switch output to trigger each quantizer and fire an envelope

These quantizers and envelopes belong to each of three voices, which you can configure at will.

How's that? Dead Banana

Edit: You'll probably want to offset/attenuate the signal on its way to the quantizers, independent of the copy that's going to the comparators, which you want to keep static.

Edit 2: It's just struck me that you could replace the mixer/switch combo with logic. NOR, OR and AND are your three ranges. Use these gates to open VCAs and you're golden. thumbs up
tardishead
Ah thanks so much for that.
Quote:
Edit 2: It's just struck me that you could replace the mixer/switch combo with logic. NOR, OR and AND are your three ranges. Use these gates to open VCAs and you're golden. thumbs up

Yes I don't have an addressable switch so this is similar to what I was thinking.
I was going to do it with 2 comparators - lowest range with NOT gate - upper is normal comp output and middle range is inverse of high plus non inverted low thru AND gate.
I do have Serge Triple Bi Di Switches. I think I can pretty much do all of this with what I've got - just done differently.
I also have a CGS Weighted Random Switch which could be good to use with this engine.
cptnal
It lives! SlayerBadger!

tardishead wrote:
middle range is inverse of high plus non inverted low thru AND gate.


...wouldn't a simple OR do? (TBH I haven't tried it yet.)

Edit: XOR - One but not both.
tardishead
Don’t have XOR
But I can make it work with what I do have
I’m having a little issue with comparator sluggishness or “gaps”
I’m also building 2 ornament and crimes to replace my Clee quantiser which has been fun but not exact enough and only one trigger input for 8 channels
But I love the feel of this kind of rhythm as opposed to the usual sequencer kinda thing
There’s a lot of room for experimentation- voltage source and comparator thresholds for a start
colb
cptnal wrote:
Oh, no - sequencers are cool.


I've been playing around with integrating some sequencing into a version of my evolving patch, replacing the feedback loop. Getting some nice results.

This clip uses an 8 step, which when combined with the shift register works nicely, but it does repeat fairly often - although each time around has a different texture. The transpose input of the quantiser is also being switched up every so often..

I've also been getting some interesting results using a seven step sequence - that way each time around is different. But that also means the result is less structured. So recording very long sections and searching for good bits to edit....

Anyhow, here's the 8 step example.

[s]https://soundcloud.com/colray/the-emotional-periphery[/s]

There's a nice effect with the Rampage based shift register that if the clock driving it is faster than its rise and fall settings, it never issues it's end of cycle event because it is always restarted first instead. That means that if the clock rate is modulated, the results can be more interesting than if the whole process was just speeded up...
cptnal
colb wrote:
cptnal wrote:
Oh, no - sequencers are cool.


I've been playing around with integrating some sequencing into a version of my evolving patch, replacing the feedback loop. Getting some nice results.

This clip uses an 8 step, which when combined with the shift register works nicely, but it does repeat fairly often - although each time around has a different texture. The transpose input of the quantiser is also being switched up every so often..

I've also been getting some interesting results using a seven step sequence - that way each time around is different. But that also means the result is less structured. So recording very long sections and searching for good bits to edit....

Anyhow, here's the 8 step example.

[s]https://soundcloud.com/colray/the-emotional-periphery[/s]

There's a nice effect with the Rampage based shift register that if the clock driving it is faster than its rise and fall settings, it never issues it's end of cycle event because it is always restarted first instead. That means that if the clock rate is modulated, the results can be more interesting than if the whole process was just speeded up...


Me like. With this kind of stuff the trick is to get the balance right between chaos to make it interesting, and structure to give the brain something to latch on to. Reckon you got the balance just right here. thumbs up
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