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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

More photoshopped vapourware "Cybernetics" expande
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules  
Author More photoshopped vapourware "Cybernetics" expande
grantrichter
Who would want one of these?

If so, tell Josh.

Probably a one time buy, built to order only.
AntManBee
I wish I was clever enough to work out what it is, which probably means I don't need one.
dude
wow is this the fabled noisering expander?
lukas412
Gotta have this.
HueMonContact
I will absolutely buy one!!!
rico loverde
seriously awesome. just made my day to wake up and see this.
fac
Whatever it does, I would buy one.
mono-poly
Can i have 2?
essex sound lab
Every time I think that I can get along without a Euro sidecar...
sundog
This reminds me of a dream I once had. woah

Count me in...
z3r01
MY ASS IS BLEEDING

Count me in! My Noisering needs a friend. thumbs up
Tombola
Grant - this looks awesome? Could this be along the lines of some of the DIY things we've been discussing over in this thread: https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=51861

8/16 step sequences, at least?

Is the bar/dot using a LM3916 to do CV switching of steps?
AntManBee
Is anyone going to say with confidence & authority what it is, or does no one who has posted in response to Maestro Richter's original post want to admit that they have no idea?
justin3am
I'm also fairly certain that this is an expander for the Noisering. At least I can't imagine what else it would be. Count me interested anyway.
Gripp
z3r01 wrote:
MY ASS IS BLEEDING

Count me in! My Noisering needs a friend. thumbs up


+1!
Ankh
Yes.
revmutt
Umm... 2 for me.
I won't even bother asking about frac. Just happy to see it.
Yeah, kind of a dream com true
revmutt
So excited I made my first double post. Wow
norbert smith
yeah baby

but seriously WTF is this help
infradead
holy fucking awesome!!

DO WANT

grant explains it more in the noisering thread
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9927&postdays=0&post order=asc&start=220
norbert smith
ooooh w00t w00t gimme one man

and more walekko plz....
z3r01
I remembered seeing Mr Richter post this in the Noisering thread, in response to someone's question about the Noisering expander, sometime in June 2010:

Mike Murphy is working on this on with me. I should be getting a CD of .wav samples of all the different cybernetic algorithms Mike has been testing with the prototype of the expander. But we have a working prototype! Considering the complexity, that was darn fast! Thanks Mike!

Now it is a case of selecting the most interesting algorithms and designing the voltage selection and variation hardware.


Edit: Oh yeah, and the recent post which infradead mentioned. thumbs up
AntManBee
From the other thread:
grantrichter wrote:
"I do have the 'Cybernetics' expander for the Noisering prototyped. It never occurred to anybody that the three pin connector on the back was for an expander. Hope you didn't goop yours up with solder. The "Cybernetics" expander adds the stuff from the 266 that I originally left out. Anyway, the expander adds variable psuedo-random microsequences, big and little endian individual bit switching, random gate and trigger and a chromatic quantized output."

In that case I'd love one to go with my Noisering.
artisokka
Count me in! hyper

...though my noisering has not even arrived yet...
kuxaan-sum
WANT!!!

applause
nrdvrgr
I dont get it, but I'm in...
nrdvrgr
I dont get it, but I'm in...
Malekko
Contrary to the lovely Mr. Richters post you DON'T need to email me (thanks Grant) in fact you need to email HIM grantrichardrichter@gmail.com and ask when he is going to mail the schematics to me!
w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t
dude
Malekko wrote:
Contrary to the lovely Mr. Richters post you DON'T need to email me (thanks Grant) in fact you need to email HIM grantrichardrichter@gmail.com and ask when he is going to mail the schematics to me!
w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t


lol, i figured that might be the case. hihi
de_raaf
better get a noisering soon, been too long on my list to get
mono-poly
Rockin' Banana!
mckenic
I certainly see a Noisering in my future... Ive known for some time tht I was going to have to get one. This would push me over the edge and MAKE me get one immediately!
suboptimal
Here's what Grant posted in the NR thread:

grantrichter wrote:
I do have the "Cybernetics" expander for the Noisering prototyped. It never occurred to anybody that the three pin connector on the back was for an expander. Hope you didn't goop yours up with solder.

The "Cybernetics" expander adds the stuff from the 266 that I originally left out. Anyway, the expander adds variable psuedo-random microsequences, big and little endian individual bit switching, random gate and trigger and a chromatic quantized output.


The NR is magnifique. I'd probably get one of these. Would need to really contemplate the space issues it would present me with, though.

Edit: I see my helpful post was preempted. hihi
Matos
Ha! I don't even have a noise ring yet, but I'd buy it!
reignbear
yes! SlayerBadger!
fluxmonkey
i would be wanting one; two if that 3pin connector is on my frac NR...

b
science
I'd buy one.
RomuloCesar
sure I will get one! maybe 2 ....
when production starts ? how much is it going to be?
Wiard
pulse_divider
I'm in for 2!
VomitFlowers
Sign me up for one at least!
richard
well eek! now I'm wishing I hadn't sold my Noise Ring aren't I?
amnesia
Yep I will grab one for my NR

Do we need to email Josh still?
infradead
richard wrote:
well eek! now I'm wishing I hadn't sold my Noise Ring aren't I?


there is only one acceptable choice at this point

buy two more
infradead
amnesia wrote:
Yep I will grab one for my NR

Do we need to email Josh still?


hourly is what we decided on IRC
Kent
I love how a price hasn't been mentioned and everyone's boners have already come out.
infradead
Kent wrote:
I love how a price hasn't been mentioned and everyone's boners have already come out.


i will go to the plasma bank and sell my plasma for money for this.

hell i will go there and sell yours for this.
obscurerobot
I want at least one. Two if it is a special order only item.
Nuuj
I'd get one and finally get that Noisering that I've been delaying getting.
Fidgit
yes, please thumbs up
Norman_Phay
I wonder if it will be possible to run this on 15V. I like the look of it but don't fancy buying NR number 2 when i already have a 1200 series one.
Ekofisk
Norman_Phay wrote:
I wonder if it will be possible to run this on 15V. I like the look of it but don't fancy buying NR number 2 when i already have a 1200 series one.


Or fit this and a NR behind a 300 panel. thumbs up

Yeah, do I need to email someone to get in on this?
dan_k
[quote="Ekofisk]
Yeah, do I need to email someone to get in on this?[/quote]

Same, Grant / Josh you guys checking these, or do do you want a separate mail?

count me in!
target_destroyed
Nuuj wrote:
I'd get one and finally get that Noisering that I've been delaying getting.

Seconded.

Wiard nanners Wiard
Fnord
I've got a frac noisering and a mutant noisering converted to modcan A. I might need 2, and a euro noisering. Doh!

Who do I email?
J3RK
Well, since I don't currently have a Noisering (shame on me) this would get me to buy both! (again... for the NR. I've owned six of them so far.)
toppobrillo
i want one, love my noisering!.. "endian" hihi
Monobass
I'd buy that for a dollar.

or maybe 2 x
numan7
2 for me, please!

cheers
Hainbach
Bad photoshop. I have looked at pixels and some shops and its wrong.

If it were true, it would be better called Prometheus. He who stole the Fire from The Gods.
chvad
I am definately in for one!!
exper
Count me down for one as well! Anything to make my noisering even better is great indeed.


Please Grant/Josh, make this happen!
Slabwax
Yes Yes I want one.





Dean
vav
I'm down for one, absolutely.
miditerranean
Yes, please!
VortexRanger
Count me in!
Human Koala
same here SlayerBadger!
hpsounds
we're not worthy we're not worthy we're not worthy love love love hyper hyper hyper

Hédi K.
bunkdata
Yes please! Guinness ftw!
blz
count me in as well sir
Cybananna
want one, but estimated price is?
Hainbach
Waking up today and revisiting this thread with a clear head, I can only add to the choir of: I want one!
Waz
how much?
MisterBrown
Bring it on! I'm in!
norbert smith
isn't it clear ?

make this happen go go go w00t
yghartsyrt
YesYesYesYes. I definitely want one
rechner7
love entropy
Spandex
I need this and will pay money for it.
e-grad
revmutt wrote:
I won't even bother asking about frac.


cry

Frac would be hyper
Drumdrumdrumdrum
I thought this was some kind of sick joke? So when do we really see it......and a Megawave and Malphonic too?

Mal and Meg hihi
Norman_Phay
e-grad wrote:
revmutt wrote:
I won't even bother asking about frac.


cry

Frac would be hyper


I will ask about frac. I want one of these. In frac, to go with my existing frac noise ring. Is this possible/feasible? I would actually pay for a run of 10 x schaeffer panels for these if it would make this possible.
e-grad
Now that sounds great.

I've no Euro NR to team up with Cybernatics anyway.
mark_snipz
Me please
berfmurret
build it and i will come! love
jeannot
Quote:
big and little endian individual bit switching


Quote:
chromatic quantized output


So great to see those expansion headers finally being used!

We need 2 down here in ATX!
zeroseven
SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger!
el clon
ok people, let's get organized.... Soapbox

it seems that there are enough of us here to ask for a Frac run, right?

"we want Frac! we want Frac! we want Frac!"


I agree!
wwall
el clon wrote:

it seems that there are enough of us here to ask for a Frac run, right?

"we want Frac! we want Frac! we want Frac!"


I agree!


I'll add my voice to the frac chorus!
Of course, I probably need a euro Noisering and expander, too.
Fnord
I'd like to join the chorus.
el clon
power to the people!
wavehead
As soon as it is made clear what one needs to do in order to get this I will definitely be buying at least 1.

If josh has no schems then I'm guessing this is still a while off.
newgreyarea
My Noisering is the only module that has never been on the chopping block. If this is gonna make it more awesome, then I will definitely get one.

-b
davidh
woah make it, i'm in
grantrichter
OK, ever since we figured out that ONLY Hinton Instruments make trimmable Euro-rack power supplies, I have designed the power supply out of the circuit.

The JAG and XMIX should not behave any different on +/- 15 volts than they do on +/- 12 volts. The additional heat disapation from the added (15-12) 3 volts might cause the 7805 on the Megawave to go into thermal shutdown, but other than that, all designs after the JAG are supply independent.

I haven't tested it, do so at your own risk, but there in no reason from a circuitry standpoint why they should not work perfectly on a Blacet supply.

And so will be the "Cybernetics" module. Joshed changed the connector on the Euro-rack version of the Noisering, but the expander module will have both power connectors on it and work with either the Frac version or the Euro version. Power comes through the signal cable, it will plug and play with either the Frac or the Euro version with just the proper jumper cable. On the Frac version it is a 16 pin DIP.

If someone wants to reverse engineer a Front Panel Express panel, then you can even have it in black. The 1200 series has been gone since 2008 when my back blew out. But thank you for buying them back then. I am really burnt out on talking about the color of faceplates. The synthesizer is BEHIND the panel, please enough already.

Cthulhu
el clon
this is good news! w00t
i don't care about the faceplate either, i just want it to fit in a Frac-rack + work w/the old NR.
Entrainer
I want 1 please. In Euro.
mono-poly
Grant any news on the anti envelope?
Entrainer
mono-poly wrote:
Grant any news on the anti envelope?


did you see the video?
Paranormal Patroler
Wow, now I need to buy a NR and this.
mono-poly
Entrainer wrote:
mono-poly wrote:
Grant any news on the anti envelope?


did you see the video?


No
Entrainer
mono-poly wrote:


No


https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7736&start=220

check Feb 11th, Grant Richter near the middle of the page.
chocolatyshatner
I will definitely buy one!! So much dancing bacon It's motherfucking bacon yo It's motherfucking bacon yo It's motherfucking bacon yo It's motherfucking bacon yo It's motherfucking bacon yo It's motherfucking bacon yo
el clon
as a Frac guy, i admit to a bit of hesitancy toward hitting the dancing bacon button... after some thought, i've decided i don't want to be the first Frac user to test Grant's notion that they should, theoretically, work on Blacet power supplies. am i overreacting? any other Frac users willing to try it?
i don't have the slightest bit of knowledge regarding electronics, so maybe i'm not understanding completely, but when he says "do so at your own risk" it's not exactly an endorsement.
plord
I have been too busy selling things to notice this thread until now.

DO WANT. YOUR ENTROPIES, GIVE ME THEM.
fluxmonkey
send me one, i'll beta test...


el clon wrote:
as a Frac guy, i admit to a bit of hesitancy toward hitting the dancing bacon button... after some thought, i've decided i don't want to be the first Frac user to test Grant's notion that they should, theoretically, work on Blacet power supplies. am i overreacting? any other Frac users willing to try it?
i don't have the slightest bit of knowledge regarding electronics, so maybe i'm not understanding completely, but when he says "do so at your own risk" it's not exactly an endorsement.
el clon
fluxmonkey wrote:
send me one, i'll beta test...


el clon wrote:
as a Frac guy, i admit to a bit of hesitancy toward hitting the dancing bacon button... after some thought, i've decided i don't want to be the first Frac user to test Grant's notion that they should, theoretically, work on Blacet power supplies. am i overreacting? any other Frac users willing to try it?
i don't have the slightest bit of knowledge regarding electronics, so maybe i'm not understanding completely, but when he says "do so at your own risk" it's not exactly an endorsement.


good idea. get Malekko to send you one and have a look.... hihi
rezzn8r
I would be interested in a frac version of this, too, and would be in for a group buy on panels
It's motherfucking bacon yo
solitaryzen
I would also love a frac version...
Mood Organ
Frac yes. Times two. Group panel buy yes.

Although every day that goes by without a solution to "no clock-in for Frac NR" is like a searing hot dagger in my brain.
3vcos
Grant,

Why no Integrator? I'd like my noisering to wiggle. :-)
grantrichter
AntManBee wrote:
Is anyone going to say with confidence & authority what it is, or does no one who has posted in response to Maestro Richter's original post want to admit that they have no idea?


What calling it a "Cybernetics" module with an "entropy" control isn't self-explanatory?

OK, ya got me.

Why is it and what?

First, yes it is the expander module for the Noisering.

The reason it exists is because I figured out another algorithm that can run on the same set of hardware. The mathematics of information theory as applied to music predict that it is possible that some portions of this new algorithm MAY have musical usefulness.

That is all we had to go on the first time, so what the heck.

Our story begins with the "Quantized Random Voltages" section of the Buchla Model 266.

http://www.musicsynthesizer.com/Buchla/source_of_uncertainty.htm

It was absolutely essential that the Noisering NOT be a 266, because Mr. Buchla had done that already, so repeating his work would not advance the state of the art.

I did however incorporate the 2^N and N+1 output structure. But there is no psuedo-random sequence generator (PRSG) in the Noise Ring currently.

A PRSG is one kind of way to control the contents of a shift register. And if you grew up on Don Lancaster, only a maximal length PRSG is desirable.

Then I find a paper by Ralph Burnams "Harmonic Content of Sub-Optimal Psuedo Random Generator Sequences". And it turns out that that the original CD4006 implementation of an optimal PRSR is only one of a spectrum of solutions, each of which has a unique audio harmonic signature.

So there is one way to spice up Mr. Buchla's original algorithm, add voltage selectable sub-optimal sequence control. So the length control selects sequences of 15,31,63,127,255 under voltage control. They values are shown on LEDs. Don't worry, beat one of the repeat is at 16, 32 etc.

In beta testing the good Dr. Mabuse (aka Mike Murphy) detected that any static sequence sounds, well, static. HOWEVER by dynamically modulating the count length, you got an effect at some settings, that were musical "keepers". That is a good enough recommend to me that I am willing to go ahead with the rest of it. "Sometimes the Universe gives you clues about your destiny, you should listen"- George Clooney

OK, so we have something new for sequence control and animation in the audio domain, what about as a controller?

The "quantization" knob on the 266 is just Shannon's Measure of Information Entropy. Which is just "how many levels in the signal, expessed in bits, dude".

Now if we make each level be the 1 volt per octave voltage of a semi-tone, we have a musically quantized output. But if we copy the 266 design exactly, then we can only control the entropy from big to small. What if we want to control it from small to big, like an expanding range of semi-tones.

So we need an "Endian" control. Technically that is the term for the order of bits. Microsoft being the reverse of MACs (of course).

The "Gate" and "Trigger" circuits came from "Musical Applications of Microprocessors" by Hal Chamberlain.

Here's a block diagram, the bar/dot switch was a dud and has been dropped.

Cthulhu
keetz
Mmm, endianness in a quasi-musical context MY ASS IS BLEEDING

So Mr. Richter, what needs to happen to get this expander in my grubby paws?

You mentioned this would likely be a small batch / custom order?
exper
Seriously, this needs to happen. I can't imagine that this needs to be a small run though, everyone that loves their NR will most likely get this.
lombrose
I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want I want !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SlayerBadger! screaming goo yo w00t
el clon
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?
Entrainer
el clon wrote:
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?


The man said he officially quit Frac production. I take that as a "no".
Now, it could/should work, but he's already said "at your own risk".
Both of these are in this thread I believe.
Veqtor
HELL YES! WANT! I've been dreaming about this device, seriously!
el clon
Entrainer wrote:
el clon wrote:
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?


The man said he officially quit Frac production. I take that as a "no".
Now, it could/should work, but he's already said "at your own risk".
Both of these are in this thread I believe.


awesome. thanks for yr help.
rico loverde
el clon wrote:
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?
just sell the frac noisering and get a god damn euro, problem solved. hihi email me if you need any more words of wisdom... It's peanut butter jelly time! It's motherfucking bacon yo
Mood Organ
d'oh!
el clon
rico loverde wrote:
el clon wrote:
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?
just sell the frac noisering and get a god damn euro, problem solved. hihi email me if you need any more words of wisdom... It's peanut butter jelly time! It's motherfucking bacon yo


but but butbut but.... waah
maybe yr right though. no use getting hung up on it just cuz it's Frac.

sorry Frac guys, i'm changing teams.
rico loverde
rico loverde wrote:
el clon wrote:
i hate to be a hard-on about this, but..... does it or does it not work on a Blacet power supply? officially?
just sell the frac noisering and get a god damn euro, problem solved. hihi email me if you need any more words of wisdom... It's peanut butter jelly time! It's motherfucking bacon yo
disclaimer: before anyone jumps off the handle and thinks im being a dick, im good friends with el clon and just giving him a bit of shit
norbert smith
and the story of malekko is not finished,... new modules continue arriving Guinness ftw!
numan7
:shark: CYBERNETICS (just when you thought it was safe to back in the modular) !!

cheers
oversee
If Cybernetics is a small/pre-order run, please count me in, but please also give some notice, otherwise I may have blown my module money when it goes up waah I'd put off my JAG purchase to get this first.

Can't wait to pair this with my Noisering.

Would the quantized output on Cybernetics be suitable for the Xmix between the un-quantized and quantized outs of a Noisering trick you mentioned elsewhere Grant?
sgnhh
what is the size of the proposed expansion? same as current noisering?
selfoscillate
hell yeah, i want one of these.
jln
Wow ! I'll definitely add this to my order list !
noisefor
Will buy!
indexofmetals
I'm not a euro man but I do love my noise ring in frac and this would be enough to make me purchase a euro one and this expander
telegasm
Will definitely buy!
zvukoprocessor
yep, will buy one too
negativspace
Noisering coming; expander welcomed. It's motherfucking bacon yo
RichyHo
Want 1. Euro. Thanks.
grantrichter
I shipped the final Rev. of the Megawave last night AND the schematics for the CYBERNETICS expander module. It has connectors for either Frac or Euro style expander ports. It will run on either +/- 12 volts or +/-15 volts identically. It gets power from the signal cable so you don't need a power cable.

For example, I used a 4013 dual flip-flop for the Gate and a 555 for the 1 millisecond trigger. There is a 1K in series, and then a 10 volt zener to ground. So the output level will be +10 volts if the chips are powered from 12 or from 15.

All of the Malekko modules except the Envelator will fit into a Balcet Frac rack. All connectors and electrical signal levels are compatible between Blacet and all Wiard/Malekko modules. Except power connectors and 12 vs. 15.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.

For mounting them I suggest double sided self adhesive Velcro tape. No sense putting holes in those beautiful Blacet racks. The bumper of my car is held on with Velcro. Detroit engineering! Naptha takes the goo off.

Cthulhu
el clon
grantrichter wrote:
It will run on either +/- 12 volts or +/-15 volts identically. It gets power from the signal cable so you don't need a power cable.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! applause applause applause applause applause It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time!

i love you, Grant.
solitaryzen
el clon wrote:
grantrichter wrote:
It will run on either +/- 12 volts or +/-15 volts identically. It gets power from the signal cable so you don't need a power cable.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! applause applause applause applause applause It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time!

i love you, Grant.


Yay, thanks Grant!! Not feeling quite so out in the cold now It's peanut butter jelly time!
rico loverde
el clon wrote:
grantrichter wrote:
It will run on either +/- 12 volts or +/-15 volts identically. It gets power from the signal cable so you don't need a power cable.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t w00t screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! applause applause applause applause applause It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time! It's peanut butter jelly time!

i love you, Grant.
el clone is a happy little bunny now!
el clon
It's motherfucking bacon yo Rockin' Banana! It's peanut butter jelly time!
J3RK
Nice move Grant! Makes me wish I had my old Frac system! w00t Definitely want one of these when they materialize! (Euro version.)
Norman_Phay
grantrichter wrote:
I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


I appreciate you taking the time to do this very much. It is nice to come in from the cold, as the other guy said, it has been quite an alienating feeling over the last couple of years.

As I'm planning on repanelling the modules I'll be buying, I'd appreciate some guidance on what you'd be OK w me putting on the panel w/r/2 brand names and the like if you have time?

Thanks again anyway.
grantrichter
Good to hear from you Norman. There is a chance I may be in Bath in August. If so, I will buy you some Six X at the Pub.

I love the music I have heard of yours. You can do anything you want about the panels. You are one of the people that I feel proud to have as a customer!

I am proud of ALL my customers, but I really like it when they send me music to enjoy! Like Norman has.

I am sorry that we got out of touch, things have been hectic trying to survive without being able to do bench work.

All the best!

Cthulhu

Norman_Phay wrote:
grantrichter wrote:
I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


I appreciate you taking the time to do this very much. It is nice to come in from the cold, as the other guy said, it has been quite an alienating feeling over the last couple of years.

As I'm planning on repanelling the modules I'll be buying, I'd appreciate some guidance on what you'd be OK w me putting on the panel w/r/2 brand names and the like if you have time?

Thanks again anyway.
grantrichter
Yes, that should work perfectly. The 1 and 2 outputs remain active, whichever algorithm is being used to set their value.

With the expander switch in either 8 or 16 position, the Noise Ring will work as it does now with the addition of the quantized output and gate, trigger and EXOR. But the "Length" control will only affect the EXOR output.

With the expander switch in the center position, the "Change" control will become inactive, and the "Length" control will vary the tones. The "Chance" control now becomes a probability control for the "Gate" and "Trigger" outputs.

Cthulhu


oversee wrote:
If Cybernetics is a small/pre-order run, please count me in, but please also give some notice, otherwise I may have blown my module money when it goes up waah I'd put off my JAG purchase to get this first.

Can't wait to pair this with my Noisering.

Would the quantized output on Cybernetics be suitable for the Xmix between the un-quantized and quantized outs of a Noisering trick you mentioned elsewhere Grant?
Monobass
really excited about this expansion.. the Noisering is beguiling and awesome already....
Mood Organ
grantrichter wrote:
I shipped the final Rev. of the Megawave last night AND the schematics for the CYBERNETICS expander module...

All of the Malekko modules except the Envelator will fit into a Balcet Frac rack. All connectors and electrical signal levels are compatible between Blacet and all Wiard/Malekko modules. Except power connectors and 12 vs. 15.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


jawdrop

New shit has come to light!!!

Many thanks for this, Grant!
gwaidan
In for 1 Euro...
rezzn8r
Mood Organ wrote:
grantrichter wrote:
I shipped the final Rev. of the Megawave last night AND the schematics for the CYBERNETICS expander module...

All of the Malekko modules except the Envelator will fit into a Balcet Frac rack. All connectors and electrical signal levels are compatible between Blacet and all Wiard/Malekko modules. Except power connectors and 12 vs. 15.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


jawdrop

New shit has come to light!!!

Many thanks for this, Grant!


+1 we're not worthy

Any chance Josh might offer these as kits sans Euro panel for those of us who want to mount it in a frac rack?
el clon
and are people still up for a group buy of Frac panels?
revmutt
grantrichter wrote:

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.
Cthulhu


That's swell. If it's long enough they can be racked on above the other in appropriate vector rails. Frac on top Euro on bottom or whatever works.
mamonu
would love one.....
Entrainer
because XS is best

idea:

possible to split 1NR to 2 xpanders?
Mood Organ
Entrainer wrote:
possible to split 1NR to 2 xpanders?


I like the way you think.
slow_riot
I'm interested in this module. Most likely will try to fit it into a Blacet rack.

Mike Murphy plus Grant Richter plus uncertainty = something
Nuuj
Just bought a Noisering.
VortexRanger
Me too.
noisefor
grantrichter wrote:
It will run on either +/- 12 volts or +/-15 volts identically. It gets power from the signal cable so you don't need a power cable.

I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


Man, this is all such great news! I have a 6U Monorocket that I am quickly running out of room on in tandem with a 12U Frac setup. I have ~3U of Frac open, and am deeply in LOVE with all my WIARD mods - MiniWave, Noisering and Borg II - can't wait for Megawave, etc., Anti-Osc next... Stoked to soon be able to mix and match Malekko/WIARD with Frac w/o having to always separate my MOST useful circuits.
Votek_Mendo
I want one for sure!
Lakbra
Count me in!!! MY ASS IS BLEEDING
richard
velcro thumbs up
Nuuj
Off topic, but it appears that human memory is also subject to entropy: http://www.wired.com/magazine/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/all/1
indexofmetals
Norman_Phay wrote:
grantrichter wrote:
I am going to make a tiny +/-15 Blacet power connector to +/-12 volt Euro connector PCB so Frac guys can join the fun. I will make the power cable issue disappear.


I appreciate you taking the time to do this very much. It is nice to come in from the cold, as the other guy said, it has been quite an alienating feeling over the last couple of years.

As I'm planning on repanelling the modules I'll be buying, I'd appreciate some guidance on what you'd be OK w me putting on the panel w/r/2 brand names and the like if you have time?

Thanks again anyway.


Norman, if you're going to do this, I love one with bananas to go with my other wiard frac banana modules. I'll send you an email.
slangking
Have a Euro NR coming soon, I would definitely get one of these!
lombrose
Up hihi
mudlogger
Would buy this in a heartbeat - the noisering is central to my euro setup
VortexRanger
hyper hyper hyper

After a few days with my Noisering I finally have a good grip on what it is doing... and I can't wait to make it do even more!!!
Bendu
How many people have to want this before it becomes a regular Wiard/Malekko product?

I want one so add my name to the list if it exists.

Thanks.
jln
VortexRanger wrote:
hyper hyper hyper

After a few days with my Noisering I finally have a good grip on what it is doing... and I can't wait to make it do even more!!!


Yes, same here. I am much more than very likely to buy this expansion module.
MindSnared
Yeah! Another reason to lust for a Noisering!
Jason Brock
This would make me buy a Noisering. I've been close to buying one before, but this would push me over the edge.
dude
i'm thinking of expanding my case pretty much just for this. is it going to exist? or are we still flirting?
infradead
after a year w/ my noisering it still confounds me and i want this. hihi

VortexRanger wrote:
hyper hyper hyper

After a few days with my Noisering I finally have a good grip on what it is doing... and I can't wait to make it do even more!!!
theparegorickid
+1. No brainer
elektrokick
Jason Brock wrote:
This would make me buy a Noisering.


+1, and I don't even own a modular yet help

Pascal
+1
suboptimal
The more I look at this the more I lust for it. I've gone so far as to clear out space in my case for it. That's super srs.
Spandex
How do we make it happen quicker? Should I cry? Or make someone a sandwich?
dude
is it clear yet whether this will be released as a normal product? clearly there is enough interest for at least and initial run?
Major Nelson
I recently got a Noise Ring, and it has really opened up my modular. I'd love to have one of these.
chvad
still wanting one of these for sure.
fac
dude wrote:
is it clear yet whether this will be released as a normal product? clearly there is enough interest for at least and initial run?


From Mr. Richter's facebook:

Quote:
By end of 2012 or sooner. Have three more modules in the works.
exper
Sounds great, can't wait to see his other designs. I avtually traded my Noisering for now, got a little sick of it having a "sound" in every patch I use it in. I definitely will buy one again though when this comes out. I wonder what else he's planning?

Megawave and Anti-Envelope and ???
lx
I'm in for one, as well as a Frac panel group buy.
J1m
hyper

oh my. yes.
Kendall Station
I hope this happens.....weee!
ThinLazy
please count me in for one too.
Orbless
I would buy one as well
Guinness ftw!
laserpalace
Add me to that list of people who would love this. MY ASS IS BLEEDING
Drumdrumdrumdrum
That's almost the first run of 200 accounted for. I can't wait for this one! razz
artisokka
Add me to the list!
Lockheed
Just got my Noisering (finally!), now waiting for this applause
melodydad
I have cash waiting thumbs up - no rack space but something would have to go for this!
Entrainer
HEAD OF THE LINE!

I love all things Malekko/Wiard but now I do have some
alternatives in the realm of sequencing and wave tables...
and even digital oscillators.

But this module, this is a must-have.
pas
please say this is happening soonish
amalthea
I just recently got an NR (loving it), and I would definitely want to get this to go along with it.
Pascal
any news on this?
Entrainer
I think it's time to start emailing Grant and requesting he send those
schematics to Josh. hihi

Out of curiosity, I wonder what the best-selling Wiard/Malekko module is.
My money is on either NoiseRing or Borg2.

(which came from pondering whether the Cybernetics module would
be a worthwhile investment, but I think this thread shows significant
interest)
numan7
Entrainer wrote:
I think it's time to start emailing Grant and requesting he send those
schematics to Josh. hihi

Out of curiosity, I wonder what the best-selling Wiard/Malekko module is.
My money is on either NoiseRing or Borg2.

(which came from pondering whether the Cybernetics module would
be a worthwhile investment, but I think this thread shows significant
interest)


Wiard yes, entrainer, i think its time to start emailing grant! :iagree:

hmmm..... i'm guessing there are more Envelators out there in the world... Wiard

cheers
pas
Entrainer wrote:
I think it's time to start emailing Grant and requesting he send those
schematics to Josh. hihi


who wants to be the pest? it's for a good cause!

i want this thing so badly, i hope this comes out before any other wiard modules from malekko, q-asr right behind it.
Entrainer
causticlogic
I don't know what it does, but if it's Malekko/Wiard, I would seriously buy 2.
Reptil
One for me please? thumbs up
decaying.sine
I'll take one too.
dephonator
I want one. Where is the preorder page:)
Oldstench
Do want.
Oldstench
e: 2 replies WTF?
supersuper
yes preorder page kudasai!!!!!
Reptil
c'mon guys applause sort it out
there's a DEMAND for this, right now. SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger!

don't let this become another anti-envelope, please?
I know pushing manufacturers isn't cool, but at least you got some feedback on how your potential clientele is feeling: I'm losing faith. waah
rasseru
Im after a Noisering and would definitely buy this straightaway
suboptimal
Confirming that I would buy at least one, but probably two of these (two now that I'm back to having two noise rings, a pairing I never should've given up to begin with).
pas
Bite!
revmutt
I have a feeling that producing a product, especially one where the designer and manufacturer and not in the same location poses a more complex set of issues then simply snapping ones fingers.

People are also assuming that this should take priority above the meat and potatoes of Josh's business.

I want this thing as much or more then the next guy but even under the best of circumstances this isn't going to get released by whining.
pas
just want'd to bump the thread, see what's up

Dinner at the Y
mattysal
Just read through this entire thread...

i want in
anarchy4bits
I want one. Please.
Hainbach
I must have posted my interest here before, but I want one, too.
ignatius
Hainbach wrote:
I must have posted my interest here before, but I want one, too.


ditto!

i love my noisering more and more and if it had a close friend.. well, the world would be a little better
thetwlo
i want one, perhaps two, and the Anti-Env! ...and the Mega-Wave!
sunnyb
also want!
suboptimal
It's time to begin the

eyes...

campaign.
yghartsyrt
ignatius wrote:
Hainbach wrote:
I must have posted my interest here before, but I want one, too.


ditto!

i love my noisering more and more and if it had a close friend.. well, the world would be a little better


same here.
Waz
Still want.
Nullsleep
The name alone would assure this module a place in my system -- definitely in for one.

madcap
For sure want to buy one. Love my noisering, would l love to add more mad scientist to it.
suboptimal
Given all the changes recently, I hope this is still in the plan!
melodydad
A gargoyle-free Richter Cybernetics - yes, please! thumbs up
gwaidan
From what I read, seems Grant is more interested in video stuff now. Really hope I'm wrong but I'm not banking on this happening soon.
sundog
Perhaps I'm a hopeless optimist but I'm still holding out for this based on this entry from 16 Feb:

grantrichter wrote:
I shipped the final Rev. of the Megawave last night AND the schematics for the CYBERNETICS expander module. Cthulhu
monstrinho
gwaidan wrote:
From what I read, seems Grant is more interested in video stuff now. Really hope I'm wrong but I'm not banking on this happening soon.



Well, the recent Facebook posts are promising "fun new stuff." What that means is anyone's guess. It would not surprise me if Grant came up with some new ideas that will function in both audio and video. The JAG is supposed to be able to process video, but I've never tried it. I've criticized Malekko in the past for seeming not to prioritize the synth stuff, but I think I'm about to eat my words in a big way....
ignatius
sundog wrote:
Perhaps I'm a hopeless optimist but I'm still holding out for this based on this entry from 16 Feb:

grantrichter wrote:
I shipped the final Rev. of the Megawave last night AND the schematics for the CYBERNETICS expander module. Cthulhu


i'm hopeful too 8_) and i think now that malekko has the robot machine overlord running and gone through what appeared to be a fuck ton of guitar pedals that dealers were waiting on.. that that clears a path for more synth modules to be manufactured. so, i'm hoping those new designs are in line after these MKII modules come together.

all i know is that Josh is super fucking busy and has had like 2 days off in the last 4 months.. or something crazy like that. they are working overtime at malekko HQ.

so, yeah.. anti-envelope.. phil triple osc, cybernetics.. more envelators.. etc.. i hope all those lovelies join the party.
gwaidan
Fingers crossed then! smile
suboptimal
Any chance of this thing seeing the light of day? eyes...
monstrinho
suboptimal wrote:
Any chance of this thing seeing the light of day? eyes...


Well, the Richter Noise Ring still has the expander port on the back. Could that be a clue??
infradead
monstrinho wrote:
suboptimal wrote:
Any chance of this thing seeing the light of day? eyes...


Well, the Richter Noise Ring still has the expander port on the back. Could that be a clue??


i was just thinking the same thing
ignatius
stillllll.... wwwaaannnntnnnttttt......
rjp2
I'm in for one!
VC_Wiggular
Noisering expander? SlayerBadger!
rjp2
yep, seems so.
theres a link to a prior thread explaining.
jgb
I'd love one, with gargoyles! smile Well, I would by one without too.
grantrichter
monstrinho wrote:
suboptimal wrote:
Any chance of this thing seeing the light of day? eyes...


Well, the Richter Noise Ring still has the expander port on the back. Could that be a clue??


The handsome and ever lovable Josh Holley is dancing fast enough for three people. If at all humanly possible, I am sure Josh will find a way. I happen to be privileged to know what a f*ck ton of super human effort Josh has put himself through in the last year. Yes, Virginia, superheroes are real.
suboptimal
I, for one, appreciate his efforts! SlayerBadger!
Entrainer
suboptimal wrote:
I, for one, appreciate his efforts! SlayerBadger!


+1. Very much so... for stepping in and helping Grant get his
designs manufactured and distributed, and at such a fair price.
The price to quality ratio is outstanding.
Entrainer
On July 14th, 2013 Grant Richter posted:

"What is Cybernetics?
Science or Psuedo-Science? Your Call!"

on his facebook...


>

Where is Cybernetics?
At Malekko HQ or in Grant Richter's mind? Your guess!

razz
gwaidan
Given how the Megawave is in the pipeline at long last, I would say at Malekko HQ... smile
Entrainer
gwaidan wrote:
Given how the Megawave is in the pipeline at long last, I would say at Malekko HQ... smile


That's what I took it as...
like GR throwing up the bat signal subtly. Could be wishful thinking on my end.
Nuuj
Oh how nice it would be, if this showed up this week...
numan7
twisted one of these days i'm going to experiment with the expander header on one of my noiserings, and see if i can't just gin up some diy-cybernetics circuitry myself!

cheers
ignatius
numan7 wrote:
twisted one of these days i'm going to experiment with the expander header on one of my noiserings, and see if i can't just gin up some diy-cybernetics circuitry myself!

cheers


keep us posted.
infradead
ignatius wrote:
numan7 wrote:
twisted one of these days i'm going to experiment with the expander header on one of my noiserings, and see if i can't just gin up some diy-cybernetics circuitry myself!

cheers


keep us posted.


seriously. would love to see this come to life
ignatius
me too.

maybe grant will chime in. we could post it on the muffwiggler FB group. i know he shows up there now and then.
suboptimal
I'd still buy it, but I'm kind of bitter about it. Feels like an unprofessional tease at this stage.
monstrinho
suboptimal wrote:
I'd still buy it, but I'm kind of bitter about it. Feels like an unprofessional tease at this stage.


I remember writing something similar about the Megawave and then it showed up a couple of months later. The fact that both Grant and Josh are perfectionists probably doesn't help things, but as with any business, there's most likely a backstory that we know nothing about. I also think that the frenetic pace of new Euro modules being released (what is it, at least two or three new modules every week?)has the effect of making people impatient. I wish that the world was full of new Richter designs (Anti-Envelope anyone?), but it is what it is.
ignatius
i posted the pic in the eurorack group on facebook and josh chimed in. said he was promised it would be done in 2012 (same as the anti-envelope) but he still hasn't seen a prototype. seriously, i just don't get it

oh well. i'm sure Grant's skills and energies are focused on other projects. Hopefully we get to experience those things some day. Drinking
ignatius
facebook eurorack group w/conversation about cybernetics and other stuff.. Grant chimes in

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10201944882997705&set=gm.73262 9643421374&type=1&theater
VortexRanger
ignatius wrote:
facebook eurorack group w/conversation about cybernetics and other stuff.. Grant chimes in

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10201944882997705&set=gm.73262 9643421374&type=1&theater


"The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page."
ignatius
VortexRanger wrote:
ignatius wrote:
facebook eurorack group w/conversation about cybernetics and other stuff.. Grant chimes in

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10201944882997705&set=gm.73262 9643421374&type=1&theater


"The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page."


oh, i guess you need to be a member of the "eurorack synthesizers" facebook group. seriously, i just don't get it
ignatius
here's the jist of Grant's post (if he has a problem w/me posting it here i'll happily remove it):

"There was a window of opportunity where you could introduce "real meat and patatos" modules with a proven track record of musical application. Somewhere along the line, there appeared modules that were so experimental and had no history of application and no knowledge if they could even be applied. It is true that I could have introduced the Anti-Envelope, a scaled down version of the Verbos Multistage. Would that have befitted the community as a whole? I can not get behind the idea of doing everything possible, just in the hope that it might be musical, and more crudely, make a buck. The Malekko line is absolutely solid, musical, designed as a synergistic system, and I if can improve on it, you will be the first to know."
monstrinho
I'm not on Facebook at all, so I can't join in that discussion, but one thought occurred to me; if Grant does not intend to release these designs as commercial products, maybe he could be convinced to publish the schematics as well as an article or two about them on his musicsynthesizer.com pages. Apart from being very, very interesting to read, the articles he published there back in the early 2000s are full of insights into circuit design and theory. Grant's work is very different from anything else out there and it's kind of a shame to not have things like the Cybernetics Expander and Anti-Envelope available at all. At least if it were published there people could DIY the designs. Also, one final observation; although I understand the rationale for not putting these designs into production, I think Grant has miscalculated if he thinks there is not a need for purely experimental modules with "...no history of application." I think that more purely experimental designs is exactly what we need.
CJ Miller
Thanks ignatius for relating that bit for us non-facebookians.

I don't really understand Grant's perspective on this, but I suppose I don't need to. If the window of opportunity is passed, does this mean he is no longer releasing "musical" modules? Or that he didn't release these two because they were not "proven" designs? I do not have any Wiard modules myself, but I know about them and have breadboarded some of Grant's other circuits. IMO he has a great feel for designing modules which are both clever implementations and very useful. As for why these two didn't make the grade, we can all scratch our heads at the castoffs of genius. Moral of the story - don't announce your modules to hungry masses far in advance!

monstrinho wrote:
if Grant does not intend to release these designs as commercial products, maybe he could be convinced to publish the schematics as well as an article or two about them on his musicsynthesizer.com pages.


Yes please!

Wiard
ignatius
i think.. based on his comments... that he doesn't think they have anything to add. at least the anti envelope... he says as much and says the verbos multistage is more full featured than the anti-envelope... per Grant's comments.

it just sounds like he isn't inspired by these designs or something and would rather work on something else seriously, i just don't get it

i understand that.. the guy is an artist.

but i also feel bad for Josh/malekko. he's been promised things several times from a few designers and really believed those things would come through and they just never happen. gotta be frustrating but i suspect it's the nature of dealing w/creative people who have a kind of genius about them.... and are also busy busy people.

i have no idea what it's like to walk ten feet in any of these people's shoes but i hope they're all doing well and have good relationships that bring forth more interesting modular music making things for us to destroy.

Hug
hpsounds
Maybe we should keep up our interest in these un-released prototypes/modules ? hihi

H.
Nuuj
On the one hand, this sucks.
I finally bought a Noisering when I found out about the potential expander.
Not that I regret that.

On the other hand I understand Grant's position.
Despite the fact that he allowed his designs to be made for other formats he only really designs modules for his own system. His vision is of an Instrument constructed of only his modules. If a new design doesn't add value to what he perceives as his Instrument, he's not going to release it. He really doesn't care about how his modules interact with others or if other modules provide similar functionality.

If he was actually still working on perfecting the Anti, it must have been like a punch to the gut when he saw the Verbos multi-stage.
jgb


Still getting the hots when looking at this!

A DIY kit would be wonderful, with someone else providing the panel (in order to properly gargoyle it without breaking any contracts with wiard).

I have no idea what it really does, but I trust Grant.
gwaidan
IIRC Josh also posted about his frustration with broken promises from Grant here a few years back, so this is not a new thing.

And Grant's FB post is a headscratcher - he seems to imply that the window of opportunity for meat and potatoes modules has closed, but he's not prepared to introduce innovative modules that may not have a defined application. Glad he wasn't in that frame of mind when he developed the JAG... seriously, i just don't get it
ignatius
gwaidan wrote:
IIRC Josh also posted about his frustration with broken promises from Grant here a few years back, so this is not a new thing.

And Grant's FB post is a headscratcher - he seems to imply that the window of opportunity for meat and potatoes modules has closed, but he's not prepared to introduce innovative modules that may not have a defined application. Glad he wasn't in that frame of mind when he developed the JAG... seriously, i just don't get it


i think it's tough to point fingers even when promises are clearly made etc. there are always things we aren't aware of and individual circumstances etc etc.. things change. seriously, i just don't get it

i think it's a bummer all around. i'm sure we'd get satisfaction from using something like the cybernetics and Josh and Grant would get satisfaction designing and building them and seeing them used and enjoyed by lot's of people.

none of us here can characterize Grant and Josh's relationship or draw too many conclusions from a few posts here or on facebook.

i think they're both awesome people and i hope they can come together on future designs for awesome modules. Hug
gwaidan
Fair point, Ignatius. It's also a bit devastating when someone spends years on something only to be beaten to market by a competitor...there's more than one manufacturer who rued the MS-20 reissue, I'm sure...
wavehead
i really, really appreciate grant's stance on introducing new modules to the wiard system... because what makes it really great is the amount of forethought into the various applications of each modules (in relation to others).

while it is really cool that people are willing to take big chances in eurorack on new modules/functions that weren't exactly made with synergy in mind (tho this is mostly because there is so much mix and match between 'systems') and sometimes rely on users to find their own road map (essentially beta-testing) - it's still a huge financial risk and i think it potentially discourages/burns people out. modular synths might be made out of function blocks with huge ranges of control and variation, but simple things like the right VCO tracking/xmod or envelope/VCA combo still can make all the difference.

it does seem like there should be a lot of area to grow in the wiard system, but as is it makes some fantastic voices that i'd say are more or less "complete"

(i will probably DIY an "expander" soon for the pair of anti-oscillator's i have - hopefully implementing folder symmetry, input, stage switching, tri->fold xfade and a sine shaper for the triangle - some of these things i do wish had been done on the mk2 when it came out).

hopefully grant's video synth stuff is in the works and will find it's way into final stages/completion soon as i'd really love to know what's going on with that, but again it may take a super long time because it's got to have synergy
ignatius
gwaidan wrote:
Fair point, Ignatius. It's also a bit devastating when someone spends years on something only to be beaten to market by a competitor...there's more than one manufacturer who rued the MS-20 reissue, I'm sure...


true. but i think designs are so different even when the functions of modules are the same across more than one manufacturer that there's still a market for more than one of whatever even if someone gets there first.. usually there is one or two things done differently that really make all the difference to some users. perhaps that shrinks the market for each module or just sucks the air out of the builder/designer.. but it seems some manufacturers just forge ahead seriously, i just don't get it

there are some really small builders out there doing interesting things and sometimes just a one off module w/a lot of possible applications. i think that can be interesting. it leaves it to users to think A LOT more about what it is they want a system to do but it's provides the opportunity to take a module from a different designer/builder and say "oh, that weird shit.. yeah.. i'd like to apply those ideas to this system i have".

or not.. i mean.. eurorack is fucking ridiculous with choices these days. there are just so many modules. a core system of oscillator/filter/vca/ etc is awash with possibilities and outcomes. some people may just want to buy a bunch of stuff from one manufacturer because they know "this stuff will all work together" and then fill out the rest with oddities and misfits etc. seriously, i just don't get it

it's easy to talk though.. when i don't have to think about the business side of the equation.
Entrainer
I, for one, still want both the Cybernetics AND Anti-Envelope from Malekko/Richter.

It's not about whether something similar exists in the Euro arena... it's about the vision of a SYSTEM. Modules are cool, systems are cooler.
Entrainer
...
muncky
Well said, sir Entrainer. Hope these beasts come out of stasis

Was there ever temperature check on how many folks would stump up for an AE or C? Is there a minimum number of healthy commitments that might get them into production?
jonkull
Entrainer wrote:
It's not about whether something similar exists in the Euro arena... it's about the vision of a SYSTEM. Modules are cool, systems are cooler.


Exactly. I've been keeping to a mostly one manufacturer (Malekko) system. I would buy an Anti-Envelope. I will not buy the Verbose Multistage.
hpsounds
Entrainer -Well said ! thumbs up

H.
Nuuj
muncky wrote:
Well said, sir Entrainer. Hope these beasts come out of stasis

Was there ever temperature check on how many folks would stump up for an AE or C? Is there a minimum number of healthy commitments that might get them into production?


I doubt it.
Grant will only release new designs if he thinks it adds to his Instrument.
He doesn't care how many he might sell or really even what his customers might want.
It's his vision, and I can respect that even if it's sometimes disappointing.
He might be persuaded to keep working on the AE and this Noisering Expander if people are still interested, but without any promise of actually releasing anything until he is satisfied with the results.
If everyone loses interest it would not surprise me if he gave up one these to work on other ideas.
drumsofd00m
Disclaimer first - I'm a 300 and 1200 series owner with what I think is a relatively "balanced" view of the system(s). I mean that I've been admiring of Grant Richter's work for 14 years and that's never gonna change, and at the same time I'm also a critical user, i.e. I won't ever pretend anything is perfect or "hype" anything or anyone.

Now, as much as I admire Grant, I'd like to counter (or add to, whichever way you want to view it) speculations like "Grant will only release new designs if he thinks it adds to his Instrument" (which would definitely be the case with the NoiseRing expander) with my own speculation, which is that I think Grant maybe likes to "set examples" more than think in terms of "product" AND I think he also longs for special recognition.

Rightfully so, because he was the first who came up with stuff like resonant lopass gates (three different types of them before 2005!), elaborations on Buchla's concepts of "uncertainty", and weird module names and faceplate designs, all of which are now prevalent in Euro-land and, I think, even form a large part of that format's appeal to newbies with little modular experience. Because it's just so easy to get fascinating and good sounding self-contained chaos patches *and* have something nice to look at with these types of modules.
Sure, one can be disappointed by a similar module being released suddenly, especially when it's done in such a professional, sleek, understated but at the same time quite commanding fashion as Verbos did, which is rare. I think marketing isn't one of Grant's strengths (or even something he likes, it seems to me). AND that statement quoted here is not the first time he seems to downright avoid what he perceives as "competition": some years back he said that the release of the Buchla 200e was one of the reasons 300 series production was all but halted for several years - that he "wanted Don to succeed".
So, I don't think we'll have much influence on this. Maybe even 500 people telling him they'd buy a Cybernetics Expander (which, by an earlier anecdote of Paul Schreiber, doesn't necessarily have ANYTHING to do with actual sales numbers later on, sadly) - maybe that wouldn't have any more effect than if the module just sunk into oblivion.
Maybe the opposite/ an adverse effect even?

How about we all keep dead silence and pretend we're not interested at all, in fact we can't even remember what that "Kybernetixx Pantomimer" vaporware thing was supposed to be about? How did you call that? Once again, sir? Maybe Grant would be so afffected that eventually he'd want to show everybody? ;)

Not completely joking.
Nuuj
This just in...
Grant thanked Verbos on Facebook for mentioning him in this interview.
http://blogs.citypages.com/gimmenoise/2014/02/mark_verbos_interview.ph p?page=2

Really interesting that Grant was Verbos' mentor.
drumsofd00m
Not sure about the details anymore, but IIRC Mark was also involved with Wiard at a very early stage (assembling modules maybe?), and he did work on Grant's Easel a few years ago.
jgb
Wiard eyes... Wiard
davidh
still want screaming goo yo
ignatius
davidh wrote:
still want screaming goo yo


my 2+2=4 tells me i can be 99% sure it won't happen.
monstrinho
Has anyone taken the time to figure out exactly what each pin on the expander header is doing? It would be a really good thing to know for anyone wanting to experiment with ideas for an expander (or even just to put together a breakout panel that brings the expander header I/O out to a panel). I think there's a much better chance of a third-party expander happening than this ever seeing the light of day.
davidh
I repeared my noisering myself and I took some notes, it is not so that hard to understand. I wonder if I can build it myself...

If really the product is abandoned, may be Grant can share the circuit for the DIYers ?
SirSickSik
I found a schematic somewhere in some documentation about randomising stuff

Picture file

the documentation:
http://musicthing.co.uk/modular/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Random-Read ing-List.pdf
Entrainer
ignatius wrote:
davidh wrote:
still want screaming goo yo


my 2+2=4 tells me i can be 99% sure it won't happen.



These things you say...
why do you say them
cry
causticlogic
Entrainer wrote:
ignatius wrote:
davidh wrote:
still want screaming goo yo


my 2+2=4 tells me i can be 99% sure it won't happen.



These things you say...
why do you say them
cry



I'm in denial. Octembruary can't come soon enough...gimme gimme gimme...
I reject your maths. Unless Tony can convince Grant to release these, maths has no purpose here. razz
Veqtor
I want this so much it's not even funny... confused
JakoGreyshire
I just saw this on MG... Looks like it was just uploaded on JAN 24th..

Then I did a search here on MW...... I'm shocked that this module is on MG when the threads here seem to say that this module will not be available...
I mean it was planned on being made then it fell by the wayside around 2012 or 2015 ish...

Anyway.. Maybe Malekko will release it??? seriously, i just don't get it

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/malekko-heavy-industry-cybernetics
snakehead
More Richter modules? This would be too good to be true.
JakoGreyshire
It might be too good to be true…. Don't get your hopes up…. Makes me think about who posted the picture to MG… Why would someone post a module that is not available? Where did they get the module picture?
exper
JakoGreyshire wrote:
It might be too good to be true…. Don't get your hopes up…. Makes me think about who posted the picture to MG… Why would someone post a module that is not available? Where did they get the module picture?


It was from this very thread, when it was in the now killed off malekko subforum.
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