question regarding Buchla

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Ardilla
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question regarding Buchla

Post by Ardilla » Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:57 pm

was good fam,

i'd like to have an unique sounding box..
sadly my budget is limited (i can't go for 13k---for now...)

so,
is it a good idea to go for a 2 panel box with a 261e and a 291e (just as an example)?

any feedback is more than welcome and thanks for taking the time!

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alt-mode
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Post by alt-mode » Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:05 pm

You don't need a Buchla to have a unique sounding box! In fact, Buchlas seem to be getting more common these days. :roll:

If you are limited on funds, you really can't go wrong with EuroRack gear and use that to make unique sounds. There are many Buchla-like functions showing up in Euro these days.

The big issue with getting just "a little Buchla" is that it doesn't interface as easily with other manufacturers modules. The CVs are all positive and the gate voltages are larger than most so it makes integration with other modules a bit tough.

Yes, Buchla stuff is very special but you can get a huge amount of mileage out of many other manufacturers for less money IMO - and I'm speaking as a Buchla owner.

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Post by confusional » Sun Jul 26, 2009 9:23 pm

Redacted.
Last edited by confusional on Fri Apr 22, 2011 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by science » Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:05 pm

alt-mode wrote:You don't need a Buchla to have a unique sounding box! In fact, Buchlas seem to be getting more common these days. :roll:
Why the eye rolling? The fact that more of them exist doesn't make the 200e any less unique or interesting :despair:

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ndkent
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Post by ndkent » Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:50 pm

Nothing wrong with the idea. I started with a 2 module boat and a 291e that Don said would ship right away and I had a second hand 259e... though by the time I got my now bigger boat and 291e a half year later I'd added 3 more modules and stared a lot at that unpowered 259e on the shelf...

I agree it's not the easiest to interface with something else but it's not impossible.

I had toyed with the idea of getting a 225e earlier rather than later but then again it's a bit over the top to get something with no sound too early. As it turned out I added it to the couple modules I eventually received all at once.

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Post by chrisso » Mon Jul 27, 2009 12:24 am

Buchla is GREAT. :tu:

If funds are limited, I say look into those Euro rack or Cynthia style options.

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Post by Lyonel » Mon Jul 27, 2009 1:07 am

alt-mode wrote:Buchlas seem to be getting more common these days. :roll:
That's great :tu:

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Post by xpander » Mon Jul 27, 2009 1:19 am

if your interested in making music with your modular, you should go with something much more aligned to your budget. i'd go with the Euro format, insane amount of modules, many are really unique and many are really affordable. i mean- tube modules, bit crunchers... the stuff coming out for Euro is just sick, really.

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kkonkkrete
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Re: question regarding Buchla

Post by kkonkkrete » Mon Jul 27, 2009 4:11 am

Ardilla wrote:was good fam,
so,
is it a good idea to go for a 2 panel box with a 261e and a 291e (just as an example)?
I agree with the others that if you know your budget is fixed and small, you may get more out of another system.

But it depends exactly what you want. B & A make the 2-panel box for a reason. If I remember correctly, Ezra Buchla sometimes gigs with a 2-box (amongst other, non-Buchla things) --- in fact I think it is with a 261e + 291e, as you suggest. Such a system, would in a sense be a complete synth --- it has oscs, an LFO, a filter, and even some sequencing capabilities. However it is very limited, and I think you would probably end up wanting more.

If you want to use the system as a source of crazy noises, rather than complete pieces of music, I think you may be very happy with a 2-box. But you definitely would not be able to take full advantage of the modules if that is all you have.

Caveat emptor: I don't actually own a Buchla system (yet...)

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ndkent
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Post by ndkent » Mon Jul 27, 2009 4:32 am

The fact of the matter is there is nothing much else that close to the combo suggested. Nothing resembles the 291e since it has a fairly complex sequencer inside. I guess the vintage 259 is comparable to the newer oscillator pair, but it will cost more on the vintage market.

Buying some euro modules will get you something interesting especially with that kind of money but nothing like either. It's a valid argument if say a 281e + 292e combo was suggested to begin with, but it wasn't.

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Post by alt-mode » Mon Jul 27, 2009 7:54 am

science wrote:
alt-mode wrote:You don't need a Buchla to have a unique sounding box! In fact, Buchlas seem to be getting more common these days. :roll:
Why the eye rolling? The fact that more of them exist doesn't make the 200e any less unique or interesting :despair:
The original poster mentioned "unique sounds" and seemed to imply that they were only available with the Buchla perhaps due to its expense and rarity. I was eye-rolling that sentiment. So, I'm agree with you but my humor didn't come off correctly with the emoticon. :despair:

It is the synthesist that makes the sound unique, not the synthesizer.

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Post by science » Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:47 am

alt-mode wrote:The original poster mentioned "unique sounds" and seemed to imply that they were only available with the Buchla perhaps due to its expense and rarity. I was eye-rolling that sentiment. So, I'm agree with you but my humor didn't come off correctly with the emoticon. :despair:

It is the synthesist that makes the sound unique, not the synthesizer.
haha... in that case, I'll join you with one of these: :roll:

I do think a lot of people have themselves convinced that buying a Buchla will give them some kind of magical synthesis powers.

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Post by momo » Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:07 am

alt-mode wrote:
It is the synthesist that makes the sound unique, not the synthesizer.
Philosophical territory, I feel that is is a bit of both. I liked reading about Suzanne Ciani in Analog Days where she described working with the Buchla akin to collaborating. You come to it with some ideas, it gives you feedback on those ideas. I suppose it;s a bit like a dance and I would say the quality of the instrument's ability to 'dance' is a factor into such a 'collaboration' so I'm not so sure if it's a case of the synthesiser doesn't matter. Cheers

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Post by parasitk » Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:52 am

In my experience this collaboration applies with any instrument, not just Buchla synthesizers. :omg:

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Post by shamann » Mon Jul 27, 2009 12:10 pm

parasitk wrote:In my experience this collaboration applies with any instrument, not just Buchla synthesizers. :omg:
I agree with this completely. I recently started playing ukulele, I've struck upon ways I've never made music before with keys and electronics. I think the big reason we associate this idea with Buchla rather than other synthesizers is that because they are both complex and really expensive, the people who have them tend to use them deeply.

If you really want something unique, look around for a synth maker who's willing to do custom work. I'm willing to bet for $4k, you could find someone to make you something that's pretty darn cool.

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Post by Lyonel » Mon Jul 27, 2009 12:53 pm

parasitk wrote:In my experience this collaboration applies with any instrument, not just Buchla synthesizers. :omg:
Yes... at this time i resume playing Drums, and they don't want to collaborate :hihi:

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Post by alt-mode » Mon Jul 27, 2009 1:03 pm

shamann wrote:
parasitk wrote:In my experience this collaboration applies with any instrument, not just Buchla synthesizers. :omg:
If you really want something unique, look around for a synth maker who's willing to do custom work. I'm willing to bet for $4k, you could find someone to make you something that's pretty darn cool.
I don't think you need to do have something custom. The beauty of modular synthesizers is that they are "custom" by default. What you do need to do is to spend time with whatever instrument you choose and make it your own. One of the challenges of modulars and perhaps moreso for EuroRack modulars is that it is too easy to get more modules or swap modules for the latest and greatest purple-toothed hornswacker filter leaving you less time to become familiar with the instrument you have. [I speak as someone who still suffers from this malady.]

One of the reasons I have slimmed down my 200e system is that it didn't click with me as an instrument. I saw that I needed to set up some default configurations and patch them into the 210e and store some setups and that started to take away from the flexibility and modularity of the system. Yes, I know I could have done without the 210e but I found that I was using the 210e as a CV and audio mixer/level adjuster due to the lack of some of these features in other modules.

I know there are folks who have really made the 200e their instrument and I have the greatest respect for them. For live applications, the 200e has a huge appeal. This was a highly personal and subjective decision on my part but it has freed up some $$ to buy some green hornswaker filters though. :doh:

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Post by 2012 » Mon Jul 27, 2009 2:09 pm

Lyonel wrote:
parasitk wrote:In my experience this collaboration applies with any instrument, not just Buchla synthesizers. :omg:
Yes... at this time i resume playing Drums, and they don't want to collaborate :hihi:
The drums or the sticks? :lol:

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Post by Lyonel » Mon Jul 27, 2009 3:12 pm

Both :bang:

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Post by Lyonel » Mon Jul 27, 2009 3:28 pm

alt-mode wrote:One of the reasons I have slimmed down my 200e system is that it didn't click with me as an instrument. I saw that I needed to set up some default configurations and patch them into the 210e and store some setups and that started to take away from the flexibility and modularity of the system. Yes, I know I could have done without the 210e but I found that I was using the 210e as a CV and audio mixer/level adjuster due to the lack of some of these features in other modules.
So, alt-mode, have you renounce about the 210e, does it give you more freedom without it ? What is your actual configuration ?
I understand the intention to not coagulate, immobilize the system ; To keep liberty and imagination for new patching ;
And perhaps presets manager and 210e may interfere with those.

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Post by alt-mode » Mon Jul 27, 2009 3:57 pm

Lyonel wrote: So, alt-mode, have you renounce about the 210e, does it give you more freedom without it ? What is your actual configuration ?
I understand the intention to not coagulate, immobilize the system ; To keep liberty and imagination for new patching ;
And perhaps presets manager and 210e may interfere with those.
I decided that the 200e was not going to be a core instrument for me so I configured a 6-boat with modules that could be used with other modulars when needed. I decided that I would primarily drive it via MIDI for pitch and gate since the VCs are too different and I didn't want to find an old MOTU 896 or 896HD to drive it via Volta. I can still use other CVs to and from the 200e for modulation.

The modules I have left are 225e, 261e, 259e, 266e, 281e, & 292e. This gives me a very complex Buchla "voice" with some interesting modulation capability but not really a standalone system.

The 291e triple morphing filter, while amazing, frustrated me because I don't like to have menus in my modulars except for 'set and forget' functions like MIDI->CV. I don't think there would be any way to provide that much functionality without lots of panel space but it gets away from the "tactile experience" I want from a modular instrument.

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Post by chrisso » Mon Jul 27, 2009 8:37 pm

alt-mode wrote: I don't think you need to do have something custom. The beauty of modular synthesizers is that they are "custom" by default. What you do need to do is to spend time with whatever instrument you choose and make it your own.
I couldn't agree more.

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Post by chrisso » Mon Jul 27, 2009 8:41 pm

alt-mode wrote: The modules I have left are 225e, 261e, 259e, 266e, 281e, & 292e. This gives me a very complex Buchla "voice" with some interesting modulation capability but not really a standalone system.
That gives you a ton of possibilities. :yay:

I have a loose 259 (original) that I haven't powered up yet.
Looking at it I can imagine spending weeks getting to know it.
Take this as personal opinion only, but I'm surprised people feel they need more than a 20 module Buchla system.

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Lyonel
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Post by Lyonel » Tue Jul 28, 2009 1:33 am

Image

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Post by Lyonel » Tue Jul 28, 2009 2:47 am

Why is there a lot of proud pictures of walls of modules in all formats and quasi nothing with Buchla owners.
Are the Buchla's oscillators so specific that one is enough, or perhaps it's a profanity to play chords with a 200e ?
I understand alt-mode intention and philosophy and it's a real perspective and bearing.
But beside incredible portability and compactness which tip the scales in favor of a small Buchla System,
where is the problem with a big one ?
Price ? ... there is pictures of non Buchla configurations here and there which cost a lot of money,
So what ?

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