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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Any headless fans here?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Guitars, Basses, Amps & FX  
Author Any headless fans here?
sonicwarrior
I started with a Steinberger Synapse SS-2F and grew pretty fond of the headless idea. That's why I have three headless guitars now.

It's a shame the idea got so many haters and there are not that many models to choose from. Steinberger makes only cheap Korean made guitars, Hohner still make their wood only cheap copies and all other headless companies I know are more or less custom shops like Basslab or Strandberg which means they are expensive and it takes at least a some months until you get your guitar (the waiting list for Strandberg is BIG!).

Any other headless fans here?
dkcg
I'd get head if I had a choice... love

Only tried a headless Steinberger a long time ago in the 80s. It was weird to me, especially tuning on the wrong end of the guitar hihi

...probably takes getting used to. I was wondering what was up with the cheap Steinbergers, I remembered them being on the expensive side when I first heard of them.
sonicwarrior
dkcg wrote:
It was weird to me, especially tuning on the wrong end of the guitar hihi


I got used to that pretty fast and I find it simpler and faster than the headstock style tuning. My headless guitars also have a better tuning stability although I only have headstock guitars with locking tuners and hardtail bridges.

dkcg wrote:
I remembered them being on the expensive side when I first heard of them.


Well, after Steinberger has been bought by Gibson they continued the old (expensive) models a while but then (in the mid 90s) they stopped the production. In 1999 the brand has been revived with the ultra cheap Spirit models. Later the more expensive Synapse models have been added, with EMG 81 and 85 pickups and a build-in spring adapter to be able to use normal strings instead of the double ball strings that were needed for the previous models if you had not installed an optional string adapter. The latest model is the ZT-3 with a new revision of the old Trans-Trem which let's you bend chords in tune and has 5 locking positions (D, D#, E, F, F#) which is better than having a D-Tuner.

I'm using my Synapse mainly as a travel guitar to practice when I go by train as the neck is a bit thick. It's thinner on the ZT-3 that I got last week so playing on that makes more fun but the Synapse is still smaller and cost only half as much so scratches on it are not that bad.
dkcg
sonicwarrior wrote:
The latest model is the ZT-3 with a new revision of the old Trans-Trem which let's you bend chords in tune and hast 5 locking positions (D, D#, E, F, F#) which is better than having a D-Tuner.


Holy shit! I didn't know any trem could do that. eek!

Any tuning protection against a string breaking?
sonicwarrior
dkcg wrote:
Holy shit! I didn't know any trem could do that. eek!


Here is an official demo video (with poor video effects):



There is another demo video for an older Trans-Trem version (1 or 2, I don't know):



dkcg wrote:
Any tuning protection against a string breaking?


Only the locking positions as far as I know. But changing the strings with the double-ball strings you'll need for the Trans-Trem to work properly is pretty fast.
Babaluma
had a cheap steinberger bass copy once, and loved the design for the most part, but it was built with really cheap parts, and i didn't like the feel of the wide d-shaped neck. would love a "real" steinberger bass one day, but they are pricey.
sonicwarrior
A Hohner perhaps?
I've heard that they are a bit like the cheap Spirit line from Steinberger as those also don't have the graphite U-channel and phenolic fingerboards of the Synapse collection.
Babaluma
i had the steinberger spirit, and have played the hohner, and a real steinberger bass, and nothing compares to the original. for around the same price you could buy a status brand new, i'd love one, but can't abide their design...

http://www.status-graphite.com/
sonicwarrior
Ah, didn't know that company. Do you mean the Streamline model?



I find that one ugly, too.
Babaluma
all of them, they're all fugly as fuck!

i love the idea, but not the implementation, (would much rather have an original steiny). am sure the status basses play beautifully, and they are made just down the road from where i went to uni (colchester, essex), but as i said, can't abide that design.
estragon
A few years back someone came out with a guitar that tunes at the other end. I’ve never tried one. I guess they sound alright but they look ridiculous and I imagine you’d feel pretty foolish holding one. That would affect your playing. The idea isn’t to feel foolish. The idea is to put a pick in one hand and a guitar in the other and with a tiny movement rule the world.

-David Fair
sonicwarrior
What a stupid reason to never even try a headless guitar. meh This David Fair should work on his self esteem if his playing depends on the guitar form he is playing. That's the worst contra headless argument I've ever heard. Well, he plays folk music and these guys are not known for their open mindness regarding guitar innovations.

And btw. there are some models that look exactly like headstock guitars without the headstock like the Steinberger ZT-3:



Or a Basslab STD:



Cynic played a ZT-3 live:



IAMX use headless guitars live:



The crowd seems pretty happy.
Christopher Winkels
Even though I play guitar about as well as Wilhelm II might have I always had a soft spot for Steinbergers. It irks me that fashion plays so much of a role in musicians' choices, because they were a very real and noble attempt to try improving the state of the art in guitars.
Bendu
I played a Yamaha BX 1 bass when I was in high school. One of the bands I played in was a punk band and at my first practice with them (I was a replacement) the singer laughed and said that my bass wasn't punk enough. They decided that they didn't need a lead singer after that. hihi
dkcg
So I've always been curious if the headstock adding/taking away from sustain is in deed an old wives' tale.

Is there anything a lot different about the neck construction or the body construction, or is the bigger heavier headstock adding to sustain a myth?

Some great info in here...I hadn't looked at Steinbergers since about 1990 or so...they were way out of my range then, so I never looked again until I saw the lower end ones on craigslist for a fraction of what I thought they were from memory. I wanted one back then, but the strat was a lot more affordable for a poor college student.
wyrtti
I've been in love with the Status Graphite headless designs for a long time, but have never bought one. I love the way they look and play. A headless 6-string bass would be soooo nice.
Babaluma
i LOVE the design of the original steinbergers and lust after them frequently. for me, an instrument has to have visual appeal to me, or i won't pick it up and play it. hence my beautiful spalted maple tele. hence my hatred of "frankensynths", but that's just me. i was inquiring after that status graphite pictured above for a while, but baulked when i found out the price.
sonicwarrior
dkcg wrote:
Is there anything a lot different about the neck construction or the body construction, or is the bigger heavier headstock adding to sustain a myth?


I have to check that at home to be sure. The necks of my headless guitars don't get thinner from the body to the headpiece which may result in the need for some adjustment time to get used to.

The Basslab is completely hollow which makes it super light (around 2 kg) and gives it a semi-acoustic fell. Plus it is possible to practice without using an amp if the ambient noise is low.
estragon
sonicwarrior wrote:
What a stupid reason to never even try a headless guitar. meh This David Fair should work on his self esteem if his playing depends on the guitar form he is playing. That's the worst contra headless argument I've ever heard. Well, he plays folk music and these guys are not known for their open mindness regarding guitar innovations.


The quote was actually from David Fair of the great Half Japanese, excerpted from his guide to playing guitar. The material you posted only solidifies my opinion of headless guitars and the people that play them, but as David says "it's your guitar and you can put whatever you want on it".
sonicwarrior
sonicwarrior wrote:
I have to check that at home to be sure.


I'm sorry, I had a head ache and stomach ache and slept almost instantly when I got home. I hope I'm able to check that today. At least the head ache is gone.
Chrome Dinette
I haven't posted here in forever, but I have three headless guitars(Teuffel/Scott French/Ozma) and two cheapo headless basses(Cort/Lotus). I have previously had two other headless guitars(Synsonics/Steinberger) as well.

I was never crazy about the trems on Steinbergers, but I do like hardtail headlesses.
oozitron
David Fair is not your typical guitar player. We're distantly related, but are on different planets musically.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vD1Yx8z0BXs


Another David (close friend, not relative) makes beautiful custom bass guitars. His instruments (some headless) are beautiful and get high marks from reviews for their sound and feel. Check out the pictures:

http://www.kingbass.com/photo.html

Drew
DonaldCrunk
i owned the Hohner steinberger copy for a while, as my only guitar in fact - it was fine, but i suspect it had none of the advantages that the _actual_ steinberger had. the trem system threw it out of tune rather easily.

it's a great studio guitar though, very compact and little to catch on when you need to grab it and add a part quickly
sonicwarrior
dkcg wrote:
So I've always been curious if the headstock adding/taking away from sustain is in deed an old wives' tale.


I've checked that now between ZT-3 and Basslab (headless bolt-on and neck-thru-body) and Framus and Ran custom (headed bolt-on and neck-thru-body) and I barely hear a difference, although it might be very slightly more on the headless models. Hard to say. That's why I say that I'm not the 'compare guy'. seriously, i just don't get it
Just me
I had a Steinberger bass when they were new and hip. It had a great sound, a new modern look and was the most difficult to play instrument I've ever owned. I sold it and bought a Music Man. I picked up a noname Japanese guitar shortly after and used it for a few years. It was nice and small and was easy to transport on a motorcycle. Only issue was I kept sliding my hand off the end of the neck.
stevenclements
I've got a very nice Ibanez IMG-2010

love it... wish I could figure out how to hang it like the rest of the guitars
Rockin' Banana!
sonicwarrior
That's a MIDI guitar, right?
stevenclements
sonicwarrior wrote:
That's a MIDI guitar, right?


Yes indeed, 24 pin out 3 pups, 2 double coil and one hex
sonicwarrior
Got a funny picture about headless guitars:
GovernorSilver
Late to the party, but yes, I'm a fan. I once owned a Steinberger GM7TA.

Now I am lusting for a Strandberg Boden 8 production model.

http://strandbergguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/AES_Strandberg _Catalog_2014.pdf
stevenclements
I keep pacing... I wanna pull the trigger on a Carvin HH2
sonicwarrior
GovernorSilver wrote:
Now I am lusting for a Strandberg Boden 8 production model.


Still after the whooping price increase?

That turned me off. Currently I'm lusting for a Xen or Skervesen headless. With 7 or 8 strings. Still undecided on that but I probably won't order this year anyway. Need to practice more before justifying that investment. help
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:
GovernorSilver wrote:
Now I am lusting for a Strandberg Boden 8 production model.


Still after the whooping price increase?


Unfortunate, yes, but I understand switching to the Washburn factory had something to do with it - higher quality construction and materials to go with the higher price. At least that is what I garnered from the Astral EXF FB page and the sevenstring forum (which admittedly I rarely visit).
sonicwarrior
Hmmm, I'm also subscribed to the .strandberg sevenstring thread but didn't notice anything about better hardware. Or do you mean the wood? I doubt the new Washburn wood is worth $500 more.

The thing is: For what those production models are costing (which is basically a mass production guitar although in a smaller scale more like synth modules) I can already get a complete custom guitar. Even ones made in more expensive countries like Germany.
And I can even get me a licensed Strandberg from a custom guitar builder with the original Strandberg hardware and everything.
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:

And I can even get me a licensed Strandberg from a custom guitar builder with the original Strandberg hardware and everything.


Who is this builder?

I don't subscribe to any sevenstring.com thread. In fact I almost never visit that forum - I just found Strandberg threads by Google search. Regarding your other question, I found the thread by the guy who got a Boden from the Strictly 7 factory with worm holes and other mistakes. And on another thread, there is a guy who was happy with his Washburn-made Boden. Then again, there's another guy who got a Washburn-made Strandberg guitar that arrived with scratches on it.

I need to practice guitar more too, before justifying a headless 8-string guitar purchase. This is one of the downsides of being a multi-instrumentalist - I also play keys and bowed strings. Maybe by the time I'm ready, Astral EXR will have sorted out their issues. Then again, those OAF-XEN guitars look great to me too... 8_)
sonicwarrior
GovernorSilver wrote:
Who is this builder?


I didn't mean anyone specific. Strandberg offers licenses (and templates) so it can be any custom builder willing to build it.
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:
GovernorSilver wrote:
Who is this builder?


I didn't mean anyone specific. Strandberg offers licenses (and templates) so it can be any custom builder willing to build it.


I was just wondering because he doesn't list licensed builders on his websites.

However, the more I look at those OAF-XEN collaboration guitars the more interested I get, lol.
sonicwarrior
GovernorSilver wrote:
I was just wondering because he doesn't list licensed builders on his websites.


No, it doesn't work this way. The license is ordered per custom order. But I just had a look and it seems the license doesn't cost anything anymore:
http://guitarworks.thestrandbergs.com/2013/03/01/design-licensing-perm issions/
There are just some specific rules. Basically when you publish the guitar (pictures, video) you have to put a reference to Strandberg in the text.
GovernorSilver
Currently Xen is the only luthier that is showing up as using a Strandberg licensed design - at least in Google search. Looks promising enough to me.

I'd be curious about what builder you choose for your headless project.
krz
Love my NS XL-2A. Was born/delivered as a fretless but much sight-reading necessitated getting it fretted. Now I wish it was the original unfretted graphite neck. Awespme sound and action! The new NS Design basses are sounding badass -as in super versatile. I think the newer Status basses look fantastic & ergonomic.
sonicwarrior
GovernorSilver wrote:
I'd be curious about what builder you choose for your headless project.


Currently my choice is between Claas, Xen/OAF (or the European partner) or Skervesen. Probably not the Strandberg design then as they all have their own design which I dig, too. But I too should practice more before buying another guitar.
GovernorSilver
krz wrote:
Love my NS XL-2A. Was born/delivered as a fretless but much sight-reading necessitated getting it fretted. Now I wish it was the original unfretted graphite neck. Awespme sound and action! The new NS Design basses are sounding badass -as in super versatile. I think the newer Status basses look fantastic & ergonomic.


Yeah, I've been an admirer of the Status Streamline for a while. Almost makes me want to take up bass again... except I know I'm going to turn into a Squarepusher clone (with 0.00314159% of his talent) if I do that

GovernorSilver
I almost forgot I signed up as a backer for this Kickstarter project - what can I say, i'm a sucker for weird looking guitars:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/alpacaguitar/alpaca-guitar-the-ul timate-adventure-guitar

So i will be getting a new headless at some point this year, just not an extended range multi-scale, lol:



I just got Pete Huttlinger's new "50 Fingerstyle Licks You Must Know" course. Yet another reminder of how much more practicing I need to do on 6-string guitar. Rockin' Banana!
sonicwarrior
Looks like a Picasso face. wink
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:
Looks like a Picasso face. wink


Now that you mention it... Looks like we have a name for my guitar when I get it. But I can't spell it with a "k" or I'll be sued by Linda Manzer.
GovernorSilver
Anybody mention Chris Forshage yet? He was inspired by Klein and Teuffel, and came up with his own take on their designs.





Some lucky gent (not me) just bought this one for just under $3000 used.
Suburban Bather
Whenever headless basses are mentioned, the first thing I think of is Milli Vanilli lol

krz
Some nice Ichabod Cranes and headless...
Milli who? ;)
trickness
Any Teuffel Tesla owners up in here? Always wanted one of those.....
Chrome Dinette
trickness wrote:
Any Teuffel Tesla owners up in here? Always wanted one of those.....


I have one of the early ones. It's great, though I hear the model has improved over the years.
Liquidcolor
I've owned quite a few Steinberger GM's and had a beautiful custom Klein that was stolen in the mid 90's. I always found the Transtrem finicky and they would go out of calibration every string change. Others have had better luck. These days it's Telecasters and Roland GX0X models. Wouldn't mind another GM at a fair price.
khakifridge
My fave squeeze is my Status Energy bass. Gorgeous. It's older than my kids and waaay more well-behaved. Also have a Steinberger XT-25 that I quite enjoy.
pacific202
I have one of the Steinberger Synapse SS-2F guitars and for the $400 I paid for it I'm happy. It's a great guitar to throw in the trunk with my Zoom G3 for a portable practice rig, and it's also great for just sitting on the couch and practicing/noodling.

The tone isn't as bad as you might think, it's comparable to a lot of other EMG-equipped guitars in the $500-$1000 price range so I guess it's not fair to compare it to a good Strat or Les Paul.

Tuning stability is the key benefit to the headless design, if you are a gigging musician then these guitars are a dream. Chances are you'll show up to your gig, make a few really small adjustments (if any) then you'll be good all night. I can't comment on the stability on the trem/vibrato guitars, but every time I've played live with a hardtail headless guitar or headless bass it's been wonderful to not have to tune up every few songs and just focus on the show.

I'll also put this forward as the nicest headless instrument I've ever seen:

http://www.acguitars.co.uk/acg_admin/wordpress/portfolio/3553/
khakifridge
+1

I almost never have to tune my Status, and the Steinberger only occasionally. Both get gigged and are perfect for the job.

pacific202 wrote:
I'll also put this forward as the nicest headless instrument I've ever seen:

Nice. I quite hanker after one of Martin Petersen's Sei Originals. One day... Guitar
Chrome Dinette
GovernorSilver wrote:
I almost forgot I signed up as a backer for this Kickstarter project - what can I say, i'm a sucker for weird looking guitars:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/alpacaguitar/alpaca-guitar-the-ul timate-adventure-guitar

So i will be getting a new headless at some point this year, just not an extended range multi-scale, lol:



I just got Pete Huttlinger's new "50 Fingerstyle Licks You Must Know" course. Yet another reminder of how much more practicing I need to do on 6-string guitar. Rockin' Banana!


Did you ever get that? How is it?
GovernorSilver
Chrome Dinette wrote:

Did you ever get that? How is it?


Haven't gotten mine yet. They've reportedly shipped out some "beta" models. They've had numerous delays but have been sending frequent update emails about where they are. The unusual design has caused some manufacturing problems. Latest email I got from them was July 13, in which they reported the results of consulting a process engineer. Included in the email was this photo demonstrating improvement.



I am the sort of customer that is willing to wait for you to get your product right before shipping it to me, instead of rushing a crappy half-finished product.
Hermetech Mastering
I've wanted a "real" Steinberger L2 or XL2 since I first them in the 80's. Now they are quite expensive. A few years ago I bought the Spirit bass, it was pretty cheap, the hardware was very poor quality, and I absolutely hated the feel of the neck (it was very "round" and not like the Jazz Bass necks I am used to at all). I still love the idea of having an original all carbon/graphite, but can anyone who owns one tell me if the neck is anything like the Spirits? I guess I really just have to try one out in a store.

Christopher Winkel's friend also posted an AMAZING looking all wood mini headless bass on his FB page a couple of years ago, but now neither of us can remember what it was and the link seems lost forever. Pretty sure it was a boutique luthier based in the US. He had a big range of basses, all sizes, but he had this little travel bass range with names like Model 1 and Model 2 etc. The one I wanted was about $2k. The company name was the luthier's name. Brad David or something, by way of an example. If anyone knows what I am talking about then please post the link!
Hermetech Mastering
oozitron wrote:
David Fair is not your typical guitar player. We're distantly related, but are on different planets musically.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vD1Yx8z0BXs


Another David (close friend, not relative) makes beautiful custom bass guitars. His instruments (some headless) are beautiful and get high marks from reviews for their sound and feel. Check out the pictures:

http://www.kingbass.com/photo.html

Drew


DREW I LOVE YOU!!!

It was the David King bass! I want this one:

http://www.kingbass.com/bassdesc/leblanc.html



smile
trickness
I've been tempted by the Teuffel Tesla, but never played one. Would love to hear from someone who has.
sonicwarrior
trickness wrote:
I've been tempted by the Teuffel Tesla

I've been, too, until I saw the current prices around 5K Euro. eek!

Don't know where you are located but for that price you also make a vacation nearby and try them yourself:
http://www.teuffel.com/english/sales/soundcheck.htm
http://www.teuffel.com/english/contact/contact.htm
The provided amps ain't shabby. wink
GovernorSilver
A truss rod was added to the Alpaca guitar design. This will probably delay production even more, but this will make it much more convenient to maintain.
GovernorSilver
The July 28 update announced a truss rod was added to the Alpaca guitar design. This will probably delay production even more, but this will make it much more convenient to maintain.
khakifridge
khakifridge wrote:
I quite hanker after one of Martin Petersen's Sei Originals. One day... Guitar


Small update. Spent four very enjoyable hours with Martin yesterday shooting the breeze, enjoying his Lebkuchen, and ogling lots of gorgeous woods. Put in an order. 8_)
khakifridge
Aaaaaaand... sixteen months later - I picked this up last week and gigged it at the weekend.



Well worth the wait. Now I just need another one. nanners
trickness
Since I originally posted above, I actually bought and sold two Teuffel Teslas. Very cool guitars, one was a Prodigy and the other a Trem version. Prodigy was pretty perfect but the Trem was unbalanced and kinda heavy because of the Steinberger setup. Ended up selling both because the ergos didn't work great for me, but I would love to get another sometime. They are very much their own thing.
Chrome Dinette
I played a Tesla for a couple of years. It sounded great and was comfortable to play, though mine was an older one and the headpiece was a drag. There was a fine line between not tightening the high e enough and the string slipping and over tightening, causing the string to break.
wyrtti
I'm in love with the idea of the NS/Stick. It's a bass, guitar and Stick, all in one!

NS/Stick
abandonist
I have a Oakland Axe Factory headless 8 string. Love it.
sonicwarrior
abandonist wrote:
I have a Oakland Axe Factory headless 8 string. Love it.

Cool! Which form?
Squattamolie
Bought new in 85 (or 86, it's getting fuzzy). Cold, dead hands. Sounds fantastic, tracks great, Type 1 transtrem works near perfect. I'll leave this one to my Son, even though I know he'll just sell it, because I couldn't bear to.

tim gueguen
Is it a factory GK equipped model? Can't be too many of those around. And what are you using synthwise with it?
Squattamolie
tim gueguen wrote:
Is it a factory GK equipped model? Can't be too many of those around. And what are you using synthwise with it?


Hi Tim, yeah the Roland is factory. Back in the mid 80s, a number of companies offered guitars with factory Roland electronics. I remember looking at a Stratus Graphite Strat that had the Roland stuff built in, and there were also some Gibsons, and others I think. The converter is a rack with no built in sounds, so I just trigger whatever. At the moment it is a DSS1, but I sometimes use a Matrix 1000, a D550 or MKS50 or 70.
abandonist
sonicwarrior wrote:
abandonist wrote:
I have a Oakland Axe Factory headless 8 string. Love it.

Cool! Which form?


Missed this. It was prototype Tom and I came up with for his multi scale work. The construction is meant to be as workmanlike as possible. One volume knob. Bamboo for light weight. Eye peg to hang it on a wall. The barest essentials.
sonicwarrior
Bamboo? eek!

Isn't that too prone to scratches and stuff?
Hermetech Mastering
sonicwarrior wrote:
Bamboo? eek!

Isn't that too prone to scratches and stuff?


abandonist wrote:
It was prototype Tom and I came up with... The construction is meant to be as workmanlike as possible... Bamboo for light weight... The barest essentials.
sonicwarrior
Hermetech Mastering wrote:
...

I read the posting. Don't know what you wanted to tell me.

Also doesn't look like bamboo.
abandonist
I'm not concerned with scratches. It's a players instrument.

I don't know what to tell you about it not looking like bamboo. It is.
sonicwarrior
Are we talking about the same thing?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bamboo

Hollow plants with not much wood on it?
GovernorSilver
Some bamboo guitars and bamboo Stick:

https://mwguitars.com.au/2013/08/13/a-bamboo-guitar-part-1-why-bamboo/

http://www.liceaguitars.com/guitars.htm

http://stick.com/instruments/bamboo/

Even Yamaha makes/has made a bamboo guitar:
http://usa.yamaha.com/products/musical-instruments/guitars-basses/ac-g uitars/fg/fgb1/

I like abandonist's bamboo guitar. I have never had a scratch-proof guitar - almost cried when I accidentally scratched my PRS CE Bolt-On, and the woods on that guitar are nowhere as hard as bamboo. I also like it when guitar makers experiment with less popular materials instead of making everything with the usual stuff.
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:
Are we talking about the same thing?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bamboo


Same article links to this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bamboo_musical_instruments

Excerpt:

Bamboo has also recently been used for the manufacture of guitars and ukuleles. Bamboo Ukuleles are constructed of solid cross laminated bamboo strips not plywood. The bamboo solid wood strips are similar to bamboo manufactured flooring. In addition to their strength, bamboo ukuleles have excellent sound & rival ukuleles made out of more traditional woods like Mahogany and Koa. Bamboo makes an excellent choice for an eco-friendly cost conscious ukulele aficionados.
sonicwarrior
Laminate! d'oh!

At first I mixed it up with balsa (very prone to scratches and dongs).
GovernorSilver
sonicwarrior wrote:
Laminate! d'oh!

At first I mixed it up with balsa (very prone to scratches and dongs).


Ah, that makes sense. Yep, that's a very different wood. hihi
moloque
Not guitar but here is 2 bass I build. Love the headless for the balance.

[/img]
moloque
This one didn't make it. Unfortunately the full ebony neck trough didn't accept my shaping skills... meh
https://www.instagram.com/p/3gaLuwyCTU/
The Grump
Hermetech Mastering wrote:
oozitron wrote:
David Fair is not your typical guitar player. We're distantly related, but are on different planets musically.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vD1Yx8z0BXs


Another David (close friend, not relative) makes beautiful custom bass guitars. His instruments (some headless) are beautiful and get high marks from reviews for their sound and feel. Check out the pictures:

http://www.kingbass.com/photo.html

Drew


DREW I LOVE YOU!!!

It was the David King bass! I want this one:

http://www.kingbass.com/bassdesc/leblanc.html



smile


David King A-Bass (edited). Rare, and though they look weird, they are ridiculously awesome to play, and of all of the basses I have ever tried the three David King basses all sit in my top ten to this day.
The Grump
My workhorse for years was one of these. Schack Carbon-V. Mine was serial #1042, stolen from me on Xmas Eve 2001 in Paris.



I love headless designs, and my next bass will probably be a headless. Maybe a David Kind, if I'm lucky.
Hermetech Mastering
It's David King, and it's an A bass. I still really want one! Maybe one day. Sorry your lovely bass was stolen in Paris :(
GovernorSilver
Strandberg Guitars is trying to make room for the 2017 models, by offering discounted prices on several current production models. The Specials page on their site has most of them, but there might be more hiding in the store.

I think all their guitars are headless.
wsy
And, if you have cousins who got married, there's headless Banjos:

www.tranjo.com

They're really quite nice; a friend had one and I tried it. I liked it a heck of a lot more than the Banjitar I had for a few months. P. O. J.

Someday maybe if I get bored with the synths I'll go for one... dark walnut, please.

- Bill
abandonist
GovernorSilver wrote:
Strandberg Guitars is trying to make room for the 2017 models, by offering discounted prices on several current production models. The Specials page on their site has most of them, but there might be more hiding in the store.

I think all their guitars are headless.


I was fortunate enough to lay hands on a Strandberg. Beautiful guitars. If someone's looking for a higher end headless, you could do far worse.
GovernorSilver
abandonist wrote:
GovernorSilver wrote:
Strandberg Guitars is trying to make room for the 2017 models, by offering discounted prices on several current production models. The Specials page on their site has most of them, but there might be more hiding in the store.

I think all their guitars are headless.


I was fortunate enough to lay hands on a Strandberg. Beautiful guitars. If someone's looking for a higher end headless, you could do far worse.


I ordered this one - that's why it's out of stock now. cool

https://strandbergguitars.com/product/os-7-lace-special-maple-blue-w16 05041/

There's some kind of bug between Chrome and their website. You might want to try a different browser if you decide to order.

I lack a fixed-bridge guitar in my collection. I'd been contemplating a D'Angelico EX-SS - a very different axe to be sure - but decided to go for the Strandberg when I saw the price. It should be more conducive to messing around with various tuning schemes too, with the carbon fiber fillets in the neck.
abandonist
I'm straight up jelly. love
GovernorSilver
I've had the Boden OS 7 Lace for a couple of weeks now. Random comments:

- Took no time at all to get used to the fanned frets. I hardly noticed they weren't in the normal alignment.

- The Endurneck is a great fit for my hands. By some reports it's not for everybody, but it works great for me. I'm a thumb-behind-neck type of player about 90% of the time.

- The neck, string spacing, etc. is equally comfortable for playing with a pick and fingerstyle stuff.

- The cutout next to the bridge is perfect for making the guitar sit on my thigh in near-vertical position, John Stowell style. In honor of the recently deceased Allan Holdsworth, I started learning his solo guitar arrangement of "House of Mirrors", which has some chord shapes that would require, ahem, creative placement of the wrists, forearms, etc. to nail. They're easier to play on this guitar, in the Stowell position.

- Action is higher than I thought it would be but hammer-ons/pulloffs do not seem to be affected.

My complaints are minor and should be easily fixed when I have the time - there's some fret buzz on the neck, near the 12th fret. I'm guessing a truss rod adjustment should get rid of that.
GovernorSilver
The Strandberg Salen line is out. I've been fascinated by the Salen models ever since they were announced. I'd also been wanting a Tele-style guitar.

https://strandbergguitars.com/product-category/production-model/salen/
Hermetech Mastering
I'm afraid to say I think they are the worst lines I've seen on a guitar for some time. Just utterly repulsive. IMO. hihi
Chrome Dinette
I like and own headless guitars. I also like and own tele style guitars, but I am not a fan at all of that tele-esque Strandberg. The random application of the tele/equire aesthetic to most other guitars is one of the things I hate the most about modern guitar manufacturing.

The most heinous subset of this is the affixation of the three saddle bridge to all manner of guitars where it looks out of place and offers no functional benefit.
GovernorSilver
Chrome Dinette wrote:
I like and own headless guitars. I also like and own tele style guitars, but I am not a fan at all of that tele-esque Strandberg. The random application of the tele/equire aesthetic to most other guitars is one of the things I hate the most about modern guitar manufacturing.

The most heinous subset of this is the affixation of the three saddle bridge to all manner of guitars where it looks out of place and offers no functional benefit.


Fair enough, but in case someone else reads your post and misunderstands, the Salens have individual saddles per string, not the old school triple saddle bridge.

It's kind of interesting that it's "ok" to make headless guitars that reference the Strat, as well as dual-HB guitars. Heck, Koll built a headless archtop guitar! If you make a headless that references the Tele, you've crossed the line! hihi Says a lot about the mystique of the Telecaster, that eclipses other iconic guitar models such as the Les Paul and Stratocaster.

I do respect your opinion, but I've seen similar reactions concerning the Tele-ness of this latest model. I imagine the reactions would have been more muted if the Suhr Tele-style pickups had been incorporated without other aspects of the classic Tele design. Just goes to show the kind of mystique built up around the Fender Telecaster over the decades.
Rex Coil 7
Wow ... totally diggin on them Strandberg "Teles" (the "fanned frets" are pretty cool too!) ... the headless design would fit in excellently with the chopped Tele I made from a stock Warmoth alder Telecaster ... I call it The Shredbilly ... it makes Telecaster purists light their hair on fire and shit bricks.

applause







Padouk 25.5" scale neck with a Strat head, stainless frets, macassar ebony fretboard, alder body, Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounder pickups with coil taps, all stainless hardware (neck plate, screws, string ferrules, string trees, control plate ... all from Calahamm). Planet Waves self trimming/locking tuners, chromed solid brass Gotoh bridge, "vintage Tele" pickguard, I wired it all up myself. Both the body and neck are unfinished, I just use furniture oil on it about twice per year. It's upper "chop" is shaped after the Gibson Explorer and Flying V ... due to a permanent neck injury I need to allow my right arm to lay against my torso when I play (otherwise I'm nearly crippled for a couple of weeks after playing for only an hour or so). The chop allows my arm to be in the right position. I traced a Dean ML (who's shape is a combination of a Flying V and an Explorer all in one) then applied the tracing to the Tele body, made my marks and took a jig saw to the body. I didn't own a router then, so I chucked up a router bit in one of my drill presses, set the table height properly and ran the body around the bit cutting a 1/2" radius on the freshly cut edges. All dunzies.



Next to go on it is a Stetsbar Pro II tremolo. Best no-cut/no-drill bolt-on trem on the market, bar none. Priced right as well, at $229 shipped.

I have always dreamed of making a double neck headless bass+guitar, with a small dinky body more or less shaped like the Steinberger "brooms", bolt on wooden necks, wooden body. Years ago that notion was a long money-wise reach away from actually getting it done, but today there are a lot more options when it comes to the headless bridge, as well as a few nice choices for "standard string adapters" on the nut-end of the instrument. Those permit the use of regular stings rather than the double ball types. The only thing I'd need help with from a luthier would be mounting the string adapter on a chopped neck. The plan was (still is? ... maybe?) to buy a Warmoth neck and cut the head off replacing it with the string adapter. Mount the bridge, bolt it all up and call it good.

So if I could locate a willing and able luthier that is capable of chopping the heads from the necks and mounting the string adapters, I may be able to pull off mounting the bridges myself. A headless double neck guitar/bass would be relatively short and light (compared to a headed guitar/bass double neck), and probably wouldn't ~feel~ much larger than a standard Jazz bass or Tele due to the small "Broom style body". Since the necks would just be retrofitted (as in "chopped") regular guitar and bass necks, cost would be fairly reasonable as well. Warmoth sells a double neck guitar/bass "blank" body that has already got the neck pockets and pickup routes done but is just a giant square slab that needs to be shaped into an instrument.

Current pricing for one in alder = $329.00 shaped like a P-bass/Strat abomination .... fetch me my chainsaw!

http://www.warmoth.com/Guitar/Bodies/DoubleNecks/DoublePrecisionStrat. aspx

A double neck guitar/bass "blank" is special order but only runs $150.00 in alder.

A guitar blank, pre-routed neck pocket and pickup routes is only $75.00 in alder.

So building a headless instrument is actually within reach for most people.

thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up
Chrome Dinette
GovernorSilver wrote:
Chrome Dinette wrote:
I like and own headless guitars. I also like and own tele style guitars, but I am not a fan at all of that tele-esque Strandberg. The random application of the tele/equire aesthetic to most other guitars is one of the things I hate the most about modern guitar manufacturing.

The most heinous subset of this is the affixation of the three saddle bridge to all manner of guitars where it looks out of place and offers no functional benefit.


Fair enough, but in case someone else reads your post and misunderstands, the Salens have individual saddles per string, not the old school triple saddle bridge.

It's kind of interesting that it's "ok" to make headless guitars that reference the Strat, as well as dual-HB guitars. Heck, Koll built a headless archtop guitar! If you make a headless that references the Tele, you've crossed the line! hihi Says a lot about the mystique of the Telecaster, that eclipses other iconic guitar models such as the Les Paul and Stratocaster.

I do respect your opinion, but I've seen similar reactions concerning the Tele-ness of this latest model. I imagine the reactions would have been more muted if the Suhr Tele-style pickups had been incorporated without other aspects of the classic Tele design. Just goes to show the kind of mystique built up around the Fender Telecaster over the decades.




I don't see it as crossing the line in any traditional sense, I just personally think the "tele aesthetic" is pretty unappealing outside of itself. I don't like it when builders try to glom it on to anything, headless or no.

I am not really any kind of a traditionalist, either.

It's just a matter of taste, though.

Yes, I didn't mean to imply that the guitar in question had a three saddle bridge. That was just an example of the random application of tele-dom that one sees a lot.




shorter version: I barely like the tele aesthetic as it is and don't think it's a good place to start on other guitars.
GovernorSilver
Chrome Dinette wrote:

I don't see it as crossing the line in any traditional sense, I just personally think the "tele aesthetic" is pretty unappealing outside of itself. I don't like it when builders try to glom it on to anything, headless or no.

I am not really any kind of a traditionalist, either.

It's just a matter of taste, though.

Yes, I didn't mean to imply that the guitar in question had a three saddle bridge. That was just an example of the random application of tele-dom that one sees a lot.




shorter version: I barely like the tele aesthetic as it is and don't think it's a good place to start on other guitars.


I'm not singling out your reaction in particular; but the negative commentary - fron other people, much more negative than your particular reaction - on this new Strandberg model is striking. They did a Strat-style model with little to no reaction. They have older models that only draw negative reaction just for being headless.

The Telecaster just has a mystique about it that seems to draw stronger emotional reactions when it's "messed with" by a guitar maker, than other iconic designs like the Strat and Les Paul.

If you look back on the thread, you'll see I have a Strandberg guitar myself. You'll also see that Strandberg has been making guitars before they introduced this "Tele" model and they still offer a selection of non-Tele style guitars on their website.
Rex Coil 7
I get a kick out of people that display moral outrage while looking down on others from the saddle of their very high horse. Anything from political issues to the modification of a guitar ... or even a modular synth. I've caught the sharp end of the stick for my modded Tele, as well as the way I have modded my Dot Com based modular.

Oh the sin of putting 1/2" diameter knobs on my repaneled modules ... and for the love of all that is good and moral, I violated the very spirit of the 5U modular when I put large chickenhead knobs on my VCOs ... this is six Dot Com modules put into one 6MU panel (I made two of these "voice modules") ... I think it created Solar flares which disrupted the global power grid and made the Earth stop rotating for several seconds with it's completion:



... "chickenheads? CHICKENHEADS? Oh the pain ..... THE PAIN!! What have you done? How can you look at yourself in the mirror every day? You're an evil racist! Only a white supremacist racist would do such a thing! You terrible terrible man".

(I've actually rec'd comments like that .. I shit you not ... here's some more .... )

"Not only have you cut that poor guitar's body, but you put a Strat head on a Telecaster neck! Did your mother drop you when you were a baby?"

meh HAAHAA! The outrage .. TEH OUTRAGE!!!! The sky is falling!!!! Run for your very lives! Go change your diapers already. They're clearly ready, since you're obviously so FULL OF SHIT that it's spewing from your mouth!

lol lol

Some folks take themselves too seriously. Life's far too short to worry about cutting a Telecaster up or using a certain type of knob on one's own synth.

Life's a comedy. thumbs up

Back to headless stuff ... check out this headless bass kit ...

LINK = https://www.amazon.com/Headless-Style-Guitar-Rosewood-SBBK-1/dp/B01IPP 19NS/ref=pd_sbs_267_1?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B01IPP19NS&pd_rd_r=54fe3e 5f-8ed0-11e8-a387-cb55ff1621b3&pd_rd_w=rGI9w&pd_rd_wg=0LAvl&pf_rd_i=de sktop-dp-sims&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=8702255303818932494&pf_rd_ r=2QNH9KN288QT0T2XGJ84&pf_rd_s=desktop-dp-sims&pf_rd_t=40701&psc=1&ref RID=2QNH9KN288QT0T2XGJ84

If only the body and neck work out and the rest of it turns out to be ~shit~ it would still be worth the $199.00 charged for it. Nice way to figure out if ~headless~ works for you or not. Y'know?

seriously, i just don't get it
locust_locust
I have a Forshage Orion.

GovernorSilver
Nice! I've been an admirer of Forshage's work for some time.
locust_locust
GovernorSilver wrote:
Nice! I've been an admirer of Forshage's work for some time.


Thank you- it is an excellent instrument.
Mine is semi-hollow with side ports.:

ShrutiSane
It is really adorable designs of guitars and some of them are made up of bamboo. Bamboo is the most traditional tree so get here the list of bamboo wholesale suppliers that having the best collection of bamboo products and furniture.
Rex Coil 7
locust_locust wrote:
I have a Forshage Orion.

Nice, but when you look at how far the knee-slot is towards the bridge when compared to the Strat it looks like your pick hand will be moved very much to the player's left since the entire instrument is shifted left when sitting to play. Look at where the bridge is located relative to the player's knee .. the bridge is nearly sitting over the player's leg.

Same with your fret hand, it will also be shifted to the player's left ... probably as much as when playing a bass with a 34 inch scale.

I am aware the shift is necessary to keep the instrument balanced when playing sitting down, since there's no weight from the headstock to counter by placing the guitar more to the player's right. But that doesn't change the fact that the entire instrument is shifted to the player's left, which may make some people feel like the instrument feels odd when sitting down. The Gibson SG is also like that to a lesser degree, and it's known to feel weird to some folks.

Just an observation. seriously, i just don't get it
locust_locust
Rex Coil 7 wrote:
locust_locust wrote:
I have a Forshage Orion.

Nice, but when you look at how far the knee-slot is towards the bridge when compared to the Strat it looks like your pick hand will be moved very much to the player's left since the entire instrument is shifted left when sitting to play. Look at where the bridge is located relative to the player's knee .. the bridge is nearly sitting over the player's leg.

Same with your fret hand, it will also be shifted to the player's left ... probably as much as when playing a bass with a 34 inch scale.

I am aware the shift is necessary to keep the instrument balanced when playing sitting down, since there's no weight from the headstock to counter by placing the guitar more to the player's right. But that doesn't change the fact that the entire instrument is shifted to the player's left, which may make some people feel like the instrument feels odd when sitting down. The Gibson SG is also like that to a lesser degree, and it's known to feel weird to some folks.

Just an observation. :despair:


It hasn't been an issue for me.

Actually the placement is perfect for seated or standing playing- that is literally the entire point of the design.

I bought this guitar when I was recovering from fretting hand surgery.
The design affords you to be able to play with a straight fretting wrist.
If you get a chance to play one you will see what I mean- it is hard to explain.
SlightlyNasty
Yeah, I thought the whole point of those style of bodies was to move the seated position closer to a classical position with a higher neck angle and less wrist contortions. Like how the Strandbergs have a dedicated leg cutout for classical seating.

I've almost pulled the trigger on an Ormsby Goliath 7-string so many times over the last couple of months. I like the idea of an extended-range instrument that doesn't require a hydraulic exoskeleton to perform bends on the high strings. Also something that doesn't cut off the blood supply to your leg in five minutes like my RG2228.
PapaLazarou
Dream guitar is a lucite Strandberg Dead Banana
Gaetan
I have a Steinberger spirit 5 strings bass that I bought in 2004. It won't blow your mind but it's a decent bass, it plays well and I like the small footprint.
locust_locust
SlightlyNasty wrote:
Yeah, I thought the whole point of those style of bodies was to move the seated position closer to a classical position with a higher neck angle and less wrist contortions. Like how the Strandbergs have a dedicated leg cutout for classical seating.

I've almost pulled the trigger on an Ormsby Goliath 7-string so many times over the last couple of months. I like the idea of an extended-range instrument that doesn't require a hydraulic exoskeleton to perform bends on the high strings. Also something that doesn't cut off the blood supply to your leg in five minutes like my RG2228.


Yes this is exactly the idea of them.

I've tried Strandbergs- I don't like the Endura neck profile but otherwise they are excellent designs.
My Forshage is a pretty different guitar- it is closer to an ES335 type tone, as it is semi-hollow.
PapaLazarou
Is that the point if the flying V as well? hihi
moloque
What about a double headless 6 string fanned fretless bass with a fanned fret guitar?

[/img]

hihi

I'd like to thank my daughter for letting me some of her glitter since I didn't have enough to finish oops
Hermetech Mastering
Why? zombie
moloque
Hermetech Mastering wrote:
Why? zombie



Why not? I'm playing bass and guitar in a new project. So since I build my own basses since many years, I though that would make sense....


Also I will never understand people who build their own guitar and end up only copying something that you can found everywhere from 100 different companies.
Thorsday
Moloque, that is a thing of beauty!

Ya! Kiesel Vader V8X

Picture file

Picture file
Jarno
Recently found out about Ormsby guitars:


Awesome headless guitars.
Really nice, I want to use a copper top with patina on my next bass build (not multiscale, not headless though).

woVERTICES
I LOVE my headless Klein AND my new eccentrically headed Klein!
Best,
John
www.johnjpotter.com
Flareless
I've got a Hohner B2A. Lots of fun to play but I'm a drummer so what the hell do I know anyway. Mostly I just count to 4 over and over again. Mr. Green

My B2A Bass
Inside the B2A
woVERTICES
An addition to my Kleins is the Sankey Destroyer...
John
www.johnjpotter.com

woVERTICES
Soon to be my newest headless from Michael Sankey...
Best,
John
Rex Coil 7
woVERTICES wrote:
Soon to be my newest headless from Michael Sankey...
Best,
John
I see you seem to have a preference for Lace pickups. I tried a set of those on one of my basses but wasn't able to make them work with the processing gear I use (amp, cab, pre-amps, EQs, compressors, and so on).

So I'm curious about your own bass rig. What has it taken to make those pickups work for you?

Thanks!
Hermetech Mastering
That looks great, does Sankey make basses too?
woVERTICES
I spoke to Michael in Brooklyn a week or so ago asking precisely that question. (My brother is a bass player) He said he'd be very happy to make a bass, and I, for one, would be very excited to see a Sankey bass!

Michael does incredible work; his instruments look beautiful and play with an ease that prompts better playing.

I would contact him via his website.

Best,
John
johnjpotter.com
Hermetech Mastering
Thanks John, I might just do that! I always fancied a David King headless bass, but think I prefer the look of the Sankeys overall.
woVERTICES
Rex Coil 7:
I don't have a bass so I wouldn't know...my Sankey Destroyer with ONE Lace pickup sounds fantastic though...
Best,
John
woVERTICES
Funny you should mention David King basses...my brother had this bass at one time...
Hermetech Mastering
Yeah, that's his A shape and the one I would probably go for!
Rex Coil 7
woVERTICES wrote:
Rex Coil 7:
I don't have a bass so I wouldn't know...my Sankey Destroyer with ONE Lace pickup sounds fantastic though...
Best,
John
.. woops ... lol oops
chlorinemist
Not a single strandberg posted here yet? These guys have basically taken the headless throne where Steinberger once reigned.



Hermetech Mastering
Totally different from Steinberger though, they are made from wood for a start! I'd say Modulus Graphite are much closer to Steinberger in philosophy, although they also use wood, and most aren't headless.

I keep going back and forth on something new, or just grab a second hand Steinberger L series, which I have wanted since the 80's...
chlorinemist
Yes they are wood, although they do have carbon fiber reinforced necks and super light weight design.

But I wasn't trying to say they are literally making steinbergers... I'm just saying they are first company since them to seriously popularize headless guitars in the mainstream with world class innovative instruments, and have a very similarly forward thinking approach to design with their fanned frets, patented ergonomic neck shapes, true temperament frets, hexaphonic instruments, 8/9/10+ string guitars, etc.
Rex Coil 7
woVERTICES wrote:
Funny you should mention David King basses...my brother had this bass at one time...
... absolutely sick. woah eek!



Want.



Wow!
shaft9000
Is tuning them up typically much slower than using a key-winder?

I'm occasionally tempted to get one for the travel convenience. There are soooo many to choose from these days, and it's awesome.
That you can now get a multiscale Strandberg(asian-built), or a custom-made USA Kiesel -multiscale in 7 or 8 string if you like - for around $1500 new is quite tempting.


...and then I think 'Yuck' the rest of the time. very frustrating
I carry the same ol' prejudice that most people do; that a headless guitar ~looks~ incomplete and aesthetically unbalanced. Whatever the actual truth is, is beside THAT point. It's all in the 'seeming'. I wouldn't take one on-stage unless the music warrants it.
I wouldn't hesitate to use one in studio, though. So long as it sounds right for the part, it is right.
woVERTICES
I play only headless guitars, a Klein and a Sankey ( with another headless Sankey on the way). I recently purchased a new Klein sTele which does have a headstock...I found it beautiful sounding but aesthetically and quite literally unbalanced after years of only headless playing(I also had a great Teuffel Tesla at one time).

After Firebirds, Jazzmasters, Telecasters, Rick Turners and more, all wonderful, I have been seduced by the ergonomics, weight, balance and sound of quality headless guitars in spite of slower than key-winder tuning....seems a small price to pay to play!
Best...John

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