getting them warm vinyl drum beats

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jake
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getting them warm vinyl drum beats

Post by jake » Sun May 06, 2012 1:32 pm

how do you get them really warm sounding drum breaks used by artists such as BOC and tycho the real warm acoustic ones, i want to get some but dont have any luck, i get the idea that they are probably ripped off vinyl but does anyone know of any ones someone has already done where i could chop up the hits and saturate the hell out of em n stuff?
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Post by Babaluma » Sun May 06, 2012 2:00 pm

there are many ways to skin a cat, why not try out a few different ones and see which work/don't work?

some ideas - sample some from vinyl, or use any drum beats you can find, or make them yourself, and then run them through as many different processes as you can, analogue and/or digital, cassette tape, etc.

when i'm going for that boards of canada drum sound i'll usually start with an analogue drum machine and/or samples of an analogue drum machine, mix them with a live drum loop, then run those through a variety of analogue outboard and digital plugin devices such as d.i.'s, preamps, compressors, eq's, delays, and reverbs, and see what works for the track i want that particular sound for.

so again, what i'm basically saying is, just try a load of stuff and see what works!

sorry not to be more specific, but there's a lot to be said for not spoon feeding, or not presuming that you should be spoon fed, from an internet forum. experience is all, as is persistence.

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Post by ignatius » Sun May 06, 2012 2:27 pm

BoC uses a lot of old gear. i've read stuff where they said they'll decide for a song to only use gear made in a certain year as a limitation. "hey let's only use gear from 1974 for this song"

they have old drum machines, use tape machines in various places, detune stuff, layer stuff.. they basically use all the methods in various places

a little tape hiss is your friend.. sending a drum loop to tape then back into the sampler or computer.. but when i listen to their stuff there is never a time when i think "the mid range is really biting my head off".. so, they are careful not to have any spikey frequencies in the high mids.. which i think has a lot to do with old drum machines and analog synths.. listen to an oberheim or SCi drum machine and there isn't a hi-fi sample in there breaking through and popping out of the lot.

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Post by richard » Sun May 06, 2012 6:17 pm

buy/borrow a sony walkman professional cassette recorder to sample to

record onto that then transfer the recordings to you computer or sampler

or try the same with any old tape recorder you have to hand

job done!
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Post by EATyourGUITAR » Sun May 06, 2012 10:49 pm

I was a DJ before I made beats so I gotta go with "your not digging enough". buy more records. listen to more records. sample more records. you can not really use the defense that there is nothing you need on a vinyl somewhere waiting for you to abuse it. Babaluma is VERY knowledgeable in production techniques and his resume is wayyyy longer than mine BUT I differ from him slightly here. why run it through tape if it already ran through tape when it was recorded the first time? why add distortion if it is already distorted? what I'm saying here is that you can take a clean sample and try to make it sound like it is vintage or dirty or whatever but you could just dig a bit more for that perfect sample. too many times I tried to polish a turd drum loop and it never comes out as good as the ones that sound tight and punchy on the record to start with. I'm not saying that post production just doesn't happen but I need to start with something that is not sampled>chopped>sampled>chopped>sampled>chopped>sampled>chopped> before I even do my thing. if you can listen to 100 records of any style from any genre in a day, then you might have what it takes to find the dope beats without any help.
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Post by parasitk » Mon May 07, 2012 2:08 am

Yeah, why learn how to do it yourself, when you can just lift it from someone else who is way more talented at production than you? :despair:


(Needless to say I agree with Babaluma's suggestions.)

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Post by jake » Mon May 07, 2012 4:58 am

yea im not bothered about the processing yet its finding the acoustic samples to chop up, do you have any idea of where i could get some good ones ?

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Soy Sos
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Post by Soy Sos » Mon May 07, 2012 5:20 am

Sample Vinyl
Listen to a ton of records and......
Sample Vinyl

Sorry to sound like a broken record (haha)
But that's how to do it.

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Post by jake » Mon May 07, 2012 5:33 am

so many puns :hihi:

because i wasnt born in the 80s i have no idea about where to start with vinyl or how to get it into a daw for that matter lol
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Post by ndkent » Mon May 07, 2012 5:45 am

of course I can't prove it, but to me BOC sounds all about processing rather than some special soundmaking gear. Vinyl itself definitely adds something but remember what went onto vinyl did not see any digital signal processing but did see analog compression, EQ and most definitely tape.

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Post by Soy Sos » Mon May 07, 2012 8:20 am

OK, what DAW do you use?
Do you have a USB or FireWire interface?
Do you have access to a turntable and mixer?
Can you get or borrow some records?
I'm sure you can find pre made vinyl breaks,
I just find it's more fun and satisfying to roll my own.
Ableton makes it really flexible to cut a sample a thousand
different ways. That's how I do it these days, but in the past
I've used a bunch of different hardware samplers.

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Post by RealDudes » Mon May 07, 2012 8:38 am

acoustic drum samples?

[video][/video]


Also, a friend I play shows with sometimes makes kinda chill wave lo fi music with just the stock sounds and processors in ableton and he always has a really nice vintage sound and when I asked him how he got it that way he said he just uses the filters and processors in ableton to make it sound old.
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Post by rico loverde » Mon May 07, 2012 9:13 am

id have to agree with the rest. vinyl vinyl vinyl. im sure there is a used record shop somewhere near you. go spend a day & sort through the bins. there may only be one little 4 bar drum break on an entire record. if ya cant listen to em at the shop just by a bunch of cheap ones. in that situation ill go by names, artwork, genre etc. ive scored some real gems this way. its a very rewarding way to go...

even just taking individual hits and then programming your own beats can be great too. sample the records into an old MPC or something like that.
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Post by Bath House » Mon May 07, 2012 3:13 pm

Sampling old, dry, analog drums from black records. Most white nerds don't listen to the type of material that this stuff is drawn from, so they don't understand that 99% of "getting it to sound that way" is just grabbing the right old records.

Viz:

[video][/video]
[video][/video]
[video][/video]

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Post by jonah » Mon May 07, 2012 5:25 pm

@Bath House, I dunno I think it's kinda distasteful to sample from someone specifically because of the color of their skin. Not to mention limiting. I use Ginger Baker samples all the time.

If you can't figure out how to use a turntable, just record it off youtube.
[video][/video]

[video][/video]

[video][/video]

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Soy Sos
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Post by Soy Sos » Mon May 07, 2012 8:05 pm

Not to be a purist, but for gawdz sake don't sample from utoob or shitty mp3s
if you want a vinyl kind of vibe. You can always ruff it up later if that's what you're going for, but you can't un-crappify it.

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Post by slovo » Tue May 08, 2012 1:15 am

i think everyone here would agree that vinyl has a certain charm to it, but it's not as tho it and youtube are the only ways. this kid probably has a cd player... there's not much chance you guys will notice if he rips a loop from a cd, if it's the right one! try stuff that's not remastered, like reissues by rykodisc, waxtrax, us collectibles, blood and fire... actually it's been awhile since i bought a cd from any of these companies, but in the 90s they shoveled a lot of wonderful music to cd, in pretty poor quality. a bunch of my old reggae cds have audible vinyl pops all over them, and the old waxtrax singles can get pretty dirty. they would all sound great, and probably cost like $1 shipping and handling, and you probably have the equipment you need already (pc with a cdrom).
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Post by Soy Sos » Tue May 08, 2012 1:31 am

I hear you slovo,
it's just wonderful to take a stack of albums and chop up some tasty bits
direct off the vinyl. Why not? This is a forum of wack job synth purists and freaks. I think it's a technique a kid like this should experience. You don't have to go out a spend thousands on decks and a mixer. I say do it on the cheap and have fun!

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Post by slovo » Tue May 08, 2012 1:50 am

fair enough. i love playing with turntables and think the world of the sounds they produce. perhaps i'm biased, tho, by the HK scene (lack thereof) and the fact that my cohort could scarcely find used turntables and a mixer. living here has also made me come to appreciate desktop space... kind of a limited tool for such a huge footprint. hell, if the guy can afford it then go for it! i'd love to have turntables in my apt... ;)
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Post by drox » Tue May 08, 2012 5:38 am

Sample from any sound source you can find and any recording medium and mash them all together into your computer and modular. Keep experementing there are no rules!

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Post by drox » Tue May 08, 2012 5:39 am

i do really love digging for breaks, and have managed to get a regular gig in a restaurant playing all the wacky records I have amassed over the years :)

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Post by Soy Sos » Tue May 08, 2012 8:10 am

Jake,
What DAW do you use?
I'll send you some vinyl grabs to cut up.
.wav 44.1 24 bit
K?

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Post by bphenix » Tue May 08, 2012 10:24 am

If you are interested in pre-existing drum sample sets, check out Goldbaby. High quality work (even for the lo-fi sound):
http://www.goldbaby.co.nz/products.html

There is a vinyl set but also of interest would be the SP1200 set.

While this a great start and super useful, some of my favorite old kits in my collection are pieced together from single hit samples of old records so it is worth taking the time to do it yourself if you have the equipment and access to a good record collection.

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Post by jake » Tue May 08, 2012 11:18 am

Soy Sos wrote:Jake,
What DAW do you use?
I'll send you some vinyl grabs to cut up.
.wav 44.1 24 bit
K?
thanks that would be great ;D

i use ableton
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Post by Soy Sos » Tue May 08, 2012 12:03 pm

Here is the joy of which I speak. I found some gems too.
Anyone feel free to grab these for as long as they're up.
If you don't use Ableton, just go in the samples/recorded folder
and have at the .wav files. They are un-cut and and un-edited,
just as nature intended.

http://wtrns.fr/EmEIsmoY2oRx-80

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