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so what's it look like from behind?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Buchla, EMS & Serge  
Author so what's it look like from behind?
ex_dead_teenager
You know I've never seen the back side of a Buchla of any vintage. I know it's not nearly as exciting as the front but I've got some questions about it's back end. For instance is it powered by a proper cable or is it a wall wart sort of thing? How many Midi dockets does it have is it midi-in only or do they also have midi-thru? And last how do the audio outputs look? Is it some kind of dual-mono type of stereo like on Evolver sequencers or are they stereo outs like you'd see on a 1/4 stereo headphone jack?

It looks like I'll be picking up a case sooner than I had expected. I heard from Don today I wrote asking if he had any in plywood and he said he had a second hand plywood case he would sell me for $300 off. I'm going to go for it because I could order it tomorrow and quite frankly while the Walnut and Zebra Wood sides are really fancy I liked the plywood cases, they're sturdy looking and tbh I think I'd be afraid to gig with something that looked as bling as some of those newer cases look. I suppose I could always trade up in the future but right now I want that case for my Pendulum Ratchet! SlayerBadger!

Anyone on here owned both the older and newer type cases and can compare them both?
Roycie Roller
Personally i find the back end of old Buchlas fascinating. It's like looking into the recesses of some alien spider's web. The circuits offer a glimpse into what it took to bring electronic synthesis to life, in a time when everything was pioneered by only a handful of people.
I haven't seen any photos of 200e innards, but here is a plethora of 200 series photos (from paults)-
Check out the MARF in particular.

http://www.synthtech.com/pix/buchla/
2012
Roycie Roller wrote:

I haven't seen any photos of 200e innards,


i did a search specialy for u:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9828434@N03/2805792727/
ex_dead_teenager
Thank you both those are some great photos but what I'm really after is a picture of the outer rear end. That said Buchla guts are awsome. Some of those PCBs are really trippy looking.
citizen mori
here are some photos of a buchla cabinet. this one is a 201e wl18 cabinet.

the latches are the new style: durable and certain, rubber and steel. there are at least two other styles of latches: an elegant but ultimately tedious push-button brass latch mechanism and a less durable, slimmer plastic implementation of the current latch style.

these wood side-panels are of the thinner variety, which means that there are metal panels on the lefthand side which allow for the routing of the inter-boat connection snakes. some older cabinets have thick, thick endcaps which have no access panels.

one of the photos below is of the i/o panel for the 227e module. there are four cutouts for panels such as this and the midi i/o for the 225e. two on the upper boat, and two on the middle boat.





ex_dead_teenager
hmmn that's just what I was looking for. it looks like it's powered with a wall wart type of supply, *sigh* wall warts, as usefull as they are in the end they just sort of take over everything... not that I'm gonna complain really, with all that these instruments can do what's one more massive electrical bump on my surge protector?
citizen mori
it is actually a power brick style power supply. there is an iec connector on the power brick.
citizen mori
...here is a photo of the rear of a model 208.

ex_dead_teenager
Power Bricks are awsome I wish more things used those.

also I'll say it again those PCBs look awsome
momo
I revisited the SOS review yesterday in full and they touch on the cabinet. I believe they really got it wrong in surmising that the plywood was an economic decision on the part of B&A. Gordon Reid is entitled to his opinion that it is cheap looking, it is however remiss to intimate that it would be any less durable than solid wood.

People who lay solid wood flooring often use plywood (not the more expensive marine grade being used by B&A) as a substrate because it is very stable. You can't stop mother nature but you can employ clever ingenuity, each leaf of wood veneer is glued 90 degrees to each other. Because wood generally moves more in one direction than the other, the effect is that any movement is cancelled out. Each leaf is glued to the other under high pressure steam and the glue is often stronger than the wood itself.

Interestingly, also in the SOS review, they suggest the 18 space boat cost $1,400 back in 2005. I'm not sure if this is a typo. Also though Don refuted many of the claims made by SOS as to the cabinet's design and durability, it appears from their FAQ page that for that reason or some other, they have revised the cabinet design in some obvious ways and apparently many others less so. I would be inclined to ascertain which era the cabinet in question is from. Or many may feel a cabinet is a cabinet is a cabinet.

Good luck and congratulations on having the option to pick one up so soon. FWIW my understanding is that Verbos' tentative turnaround is around a month so even if you had to wait for three or more for modules from B&A, you could be up and running to a degree with third party modules. The ZOe also is slated to be ready fairly imminently. Exciting times. Cheers
Roycie Roller
2012 wrote:
Roycie Roller wrote:

I haven't seen any photos of 200e innards,


i did a search specialy for u:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9828434@N03/2805792727/


Cheers! He has some great photos on his page.
Lyonel
Thanks for all those explanations citizen mori, very informative.
Boats look great and strong ...
is this the actual thickness and wood variety employed by Buchla & Associeted ?
science
You heard back from him? When?

I can't even get him to return an e-mail or call after sending him a deposit check, which was confirmed to be delivered on the 13th, and still hasn't come out of my checking account as far as I can see.
science
What really has me confused is that he responded relatively quickly to e-mails I had sent him months ago when I first started seriously considering ordering one, and over the 2 weeks before I sent my check. Ever since he sent me an e-mail telling me where to send the check, I can't get a hold of him. Guess I'll try calling again today.
550b
Thanks to Roycie and Citizen for the pix. I've had trouble finding pictures of the 'boring' parts of Buchla systems (cases and guts) - most of them are of panels or spaghetti.

science wrote:
I can't even get him to return an e-mail or call...


Don has always responded to my emails, eventually. Sometimes quickly, sometimes not. I try to be patient and remember that B&A is a very small company. I have never heard of anyone having trouble getting their order filled, though sometimes things are delayed a bit.

Hopefully, it just means he's busy getting systems ready to ship!
science
I really don't agree with that. No offense to Don or anyone else, but it's not like he's receiving hundreds of phone calls and orders every day. It's not very hard to make 5 minutes to call or e-mail someone who just sent you a check for thousands of dollars... and if it is, it's time to hire help. That's just business.
cbm
citizen mori wrote:
there are at least two other styles of latches: an elegant but ultimately tedious push-button brass latch mechanism and a less durable, slimmer plastic implementation of the current latch style.

I'd like to defend the "elegant but ultimately tedious push-button brass latch." It may be tedious from a manufacturing POV, but from a user's POV it's the best latch that's been used (at least I think so.)

It has a very clean visual line, and it holds the case closed just fine.


Quote:
these wood side-panels are of the thinner variety, which means that there are metal panels on the lefthand side which allow for the routing of the inter-boat connection snakes. some older cabinets have thick, thick endcaps which have no access panels.

Once again, the thinner wood w/ "access hatches" may be better from a manufacturing POV, but it is not as nice from an esthetic POV, at least for me. The combination of the thicker wood with the inter-boat wiring going through a hidden channel and the brass latches is the pinnacle of the current 200e case design, IMO.
citizen mori
cbm wrote:
I'd like to defend the "elegant but ultimately tedious push-button brass latch." It may be tedious from a manufacturing POV, but from a user's POV it's the best latch that's been used (at least I think so.)

It has a very clean visual line, and it holds the case closed just fine.


your experience with these latches is very unusual, and you are very fortunate to have a rare example of reliable brass latches. i agree that they've a clean look (hence my elegancy claim) but of all the brass latch cabinets i've seen closed, only a few could be trusted to keep the system latched up.

regarding the thicker wood endcaps, i agree.
cbm
The only "trick" to the brass latches, is to press the button while closing the case.

From what I've heard, these latches required very high accuracy in placing them in the wood, which led to a high failure rate in completed sides.

I guess I did get lucky.
citizen mori
Lyonel wrote:

is this the actual thickness and wood variety employed by Buchla & Associeted ?


yes, currently. it may change again someday...
citizen mori
cbm wrote:
The only "trick" to the brass latches, is to press the button while closing the case.

From what I've heard, these latches required very high accuracy in placing them in the wood, which led to a high failure rate in completed sides.

I guess I did get lucky.


lucky on latch and wood! i've more green-nose on the fortune of your wenge. gorgeous wood on that cabinet! perhaps these incidences were karmic prediction of your ratchet efforts? love
ex_dead_teenager
science wrote:
You heard back from him? When?

I can't even get him to return an e-mail or call after sending him a deposit check, which was confirmed to be delivered on the 13th, and still hasn't come out of my checking account as far as I can see.


Yah Don seems sort of sketchy. When I phoned him a few weeks back he sounded rather startled and I was worried that I may have interrupted him in the millde of something but he assured me I haddn't so what ever he answered my questions and then the next day he sent me an e-mail reply addressing the questions I'd written him with.

Then I wrote him again about plywood cases and three days later I heard from him again. I couldn't tell you what's up. He seems to just do things in his own time though that's got to suck when it comes to waiting on orders. Actually I might call him today because he didn't tell me which size the cabinet was and if it's a 12panel I could put the check in the mail today though I'd be quite happy to wait two weeks for the money to buy an 18 panel.
citizen mori
ex_dead_teenager wrote:
Yah Don seems sort of sketchy.


d'artistes croquis souvent!! applause
xpander
citizen mori wrote:
i agree that they've a clean look (hence my elegancy claim) but of all the brass latch cabinets i've seen closed, only a few could be trusted to keep the system latched up.

i have a 201e-18 and i'm not sure what benefit the latches provide. if i transport it, it goes in the case. if i take it out of the case, it's going to travel about 3 to 5 feet to it's performance destination. maybe there's a benefit to having it latched while it's in its case? i doubt it. i'm never going to rely on the handle to carry the 200e so they seem unnecessary.
Lyonel
science wrote:
I really don't agree with that. No offense to Don or anyone else, but it's not like he's receiving hundreds of phone calls and orders every day. It's not very hard to make 5 minutes to call or e-mail someone who just sent you a check for thousands of dollars... and if it is, it's time to hire help. That's just business.


The first and only time that i have talked to Don Buchla, i asked him why he didn't answer to my many anxious Emails about my 17000$ bank transfer ;
he told me that he wasn't very compulsive about Emails.... i think that i laughed with him. d'oh!
science
ex_dead_teenager wrote:
Yah Don seems sort of sketchy..

I didn't even remotely suggest that.
citizen mori
here are some photographs of the brass latch style as well as the interboat routing. in this case, the cabinet has end caps thick enough to not need the access panels for the interboat snakes and so you see wood grain behind the snake instead of the black metal of the access panels.









oh, i thought jut now to say: if these images are too large for the forum community, please do let me know, and i will instead create a web gallery on my web domain to link to for discussions like this. question
rlainhart
Umm, Mori, just how many 200e cases do you have? ^_^

I agree with Chris about the brass latches, by the way - my case has them, and I haven't had any problems with them. I think it's an elegant design.
citizen mori
rlainhart wrote:
I agree with Chris about the brass latches, by the way - my case has them, and I haven't had any problems with them. I think it's an elegant design.


perhaps it is i who has been unlucky with brass latches!
sascha.victoria
Allesandro is back at it. It looks like this from the front:

http://vimeo.com/5146872?pg=embed&sec=
ex_dead_teenager
science wrote:
ex_dead_teenager wrote:
Yah Don seems sort of sketchy..

I didn't even remotely suggest that.


oh wow, you totally read me wrong. I only meant that from the phone call I had with him he seemed startled and sort of all over the place. By no means was he sketchy in the sense that Peter Grenader is. I think I use the word different than other people, no offense intended whatsoever. Though it's interesting to note how different uses of the same slang can be from one end of the continent to the other. Again no offense intended at all.
science
Whoops... none taken. I had took what you said as a sarcastic remark suggesting I was calling him sketchy. d'oh!
amnesia
i think the more you talk with don the more he is use to you...i have spoken to him 3 times this week, but i am looking to buy a second cabinet......now if alessandro cortini would answer any of my emails that would be cool. i have entered 3 messages on vimeo and he has deleted them>>>??? Not sure why? I was asking for advice on 222e ...he has usually replied to me????
ex_dead_teenager
Alessandro is on here, just a thought but maybe you could PM him? Of course that's really presumptious of me.
amnesia
i have PM'd him few days back...maybe he has me confused with someone who has upset him?????just dont know, he seems like a nice guy..he could be busy, but why delete my vimeo questions..its a mystery??????
amnesia
i kinda wished B& A had Buchla and Associates on the back of the modular so people could know what you were playing, I guess most dont have a clue, so it can work both ways :-)
ex_dead_teenager
I'm kind of glad it doesn't have anything written on the back.
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