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Anyone ever seen a Frac/Eurorack Combo Rack?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Fractional Rack Modules Goto page 1, 2  Next [all]
Author Anyone ever seen a Frac/Eurorack Combo Rack?

Tubeampguy

Anyone ever seen a case that would house and power both FRAC and EURORACK? help


Tubeampguy

poke


Cat-A-Tonic

Not commercially,
but you could DIY a case with 2 PSUs and 2 bussboard systems.
Make one row for each format.
I've seen it done by others in the past.


BananaPlug

The last two iterations of my frankensynth use a metal frame. Each 3U row can be used for frac or euro easily. It's kind of a post and beam construction. Each rail is supported by legs going straight to the back of the case. That provides some flex so you can get the rail to rail spacing you need for frac or euro (a small difference). The rails use a sliding nut that takes an M3 screw. That takes care of side to side issues. You could split a rail, adding legs there and have a row that's half euro and half frac.

Here's what I'm talking about. I used it as three rows of frac but any of the rows would accommodate euro just as easily. If the lack of a little lip above and below the euro modules bothers you you might add some kind of filler strip and attach it to the legs. small gaps between rows are helpful for cooling anyway. The metal stuff is called Microrax. The cost adds up by the time you get all the little bits of hardware but it served my purposes very well and goes together quickly.



It's peanut butter jelly time!


mamonu

BananaPlug wrote:



It's peanut butter jelly time!



now this looks great!

thumbs up thumbs up


Tubeampguy

BananaPlug wrote:
The last two iterations of my frankensynth use a metal frame. Each 3U row can be used for frac or euro easily. It's kind of a post and beam construction. Each rail is supported by legs going straight to the back of the case. That provides some flex so you can get the rail to rail spacing you need for frac or euro (a small difference). The rails use a sliding nut that takes an M3 screw. That takes care of side to side issues. You could split a rail, adding legs there and have a row that's half euro and half frac.

Here's what I'm talking about. I used it as three rows of frac but any of the rows would accommodate euro just as easily. If the lack of a little lip above and below the euro modules bothers you you might add some kind of filler strip and attach it to the legs. small gaps between rows are helpful for cooling anyway. The metal stuff is called Microrax. The cost adds up by the time you get all the little bits of hardware but it served my purposes very well and goes together quickly.


That is killer! I'll have to look into this. Thanks! applause



It's peanut butter jelly time!



Tubeampguy

I found this online from Elby. Russian Roulette poke Fencing
www.elby-designs.com/panther/euro-frac.pdf


limpmeat

Can you use normal rack mounting rails for Frac? Thinking of building a new rack for some frac modules and I have some spare rail lying around.


adamf

I have been focusing more on my frac than euro of late. I wanted to get a delay module into my frac system. Thinking it over, I realised that my Harvestman Tyme Sefari measured 15 hp, which happens to be a very good size match for two frac spaces. So, with a bit of bravery, I mounted it into my frac case by drilling some appropriately spaced holes in the frac rails and making a little power connector adapter. Powered it on and have been enjoying it ever since. Not sure about the wisdom of running it on 15 rather than 12v, but it works for me (so far...).

Using this same principle, you could mount any combination of euro modules that adds up to 30 hp (ie: 4 frac spaces) into a Frac system, provided they are ok on 15v.


adamf

adamf wrote:

Using this same principle, you could mount any combination of euro modules that adds up to 30 hp (ie: 4 frac spaces) into a Frac system, provided they are ok on 15v.


actually, there is another limiting factor: some euro modules have pcbs that take up too much of the 3ru width, so won't fit inside the frac rails.


solitaryzen

adamf wrote:
adamf wrote:

Using this same principle, you could mount any combination of euro modules that adds up to 30 hp (ie: 4 frac spaces) into a Frac system, provided they are ok on 15v.


actually, there is another limiting factor: some euro modules have pcbs that take up too much of the 3ru width, so won't fit inside the frac rails.


The frac Zeroscillator I got also has this problem - had a load of trouble getting it into a Blacet rack. It's not going to be moved anytime soon!


Adam-V

adamf wrote:

actually, there is another limiting factor: some euro modules have pcbs that take up too much of the 3ru width, so won't fit inside the frac rails.


Very true. The rails in frac racks are quite a bit closer together than the rails in eurorack.

And FWIW, some euro modules have PCBs that don't even fit between euro rails! I had to grind the edges off the PCB on the uLFO in order to mount it in my Doepfer rack. There are a couple of Livewire modules that are a bit of a squeeze too.

Cheers,
Adam-V


adamf

Actually, I'd almost forgotten about this portable Euro/frac system that I set up a couple of years ago:

http:[email protected]/sets/72157616560355458/

http:[email protected]/3427702246/

A lot has changed since then with inevitable module purchases etc.. At that stage I was running the whole system on +/-12v.


Cynthia

We have a new Zeroscillator, ZO Engine Board design coming out in a about three-weeks that is a single surface mount PCB instead of the former block of four circuit boards. This allows mounting in much more shallow cabinets. The whole depth of the module is now around 2.5 inches!

As far as top and bottom clearance of the Front Panel Assembly with it's own pair of circuit boards, maybe I can narrow the vertical height of the FPA with this in mind? I'll have a look, I know it as a tight fit before.

We still have several of the large FPAs for Frac ZOs already assembled here waiting for these new engines to arrive so we can dock and ship.

One of the things that makes the ZO special is that the tuning and exponential converter are not tied directly to the power rails, instead they're fed by a precision Voltage Reference so once calibrated, they will work just fine regardless of 12V or 15V power supplies smile

http://www.cyndustries.com/modules_zero-osc.cfm?type=37


solitaryzen

Cynthia wrote:
We have a new Zeroscillator, ZO Engine Board design coming out in a about three-weeks that is a single surface mount PCB instead of the former block of four circuit boards. This allows mounting in much more shallow cabinets. The whole depth of the module is now around 2.5 inches!

As far as top and bottom clearance of the Front Panel Assembly with it's own pair of circuit boards, maybe I can narrow the vertical height of the FPA with this in mind? I'll have a look, I know it as a tight fit before.

We still have several of the large FPAs for Frac ZOs already assembled here waiting for these new engines to arrive so we can dock and ship.

One of the things that makes the ZO special is that the tuning and exponential converter are not tied directly to the power rails, instead they're fed by a precision Voltage Reference so once calibrated, they will work just fine regardless of 12V or 15V power supplies smile

http://www.cyndustries.com/modules_zero-osc.cfm?type=37


Thanks for that info. If you could improve the top & bottom clearance, that would be great, as mine was so tight I couldn't get the bottom screws in properly! If the tracking is improved with the new version, I might just consider getting a second ZO if finances allow down the track Dead Banana Would be nice to have one in my portable case.


noisefor

I used an Audiopile 12U case to run both systems in one. The Audiopile stuff is solid and affordable. I mounted 9U Blacet Frac rails/power in combo with a 3U TipTop Happy Ending kit that has its own discreet power source w/wall wart.

The cases are a minimum 10" deep with two lids for access (disadvantage to dual setup is Frac mods tend have PCB's mounted in series and can be as much as 6" deep so you have to accommodate for depth unlike Euro which are generally parallell mounted to face plates).

You can easily DIY something like a TipTop zeus 1200ma powered board for the Euro stuff with the Zrails and ears (which are all mountable on standard rack equip.) if you don't want to use up the 6hp for the TipTop power switch, for example.

The Audiopile cases are a great bang for the buck if not a little bulky and heavy with both lids on - good if you play out with a dual rig as I do. Interior is plywood so you can easily mount stuff too. Both sides have rack rail but you can lighten overall weight by removing rear rails.

http://audiopile.net/products/Cases/RUE_Roadracks/RUE_Case_products_pa ge.shtml

Picture of rig (which has changed a bit...):

Picture file


Tubeampguy

adamf wrote:
Actually, I'd almost forgotten about this portable Euro/frac system that I set up a couple of years ago:

http:[email protected]/sets/72157616560355458/

http:[email protected]/3427702246/

A lot has changed since then with inevitable module purchases etc.. At that stage I was running the whole system on +/-12v.



Thanks for posting these pictures! That's exactly what I was envisioning! applause


reignbear

adamf wrote:
I have been focusing more on my frac than euro of late. I wanted to get a delay module into my frac system. Thinking it over, I realised that my Harvestman Tyme Sefari measured 15 hp, which happens to be a very good size match for two frac spaces. So, with a bit of bravery, I mounted it into my frac case by drilling some appropriately spaced holes in the frac rails and making a little power connector adapter. Powered it on and have been enjoying it ever since. Not sure about the wisdom of running it on 15 rather than 12v, but it works for me (so far...).

Using this same principle, you could mount any combination of euro modules that adds up to 30 hp (ie: 4 frac spaces) into a Frac system, provided they are ok on 15v.


is the tyme sefari still running fine under 15v?


giorgio

maybe randall can help? (hides)


ddoyen

how about getting a paia or blacet rack, and something like a tiptop happy ending..or whatever combination of frac and euro you have in mind and stack and mount em up in a nice wooden box?

i'm thinking that's what I'm leaning towards..(unless I'm missing something and it's a bad idea??)

I got my 9700 together and want to get some of the newer paia modules and some blacet stuff eventually but I think I wanna get a rack of make noise stuff together..shit is just soooo damn cool.


adamf

reignbear wrote:
adamf wrote:
I have been focusing more on my frac than euro of late. I wanted to get a delay module into my frac system. Thinking it over, I realised that my Harvestman Tyme Sefari measured 15 hp, which happens to be a very good size match for two frac spaces. So, with a bit of bravery, I mounted it into my frac case by drilling some appropriately spaced holes in the frac rails and making a little power connector adapter. Powered it on and have been enjoying it ever since. Not sure about the wisdom of running it on 15 rather than 12v, but it works for me (so far...).

Using this same principle, you could mount any combination of euro modules that adds up to 30 hp (ie: 4 frac spaces) into a Frac system, provided they are ok on 15v.


is the tyme sefari still running fine under 15v?


Yes, my sampling friend is still running well on 15v.


adamf

ddoyen wrote:
how about getting a paia or blacet rack, and something like a tiptop happy ending..or whatever combination of frac and euro you have in mind and stack and mount em up in a nice wooden box?

i'm thinking that's what I'm leaning towards..(unless I'm missing something and it's a bad idea??)

I got my 9700 together and want to get some of the newer paia modules and some blacet stuff eventually but I think I wanna get a rack of make noise stuff together..shit is just soooo damn cool.


Nothing wrong with that approach. I have a row of malekko/wiard running with my frac stuff currently. It has its own 12v supply while the frac has 15v.

If you decide to run everything on either 15v or 12 v only, just be aware that some euro modules may not be able to run on 15v (they may have ICs that fry) and that using a voltage that a module was not original designed for may change its operating characteristics (eg: my Metalbox tube VCA didn't have as much balls or snarl when run under 12v --yes, balls and snarl are legitimate technical terms).

Also, some Frac modulation sources may output voltages above 12v.If you are running a mixed 12 and 15 v system, hitting the 12v stuff with higher voltages may damage them.


spadezftw

I was thinking about figuring out a way to put some Euro modules into a PAiA Fracrack system I have, which as of now has only the 9720 VCO. I've since decided against it, but was wondering if some linear regulators (7812/7912) downstream of the regulated +/- 15V supply might do the trick to supply +/- 12V for a module or two. The regulator circuit could be assembled on a protoboard, break out an IDC for power distribution, and be secured directly to the case.

If using the PAiA unregulated (9770/U) universal supply for supplying PAiA Frac modules that don't require regulated power, it seems one might even be able to tap the rectified AC directly off of the board to provide the input to the 12V regulator.

Any thoughts from those with power know-how? I might reconsider my options and try this as a cheap and dirty way to power a Euro module or two (presuming the PCBs will fit between the rails) until I build a dedicated rack


ersatzplanet

A while back somebody was pushing the idea of a Euro/Frac rail design they had. The rail had the front and rear rail surfaces offset from each other and a central screw for mounting. All you had to do was rotate the rail around and you had the closer hole spacing of the Frac rack. Was a neat idea but the tooling and setup to extrude the rails was probably too much especially since Vector rails would still work great if they were just mounted closer together.


analogdrummer

ddoyen wrote:
how about getting a paia or blacet rack, and something like a tiptop happy ending..or whatever combination of frac and euro you have in mind and stack and mount em up in a nice wooden box?

i'm thinking that's what I'm leaning towards..(unless I'm missing something and it's a bad idea??)

I got my 9700 together and want to get some of the newer paia modules and some blacet stuff eventually but I think I wanna get a rack of make noise stuff together..shit is just soooo damn cool.


That's what I did:



The case I made detaches from the desk.

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