[Project] Random Looping Sequencer / Turing Machine

raisinbag · Post by **raisinbag** » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:42 pm

Hey thanks Sduck, boards look great, now time to start loading them up.

Tombola (or anyone), is there a reason for the specific switch in the BOM? Can I use just any OnOffOn SpSt switch? The one Spec'ed from Mouser is Like $7. I can save $40-$50 using what I have on hand.

touyube · Post by **sduck** » Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:50 pm

7$? Too much! I subbed NKK's - the (on)-off-(on) spdt one (633-M201802) was 4.46$, the on-none-on spdt (633-M201202) was 3.53$.

I bought those led array thingies, but am not particularly enamored of them - will 10 plain old leds work? I've got bucketloads of regular leds.

diablojoy · Post by **diablojoy** » Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:03 pm

Tombola (or anyone), is there a reason for the specific switch in the BOM? Can I use just any OnOffOn SpSt switch? The one Spec'ed from Mouser is Like $7. I can save $40-$50 using what I have on hand.

I just used what i had on hand which were actually double pole on/off/on
momentary toggles they fitted after i cut the extra legs off [ bit of a hack ]
the holes in the board are large enough to take standard solder tag switches as opposed to pcb mount
However my panels are a custom size 241mm x 100mm so the extra width dimension of the switches i used were not an issue plus i spun the board 90 degree's in any case.

diablojoy · Post by **diablojoy** » Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:08 pm

will 10 plain old leds work? I've got bucketloads of regular leds.

No reason they wouldn't unless you are using one of the available panels
then it might look a bit naff
but of course you would be doing one of your own very nice panel designs if memory serves me right 8_)

raisinbag · Post by **raisinbag** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 3:26 am

sduck wrote: I bought those led array thingies, but am not particularly enamored of them - will 10 plain old leds work? I've got bucketloads of regular leds.

That might work out so much better. My plan is to make an aluminum panel and drilling 10 3mm holes would be so much easier than routing out a clean square for the LED "thingy" So ya if anyone has been successful using standard 3mm (or 5mm) LEDs let us know. Maybe I'll use a few different colours for shits and giggles?

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 3:51 am

raisinbag wrote:Hey thanks Sduck, boards look great, now time to start loading them up.

Tombola (or anyone), is there a reason for the specific switch in the BOM? Can I use just any OnOffOn SpSt switch? The one Spec'ed from Mouser is Like $7. I can save $40-$50 using what I have on hand.

Ideally the write switch should be (on)off(on) - momentary ons - otherwise when you flip it up or down it will just write the whole sequence high or low.

But if your switches fit the board and work with your panel, they should be fine.

RE: LEDs, definitely you could use 10x (actually 9x, because one LED in the matrix isn't used) simple LEDs, you might want to tweak the current resistors.

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 3:53 am

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 3:57 am

sduck wrote:7$? Too much! I subbed NKK's - the (on)-off-(on) spdt one (633-M201802) was 4.46$, the on-none-on spdt (633-M201202) was 3.53$.

Yes, my Mouser powers are weak. Thank you.

I've just updated the mouser BOM - cut Ã‚Â£5 off the cost!

Full Mouser Project: http://bit.ly/MRGqRF access id: bc8a4a43bf

raisinbag · Post by **raisinbag** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 4:06 am

so "Tweaking" the resistors for single LEDs, would that be the network? I assume a standard LED might draw more Current, so would I be trying to reduce that with a larger resistor value? If memory serves the network is 330 Ohms. What should I be aiming for V OR I across each LED? I guess I can always get a 10pin Network and cut off the useless pin, as the 9 pins are hard to find locally.

Navs · Post by **Navs** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:22 am

Built & working!

http://navsmodularlab.blogspot.de/2012/ ... bitsy.html

Thank you, Tom!

touyube · Post by **sduck** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 9:04 am

Tombola wrote: RE: LEDs, definitely you could use 10x (actually 9x, because one LED in the matrix isn't used) simple LEDs, you might want to tweak the current resistors.

Great! Which one of the leds isn't used?

Edit - never mind, I think I figured it out

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:02 pm

Navs wrote:Built & working!

http://navsmodularlab.blogspot.de/2012/ ... bitsy.html

Thank you, Tom!

Thanks Navs - I'm very relieved to see the first successful build. (Although you'd find it a lot easier to paint the infill *before* peeling off the masking tape!)

Peake · Post by **Peake** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:13 pm

Many thanks for the project! One thing I've not seen mentioned is the required pulse/gate level to advance the steps. I'll assume 10V? I want to use this with analog oscillators outputting commercial levels of about 1.2VRMS so I'll need some gain in between?

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:38 am

Peake wrote: the required pulse/gate level to advance the steps. I'll assume 10V?

No, there's a comparator on the pulse input. It should trigger on any voltage above 1.5v.

In practise, it clocks with every square or pulse in my little system (Dixie, Doepfer quad LFO, Maths pulse outputs, arduino pulses) and most other wave shapes, although it can be unusual with sines or E350 wavetable weirdness. There's no hysteresis (smoothing) on the clock input, so that might be the problem with weird waveforms, but it seems to work well with anything like a clock/square.

It sometimes also behaves very strangely (looped sequences disappearing) with multed/stackcabled clocks, I don't know why that is.

Peake · Post by **Peake** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:39 am

Wonderful news, thank you!

Navs · Post by **Navs** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:23 am

Tombola wrote:(Although you'd find it a lot easier to paint the infill *before* peeling off the masking tape!)

Yeah, I did think about that, but impatience got the better of me

That said, I might try Matthias Fonik's method of using crayons to infill. The unwanted residue can be wiped off.

Tombola wrote:...behaves very strangely (looped sequences disappearing) with multed/stackcabled clocks ..

Bitsy does this too, usually when the stack/ mult connection is made. I have a feeling it's the 4015 getting reset due to the short.

Navs · Post by **Navs** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:27 am

Two questions before I pack away the parts:

I used a green LED. Is the 330r network still ok?

Can someone explain if there's a reason I shouldn't have subbed the polyboxes C10 & 11 for ceramics? How might they affect performance in the Turing Machine and, for that matter, in other modules?

touyube · Post by **sduck** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:12 am

Navs wrote: I used a green LED. Is the 330r network still ok?

Depends on what kind of led you used and how bright you want it. There are green leds and GREEN ones. Most of them are fairly dull, so you'll probably be alright with the 330R. If it's too bright with the leds you have you could change the network to a 1K one or higher. If they're too dull you'd probably be better off subbing a brighter led than going for a lower network value - it's really low as it is.

Navs · Post by **Navs** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:18 am

Ta. It's the green version of the Kingbright DC10.

As you can see in the pic above, it's not too 'king bright, so I hope it's ok

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:02 pm

When I was prototyping, I had just the 330 resistor network going straight to ground. It was fine, but the current draw of the circuit seemed quite high. So I added another resistor (r19, 560 ohms) after the network. Thats why r13, which is an extra current protection resistor ( 9 x LEDs, 8x resistors in the network) is 820ohms, as close as I had to 330+560.

If you wanted your LEDs brighter, you could bridge or reduce r19, and reduce r13 accordingly, so all the LEDs are the same brightness.

But - obviously - that would cause current draw to rise.

diablojoy · Post by **diablojoy** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 10:57 pm

Hi Tom
could you repost the schematic please
I cant for the life of me read the pdf version off the site
the rest of the documentation is fine just the schematic

cheers
denis

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:47 am

There's a link to a big png of the schematic here : http://musicthing.co.uk/modular/?page_id=21

It's not very tidy, I'm afraid

HueMonContact · Post by **HueMonContact** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:55 am

Trouble shooting time...

I just finished building a RLS and I powered it up (no magic smoke Woohoo!) and inserted a clock (NoiseRing) and the first light of the LED bar of the RLS far left blinks in unison with my Noisering but the module does not seem to be functioning properly. I can supply pictures if needed.

Thanks in advance for any help or tips.

ultrashock · Post by **ultrashock** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:01 am

some bump after quick styding of schematic
C6 el.capacitor (bottom left) should be reversed in polarity.
in fact, it should blow (didn't yet?

)

Tombola · Post by **Tombola** » Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:36 am

HueMonContact wrote:Trouble shooting time...

I just finished building a RLS and I powered it up (no magic smoke Woohoo!) and inserted a clock (NoiseRing) and the first light of the LED bar of the RLS far left blinks in unison with my Noisering but the module does not seem to be functioning properly. I can supply pictures if needed.

Thanks in advance for any help or tips.

Well, that shows that power is coming in OK, and that the TL072 chip is working.

Are you getting white noise at the noise output?

Do any of the other lights come on?

Some large photos of my boards:

MUFF WIGGLER

MUFF WIGGLER

[Project] Random Looping Sequencer / Turing Machine