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Metasonix Power Supply Advice
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Author Metasonix Power Supply Advice
wavecircle
I recently had my D-1000 repaired but I am having problems getting a reliable PSU. I have to spoke to Eric about this and his suspicions that my PSU was delivering too much voltage were confirmed when I checked my Maplin 12v AC supply under a voltmeter and found it was delivering 14.5v RMS.

I have seen that Schneiders sell Metasonix supplies but with shipping it comes to about £30 which I think is a bit high for a transformer. Could a UK D-1000 owner give me the specs of their supply and where to get one if at all possible?

Cheers!
slow_riot
PM Antmanbee about this... he got a good one that was shipped to me... gave it away though.
SewerBadger
I use a 12V halogen lamp transformer on my Wretch Machine, as per Eric Barbour's recommendation. Lots of headroom with that one.

Finding 12VAC supply locally should be pretty easy. Is the current consumption of PSU specification not listed on the unit or owner's manual?
wavecircle
See, this is what I thought but my 12V supply is delivering 14.5V. Maybe my house is the problem?

There is a label in the D-1000 lid which states 12v AC and maximum current consumption of 1.2A. It is my understanding that a device will only take the current it needs, but these have always been DC devices. I am not entirely confident that is the case with AC.

Nevertheless my supply can deliver 3A of current, at 12V that 36W.

I am guessing that 12V x 1.2A is ideal for the D-1000 so that means 14.4W

I am not sure of the importance of power rating of the transformer.
weinglas
Eric mentions the Maplin L54BR on his website:
http://www.metasonix.com/index.php/support

I have the PS from Schneiders and it works great.
wavecircle
Hmm, thanks Weinglas. It is the L54BR that I am using. Maybe my resonance settings are just too high? Is it normal to hear the normal background hum being filtered when turning pots with no triggers active? It's not a big deal, I am just trying to get an ideal calibration. Although it is great fun to saturate the resonance.
weinglas
I do not know to what degree it is normal. But mine really is noisy. I have a noise gate at the main out twisted

If you are searching for older Threads on the D1000 the high noise level seems to be normal. But it is more noise than hum hmmm.....

BTW: The Schneiders PS also works perfectly with the KV100, but this one has a noise gate built in Dead Banana
wavecircle
I would describe it as hum on mine. I know that some background interference is going to be there on a device like this, it's not something I am unaware of. It's just I have never seen another one in use so it would be good to have a reference of "normal" operation. The background noise on mine is exactly the same as what can be heard on the big city music demo of it. It's just when I move my pots without triggers I am filtering the hum. Can you replicate this?
slow_riot
Halogen PSU is shit, very noisey.

Definitely had issues with TM2 and one supply that gave too much voltage... it cut out after 10 mins or so... that same PS also did something funny to the D-1000 but can't remember what.

Best was the one that Antmanbee got... don't think it was from Maplin.
weinglas
wavecircle wrote:
... It's just when I move my pots without triggers I am filtering the hum. Can you replicate this?


Will try this at home, but I cannot guarantee it will be today...
wavecircle
I just tried another AC supply I have but this only delivers 500mA at 12V. All I could really hear was the clock pulse and all the drums were tinny. This tells me that getting the PSU right is very important, I'll just get the Schneiders one if I can't source one in the UK.
weinglas
I do not know if i should thank you or if i should hate your question angry

Ok, i tried three different power supplies with headphones and no noisegate. Two similar to the Schneiders with 1670 mA and one with 1000mA (thought i had two more different power supplies but i could not find them, so maybe these two are not the Schneider ones). The 1000 mA had less noise but it sucked regarding the bass drum sound.

The other two sounded the same: Warm and phat! Both had hum (the noise was only an issue with high volume settings) that could be filtered and reacted very much to different volume pot settings.

So now that i know there are differences i have to think about getting on a quest for the perfect power supply very frustrating

Or i just ignore it and keep on using the noise gate. hihi

BTW: There seems to be less hum with the individual outs and lower volume settings.
wavecircle
I think your 1670mA supplies are the ideal ones to use, they have a bit of headroom. I think the D-1000 will only consume what it needs, whether or not my 3000mA supply is delivering too much juice is another issue. I have sourced a 1700mA supply in the UK which I will buy tomorrow and test out.

Can you get really meaty overdrive on yours? I've seen the zerosuminertia video where he gets this beautiful distortion when he goes past about 1 o'clock on the main volume outs. I can't achieve this sound on mine yet. Again, perhaps a power issue, perhaps a resonance issue.
zerosum
Quote:
I've seen the zerosuminertia video where he gets this beautiful distortion when he goes past about 1 o'clock on the main volume outs. I can't achieve this sound on mine yet. Again, perhaps a power issue, perhaps a resonance issue.


Some of that was probably due to the speaker I plugged it into clipping/breaking up. It was also recorded with a camera mic, so there
is extra dirtyness there too.
That particular D1000 belongs to Lakbra, and what he has done with it
sounds great!
It's peanut butter jelly time!

I do think that it will sound different in the US than it will in other parts of the world due to the power differences and different power supplies used.

Another way to add some grit is to run the D1000 into passive DI(Radial JDI is cool), engage the pad, then plug it into a preamp and overload the preamp, then trim off the final output volume of the preamp a bit before hitting the AD converter.
wavecircle
Right, if you are in the UK try this: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getP roduct&R=4006541

I got one this morning and it certainly sounds a bit better than the Maplin one.

My distortion was non existent before, what I have done is swap the final tube (the one above the cymbal), now I am getting somewhere. Could someone please clarify if this valve should be different from the other 3 "voice" tubes. I read that the final valve was a pentode pre-amp tube? Changing this tube has made a lot of difference, but I would like everything to be in it's right place.
SewerBadger
Ah, now we are getting into trying out different power supplies. I can't stand the Tone Quester crowd crowing on about carbon batteries. However, I have to admit that I've gone down this route a bit with our favored yellow boxes. I have gravitated toward finding the maximum voltage allowable as I have found a wider range of tones to be available due to greater headroom in some cases.

Here is how I roll:

Wretch/S-1000: a French-made Optelec 12V lamp transformer. Eric B. gave me the specs and I found this at the local hardware store in the 10th district of Paris. It has a polyfuse in it and has been rock solid for years.

TM-2: a Voltcraft 9VAC 2Amp unit. The TM-2 didn't like anything greater than 9VAC. The TM-1 sounds great @ 12VAC

TM-1: a TDC branded 12VAC 60VA supply. I found this on ebay.

KV-100: 12VAC 1670mA supply. The KV-100's poly-fuse trips if I go any higher.
wavecircle
The problem with AC supplies is that they are generally unregulated, it's easy to regulate DC but I've found it next to impossible to get an AC supply which guarantees the quoted voltage. Even this one I bought today is running at between 14-15v but it just sounds better and it isn't causing the thermal shutdown that I have experienced before. I am not an expert but perhaps this is to do with the overall power output.

I must say that swapping the tubes out has improved the overall sound.
thermionicjunky
Kent wrote:

TM-2: a Voltcraft 9VAC 2Amp unit. The TM-2 didn't like anything greater than 9VAC.


Wow, I just tried a 10V supply instead of the supplied 12V and the TM-2 has never sounded better. The hum was completely silenced.
metasonix
wavecircle wrote:
My distortion was non existent before, what I have done is swap the final tube (the one above the cymbal), now I am getting somewhere. Could someone please clarify if this valve should be different from the other 3 "voice" tubes.

"Different"? They are all the same type: 6GH8/6U8/6CQ8/6AX8/6KD8, also called ECF82 in Europe. The right-hand one is used as a preamp and gate for the cymbal, the others are resonant ringing-filter circuits.

Different brands might sound different, but I won't guarantee anything. You tube-roll at your own risk. And whatever you do, DO NOT try a type that doesn't have the same pinout and heater requirements.
corex
That's interesting news. I'll have to try that with my TM-2.
wavecircle
metasonix wrote:
wavecircle wrote:
My distortion was non existent before, what I have done is swap the final tube (the one above the cymbal), now I am getting somewhere. Could someone please clarify if this valve should be different from the other 3 "voice" tubes.

"Different"? They are all the same type: 6GH8/6U8/6CQ8/6AX8/6KD8, also called ECF82 in Europe. The right-hand one is used as a preamp and gate for the cymbal, the others are resonant ringing-filter circuits.

Different brands might sound different, but I won't guarantee anything. You tube-roll at your own risk. And whatever you do, DO NOT try a type that doesn't have the same pinout and heater requirements.


I just swapped with the spares you sent Eric. Zerosum told me that all 4 tubes are the same. All fine.
schmuck
thermionicjunky wrote:
Kent wrote:

TM-2: a Voltcraft 9VAC 2Amp unit. The TM-2 didn't like anything greater than 9VAC.


Wow, I just tried a 10V supply instead of the supplied 12V and the TM-2 has never sounded better. The hum was completely silenced.


Old post I know but wondered if you kept using the "under current" power supply successfully? Apart from the hum that went, does it sound as it should? what is the ampere value of the 10V supply?
thermionicjunky
schmuck wrote:
thermionicjunky wrote:
Kent wrote:

TM-2: a Voltcraft 9VAC 2Amp unit. The TM-2 didn't like anything greater than 9VAC.


Wow, I just tried a 10V supply instead of the supplied 12V and the TM-2 has never sounded better. The hum was completely silenced.


Old post I know but wondered if you kept using the "under current" power supply successfully? Apart from the hum that went, does it sound as it should? what is the ampere value of the 10V supply?


There's nothing out of bounds about it. The supply requirements are 10-12v and at least 1A. My 10v supply delivers 2.4A (it came with my TM-5.) The sound was always there, but with the VCA open there was a noticable hum. For whatever reason, this circuit performs a bit better on the 10v supply. I don't know why. I haven't noticed much difference with any of the other TM modules (I have the set.)
schmuck
^^^ thanks a lot for your answer! I think I will have to try this. The hum here is quite strong. While I quite like it, it is rather overbearing, and too much removal with x-hum causes ringing sometimes.

Still, having lots of fun with it there are many more sounds in it than one would think...
thermionicjunky
schmuck wrote:
^^^ thanks a lot for your answer! I think I will have to try this. The hum here is quite strong. While I quite like it, it is rather overbearing, and too much removal with x-hum causes ringing sometimes.

Still, having lots of fun with it there are many more sounds in it than one would think...


The easiest way to attenuate the hum is to use the VCA. These pentode VCAs work best with strong CVs (10v or more) and a slight negative offset (to close fully). But I do recommend experimenting with the AC supply voltage.
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