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J.Haible's Living VCO for Eurorack
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Author J.Haible's Living VCO for Eurorack
logicgate
Here's another project I've been sketching. A friend of mine built the living vco and tested with 12v, he said the module works perfectly without any mods, cool! SlayerBadger!


I've got some friends interested in some kits, and this VCO will be included.


I'm not profiting here, I'm making this VCO for me and I'll offer to a group of friends only for the cost of production.


Of course, if there's more people interested I can give the files after everything is 100%

There's still some adjustments to be made, but I'm almost there.


I used board mounted pots and jacks for this one so, no wiring!! we're not worthy







logicgate
I only forgot to mention that I need to make the correct footprint for the 9mm alphas, the ones in it right now are the wrong size.
raisinbag
Omg I'd love one as long as it is all kosher
sammy123
Will there be a panel involved? If so I would be interested.
steffensen
Yes Yes Yes!
thetwlo
raisinbag wrote:
Omg I'd love one as long as it is all kosher


thumbs up same!
fluxmonkey
Quote:
Post subject: IMPORTANT: Copyright, Intellectual Property & Misuse

...To help assist, we ask that forum users do not knowingly share, sell or upload materials that use the intellectual property of others unless they know this material has been approved for use in this fashion.

Additionally, if you feel that your own material is being mis-used here at the forum, please get in touch with myself or one of the moderators and we will remove the offending material.


Since Jurgen is dead, I doubt you have his permission... but email from heaven is dodgy, so I doubt he'll lodge a complaint himself. His IP, and his boards, are currently tied up in courts... once that's cleared up (and it's been a long time already), the profits from his work will support his children. Creating work for sale now would compete with that, and deprive them of income. Unless you have their permission, I think this is in bad taste at best. Please reconsider.
logicgate
fluxmonkey wrote:
Quote:
Post subject: IMPORTANT: Copyright, Intellectual Property & Misuse

...To help assist, we ask that forum users do not knowingly share, sell or upload materials that use the intellectual property of others unless they know this material has been approved for use in this fashion.

Additionally, if you feel that your own material is being mis-used here at the forum, please get in touch with myself or one of the moderators and we will remove the offending material.


Since Jurgen is dead, I doubt you have his permission. His IP, and his boards, are currently tied up in courts... once that's cleared up (and it's been a long time already), the profits from his work will support his children. Creating work for sale now would compete with that, and deprive them of income. Unless you have their permission, I think this is in bad taste at best. Please reconsider.


I'm not creating work for sale, this is a personal project.

There's no profit involved. If I lay down a PCB by myself and have it manufactured, I'm forbidden to share it with my friends? Or any other people interested? I Can't see how I'm possibly stealing his children's money in this situation...

It's not like I'm selling it on ebay or something...
filterstein
Difficult subject.
All the roland clone stuff, the buchla en serges.
If someone claims he has permission, who can verify?
Have you noticed that the envelopes of the crowbx are based on jurgens drawings?
As far as i know he had no problem with personal use.
And in europe we have fair use rights.
oldcrow
Jurgen and I discussed this about 15 years ago. Generally, his take was if he offered schematics and construction tips on a public web site or mailing list, forum, etc. They were "open source hardware" and free to build for non-commercial purposes. He did not mind if PC boards were made to enable others to make his designs as long as it was in the spirit of DIY, that is, intended for hobbyists and musicians to explore some nifty hardware, not for a company to start selling finished products.

I do indeed have a little bit of JH design in the crOwBX, and I make no secret of it. His design core is an inverse-parallel 2-quadrant multiplier, inspired by Doug Curtis' CEM3310 and some suggestions by Joachim Verghese. The CEM3310, from which JH took his design goals, is at the core a 2-quadrant multiplier. The OBX voice cards used CEM3310s, so building a discrete equivalent circuit to act like a CEM3310 is invariably going to use the same approach. JH did his in mostly all transistors, and he had a hold function like Korg MS EGs. I used more traditional elements like a 555 and a 4052, but if you strip away all the front end stuff you are left with a very basic expo converter that just happens to have another expo pair tacked on. The ingenuity is in understanding one pair is reverse-biased while the other is active, which is why it works in the first place.

My point here is it is like putting a steering wheel on a car or a multi-touch screen on a smart phone: it is the functional path of choice in the design.

I also use Tom Wiltshire's PIC code for the noise generator, which again I make no secret of. Tom knows. SlayerBadger!

If logicgate is making boards for himself and a parcel of DIYers, JH would have approved. He wanted his stuff out there in just this sort of way. For himself, he tended to make one of something and move on, because to him design and verifying the design was the allure. It is why his legacy site is filled with all sorts of awesome stuff. Guinness ftw!

--Crow
/**/

filterstein wrote:
Difficult subject.
All the roland clone stuff, the buchla en serges.
If someone claims he has permission, who can verify?
Have you noticed that the envelopes of the crowbx are based on jurgens drawings?
As far as i know he had no problem with personal use.
And in europe we have fair use rights.
sduck
Personally I don't have any issues with this. My only concern is that it's NOT the Living VCOs - only a small subset of the whole thing, and leaving out that little s at the end doesn't really clarify that this is something different. Personally I'd come up with a new name for it, so as not to confuse anyone down the line into thinking they're getting the real deal, when it's not. Does this make sense - ? Otherwise I think it's a fine project.

My actual Living VCOs board keeps on getting put off - I've been meaning to build the thing for ages.
Luka
yeah i must agree

for me living vco is about having a bank of vcos with linear detune
oberkorn
oldcrow: well said, good to hear from someone who knew Jürgen

logicgate: if you do this, I'll be interested!
home_listening
Got to admit I'm still blown away by the angst people feel about cloning Haibles designs.

So we can clone entire synths by people who are still alive (TTSH - Alan Pearlman), too many subsets of the korg/yamaha/roland classics to count, etc etc but not the living VCO?

The situation is identical as I see it.

Jurgen was a valued member of forums and had a dedication to SDIY - making this PCB a fantstic tribute to his memory rather than a grave robbing abomination. It is worth mentioning that he himself had cloned a number of things (1176, entire korg PS3100 I think and the synthi to an extent. So if we aren't putting the man above his own principles, to my mind it is all fair game.

I do feel that I have to say that he was a masterful designer and was a valued member of the electro music forum, my feeling that it is ok to clone his stuff is in no way malicious.
drip.feed
sduck wrote:
Personally I don't have any issues with this. My only concern is that it's NOT the Living VCOs - only a small subset of the whole thing, and leaving out that little s at the end doesn't really clarify that this is something different. Personally I'd come up with a new name for it, so as not to confuse anyone down the line into thinking they're getting the real deal, when it's not. Does this make sense - ? Otherwise I think it's a fine project.

My actual Living VCOs board keeps on getting put off - I've been meaning to build the thing for ages.


What's the difference? seriously, i just don't get it
negativspace
You'd have to build 3 of these to get the "Living VCO" because part of what makes it special is the individual oscillators interacting with one another while linearly detuned.

Build 3. w00t
Pfurmel
sduck wrote:


My actual Living VCOs board keeps on getting put off - I've been meaning to build the thing for ages.


I'll gladly build it for you, if I get to keep it at the end 8_)
spotta
negativspace wrote:
You'd have to build 3 of these to get the "Living VCO" because part of what makes it special is the individual oscillators interacting with one another while linearly detuned.

Build 3. w00t

In that case I'm interested in 3 thumbs up
mxmxmx
negativspace wrote:
You'd have to build 3 of these to get the "Living VCO" because part of what makes it special is the individual oscillators interacting with one another while linearly detuned.


so i take it "linear detune" is labelled "fine" here?

since this is for euro, the thing that seems to be missing though is another op amp stage, or are you (logicgate) doing the "driver" board as well?

edit: well, i guess no, since there's no wiring...
drip.feed
negativspace wrote:
You'd have to build 3 of these to get the "Living VCO" because part of what makes it special is the individual oscillators interacting with one another while linearly detuned.


Do you connect them all together?
2thick4uni
Great, I built the Living VCO's in 5u format when Jurgen first released them then stupidly sold them shortly afterwards. oops

Would be nice to have them again, particularly in Eurorack format.

Jurgen Haible was a genius, lets celebrate his work we're not worthy we're not worthy we're not worthy



.
logicgate
Hello guys! Nice to see this thread going with no anger.


The project is not finished yet! I'll etch this board 1st and see how it goes so I can have them made without any errors.



As negativspace said, you have to build three of them, I decided to make them individually so you could build as many as you want.


If you check the schematics you can see that all three VCOs are the same.


Yes I just labeled the linear detune as "fine", It's not final I was just lazy to type LINEAR DETUNE


I left the amp/driver section out of the equation, a friend of mine said it's unecessary. If the level is good enough there's no point, we'll see!!!

Stay tuned
2thick4uni
logicgate wrote:


I left the amp/driver section out of the equation, a friend of mine said it's unecessary. If the level is good enough there's no point, we'll see!!!



Hmmm, not sure. The output is +/-1.2v as opposed to the usual +/-5v Eurorack standard so its going to be a good bit quieter than other ocillators. It would be very easy to add the non inverting amp from the controller board to bring it up to correct levels.



.
mxmxmx
2thick4uni wrote:
logicgate wrote:


I left the amp/driver section out of the equation, a friend of mine said it's unecessary. If the level is good enough there's no point, we'll see!!!



Hmmm, not sure. The output is +/-1.2v as opposed to the usual +/-5v Eurorack standard so its going to be a good bit quieter than other ocillators. It would be very easy to add the non inverting amp from the controller board to bring it up to correct levels.



.


i agree .. there seems to be plenty of space left on the board and why not be on the safe side.

anyways, cool project. i'd be in, too.
Memory_Leak
interested in three please......maybe more wink
mOBiTh
i'm in 8_)
oberkorn
looking at the original schematics you'll find 3 oscillators AND a driver circuit.

so simply building three oscillators will still leave me without the driver that manages the spread/detune among other things? or am I missing something?
logicgate
oberkorn wrote:
looking at the original schematics you'll find 3 oscillators AND a driver circuit.

so simply building three oscillators will still leave me without the driver that manages the spread/detune among other things? or am I missing something?


Nope, each oscillator has it's own detune feature, it's not a part of the oscillator driver.
logicgate
POLL:

Input attenuators for PWM and FM:

Yay or Nay??



I'm trying to keep this project the simple and cheapest possible.



Cheers!
numan7
thumbs up i definitely think there should be input attenuators for PWM and FM, and don't care if that means an extra 2 to 4 hp of panel-width.

cheers
lombrose
Input attenuators for shure!!!! 8_)
thetwlo
numan7 wrote:
thumbs up i definitely think there should be input attenuators for PWM and FM, and don't care if that means an extra 2 to 4 hp of panel-width.


thumbs up yup. YAY!
2thick4uni
+1 For PWM and FM attenuators
Rigo
Interested in a triplet to ...
oberkorn
Yay to attentuators

Quote:
Nope, each oscillator has it's own detune feature, it's not a part of the oscillator driver.

what does the driver then do?
raisinbag
Haha feature creep+democracy=clusterfuck! Hahahah. Well I have a bunch of simple vco modules and have wanted a livin vco for a while. So I basically take whatever you make and love the idea of as much cool whacky features built in as possible. My advice is to do your take on it and if people want it they will get one.
pre55ure
Interested in a trio if this happens.
sduck
Here's a link to a version of Jurgen's page about this.

http://www.jhaible.com/living_vcos/jh_living_vcos.html

It seems to me that since everyone seems to want 3 of them, put 3 on the pcb. And while the driver board is "unnecessary", the vibrato and portamento features it provides are very nice to have, and really add to the sound of the sound of the thing, so clone that too.

Personally, I'd leave out the "Living" part out of the name unless you're doing a full-on clone of the real thing. Calling it a Jurgen Haible VCO isn't too shabby! But it's your project, do what you want.
mxmxmx
sduck wrote:
Here's a link to a version of Jurgen's page about this.

http://www.jhaible.com/living_vcos/jh_living_vcos.html

It seems to me that since everyone seems to want 3 of them, put 3 on the pcb. And while the driver board is "unnecessary", the vibrato and portamento features it provides are very nice to have, and really add to the sound of the sound of the thing, so clone that too.

Personally, I'd leave out the "Living" part out of the name unless you're doing a full-on clone of the real thing. Calling it a Jurgen Haible VCO isn't too shabby! But it's your project, do what you want.


hmmm, why's that? even if i wanted 3, it certainly will be cheaper to have them made as individual pcbs. in terms of wanting three, bringing out the rails somewhere in addition to the power connector would make sense though. people can always add the driver board, if they felt like it.


but then again, as you say, it's his project ... "almost living vco"
joshuagoran
After learning more about this circuit, I'd definitely be going for three...is it actually cheaper to have them as separate PCBs? I thought they are usually charged by the square inch, in which case it seems impossible that 3 smaller PCBs would be cheaper, especially as the power section of the PCB would be redundant if repeated on three boards. But perhaps I am missing something.

I am not especially opinionated either way about the input attenuators. I would particularly like having them if you are able to lay out the circuit in such a way that you can have extra knobs not necessarily mean much/any extra HP, given that there looks to be a bit of extra space on the ultra-early stage single VCO PCB image and that a layout as it stands wouldn't be very dense yet. I too like the idea of trying to keep this project affordable, so I suppose it depends how much real estate those extra pots would add to the PCB/panel.

I do also like sduck's thought to add in the vibrato and portamento controls if you were to link the 3 VCOs together on a board, but similarly, it's your layout and I am not going to hate on whatever your decision might be.
abendrot
looks very interesting!
is there any kind of audio demo of the original living vcos online?
i found nothing on the haible site or on the tubez seriously, i just don't get it
mxmxmx
joshuagoran wrote:
After learning more about this circuit, I'd definitely be going for three...is it actually cheaper to have them as separate PCBs? I thought they are usually charged by the square inch, in which case it seems impossible that 3 smaller PCBs would be cheaper, especially as the power section of the PCB would be redundant if repeated on three boards. But perhaps I am missing something.


depends, i had in mind people just sending off a file to oshpark or itead et al. oshpark for instance charges by inch, but you get three boards. same of course for a 3-in-1 board, and i guess it wouldn't be too difficult to get rid of those 2 spare ones again. so probably doesn't matter that much, except, i can't see what's wrong with keeping things flexible. perhaps someone wants 2 or 4, with or without vibrato, etc.

well, either way, looking forward...

@abendrot - it's right there on the page http://www.jhaible.com/living_vcos/living_vcos%2520_1.mp3
negativspace
Yeah, I don't think I'd do a trio myself. I think a pair will do fine. I like the idea of single-oscillator boards. thumbs up
sduck
abendrot wrote:
looks very interesting!
is there any kind of audio demo of the original living vcos online?
i found nothing on the haible site or on the tubez seriously, i just don't get it


There's a demo on the linked page I posted a page ago in this thread. It's the whole thing, not just one vco though.
LED-man
Interested in a trio too.
seanpark
I've read Haible's Living VCOs page probably 15 times. Very interested in this circuit.
oldcrow
I made a layout for the living VCOs and driver about a year before JH died. I never made any boards from it. I might make a small run of them for strict DIY purposes. I originally did the layout to revise into one that used my CS VCO cores as the reedy overtones from the CS sawtooth are among my favorite musical sounds.

We'll see. hmmm.....

Crow
/**/
logicgate
Hey Guys!

I finished the proto (without input attenuators) that I'm going to be etching at home for testing. I'm attaching the .BMP files (top/bottom copper & reference designators) to this message.


As requested, I've added another opamp right before the outputs, one input of the TL072 for SAW and the extra input for PULSE.

This is only for the brave lol

I particularly enjoy etching the PCB's at home

Etch and build at your own risk!!! (as I will SlayerBadger! )


You can see that It will be very hard to keep the PCB the same size as it is now when adding the input attenuators for FM and PWM, I'll try my best to squeeze them in.


I won't be building the osc driver part, sorry. The initial idea was to make single oscillators and build as many as you like, I'm going with that. It's a lot easier and people can make their own configuration. I have several other modules that can perform the portamento and vibrato, no need to make the module bigger.


Just for the fun of it here is the 3D preview screaming goo yo :








EDIT:

R40 and R8 trimpots are supposed to be on the other side!
raisinbag
Cool man!
logicgate
Another thought:


I know that LM3046 was used in the original, but, since we only need one matched pair, it seems like it would be better to use MAT02, SSM2210 or a hand matched pair, it's gonna save space on the PCB.

You can save your CA3046 and put it to a better use.

What do you guys think?
oldcrow
Use two 2N3904s. JH made the expo converter cheap on purpose. screaming goo yo

--Crow
/**/

logicgate wrote:
Another thought:


I know that LM3046 was used in the original, but, since we only need one matched pair, it seems like it would be better to use MAT02, SSM2210 or a hand matched pair, it's gonna save space on the PCB.

You can save your CA3046 and put it to a better use.

What do you guys think?
thetwlo
if space is an issue, would making a daughterboard for the pots/jacks make sense? Sure it's a bit more $...
I suppose then you could do a daughter board for a single or a triple--assuming a triple's panel could be smaller than 3-singles.
KnobHell
Congrats logicgate for doing what I tried to do a year ago in making Jurgens work live again!
joshuagoran
oldcrow wrote:
Use two 2N3904s. JH made the expo converter cheap on purpose. screaming goo yo

--Crow
/**/

logicgate wrote:
Another thought:


I know that LM3046 was used in the original, but, since we only need one matched pair, it seems like it would be better to use MAT02, SSM2210 or a hand matched pair, it's gonna save space on the PCB.

You can save your CA3046 and put it to a better use.

What do you guys think?


I think this theory makes sense for this VCO. Seems a bit of imperfection which could come with cheap transistors is part of the charm. And it's definitely the cheaper method smile
Silesius
logicgate wrote:
Hey Guys!

I finished the proto (without input attenuators) that I'm going to be etching at home for testing. I'm attaching the .BMP files (top/bottom copper & reference designators) to this message.


Hey, is it me or there's no attached bmp's? I would like to have a look, and maybe etch my pcb's at home, since I like that too...
logicgate
Silesius wrote:
logicgate wrote:
Hey Guys!

I finished the proto (without input attenuators) that I'm going to be etching at home for testing. I'm attaching the .BMP files (top/bottom copper & reference designators) to this message.


Hey, is it me or there's no attached bmp's? I would like to have a look, and maybe etch my pcb's at home, since I like that too...


heya! Cool!

It's at the bottom of the post with the latest PCB 3D preview.

Cheers!
logicgate
@thetwlo

It's not space being a "issue" but, you know, if we can save HP, why not? Sometimes this saving makes us keep that module on our systems, that otherwise you would have to remove because of the space issue

The idea of a daughterboard is good, but will defeat the "simple and cheap" purpose.

I mean, It's gonna cost the double, and it's not what I have in mind.

A panel for a triple version would be the same thing as three singles. If you check JH's living VCO site
you can see that it's the same thing as three single PCB's side by side. Bottom line: Building 3 singles is the
exact same thing as building 3 osc in the same board.

Right now, the width of the PCB is 58.42mm (aprox. 12HP), wich I think it's good for a single osc.


I'll try to squeeze the attenuators, let's see how it goes.


@Knobhell


Thanks mate!


@oldcrow and josh

Haha yeah, really makes sense!!

It's very easy to lay out on veroboard that moog transistor matching circuit, in no time you get a couple of matched
transistors. Definetely the cheapest route.
8_)
logicgate
Another thought:

A friend of mine suggested to add a waveshaper, so we could get a triangle out of the living VCO.

Googling around I found this:


http://me.ineptum.home.comcast.net/~me.ineptum/asm-1/sawtotri.gif


Very simple, just 7 resistors, two opamps, 1 transistor and 1 cap.


What do you guys think?
negativspace
I almost made the same suggestion... I am in favor. thumbs up
2thick4uni
logicgate wrote:
Another thought:

A friend of mine suggested to add a waveshaper, so we could get a triangle out of the living VCO.

Googling around I found this:


http://me.ineptum.home.comcast.net/~me.ineptum/asm-1/sawtotri.gif


Very simple, just 7 resistors, two opamps, 1 transistor and 1 cap.


What do you guys think?


Well, if we are going to do feature creep then why not put one of Jurgen's A or B wave multipliers on instead? Only 2 opamps,17 resistors, 20 diodes and no caps! hyper



.
FetidEye
hihi
numan7
2thick4uni wrote:
logicgate wrote:
Another thought:

A friend of mine suggested to add a waveshaper, so we could get a triangle out of the living VCO.

Googling around I found this:


http://me.ineptum.home.comcast.net/~me.ineptum/asm-1/sawtotri.gif


Very simple, just 7 resistors, two opamps, 1 transistor and 1 cap.


What do you guys think?


Well, if we are going to do feature creep then why not put one of Jurgen's A or B wave multipliers on instead? Only 2 opamps,17 resistors, 20 diodes and no caps! hyper

.


I agree!

cheers
logicgate
Haha no, no feature creep!!

I was able to squeeze in the attenuators and the waveshaper with a more careful and thoughtful approach.

I replaced the CA3046 with a LS318 footprint, so it's easier to choose between MAT02, SSM2210 or a hand matched pair.


Now we have a final proto:







1st I'm gonna etch the board on page 5 and see if everything is ok, then I'm gonna test this one.

If everything works as planned, soon we gonna have the PCB run.


Cheers!
logicgate
I'm attaching to this message the SCH and PCB files from diptrace, if you'd like to play around with the design or add/change something, as long as it doesn't turn into a 6 OSC PCB with waveshapers, filters and god knows what lol


Right now, the height of the board is 120mm.

If someone more skilled than I could squeeze everything into 100mm tops, the boards could be cheaper!!

Files below.
numan7
we're not worthy awesome work, logicgate--it's looking so beatiful... and almost alive ! Guinness ftw!

This is fun! i can't wait to hear a trio of those tri-waves singing together!!! w00tw00tw00t

cheers
Isaiah
Some 3mm PCB mounting holes would be a welcome addition for those who will build this in formats other than Eurorack.
I imagine they would be very easy to add hihi

Thanks for doing this!
Monobass
definitely interested in 3-6 for personal use
constantin3000
wow, how could I miss this thread in the last days...
I would aswell be interested in 3 boards.

Thanks for doing this!
mxmxmx
logicgate wrote:


Right now, the height of the board is 120mm.

If someone more skilled than I could squeeze everything into 100m tops, the boards could be cheaper!!



hmm, not sure whether that would in fact yield 20mm, but just scrapping the bottom row of pcb mount jacks and replacing them with a little three pin header adjacent to the CV ins might work.

... that's the kind of wiring i can live with, and probably would keep things more comfortably << 128mm.
logicgate
mxmxmx wrote:
hmm, not sure whether that would in fact yield 20mm, but just scrapping the bottom row of pcb mount jacks and replacing them with a little three pin header adjacent to the CV ins might work.

... that's the kind of wiring i can live with, and probably would keep things more comfortably << 128mm.



It's a good idea, what do you guys think?


According to Iteadstudio:

2 layer pcb larger than 10cm x 10cm = US$38 for 5pcs

2 layer pcb 10cm x 10cm = US$24,90 for 10 pcs



It will be 3 x cheaper, it's US$2,50 per board...

If we decide to keep the PCB mount components, each board will be around US$7,50, it's still cheap so, dunno...


I can remove the erthevar jacks and replace them with 3 pin headers, same thing for the pots. The bad thing is that we are gonna have to wire everything...
mxmxmx
i'd definitely keep the pots, i actually had in mind only the saw/pulse/tri jacks, but that of course would only save you ~ 11mm.

i'm not so worried about the price actually, more the leeway.
lessavyfav
Been sniffing around and am excited to get 4-6 of these- if 3 is nice 6 is twice as nice! Whatever you go for is good but 3x cheaper is 3x cheaper ;-) even if the price isn't that high to begin with.
mxmxmx
lessavyfav wrote:
Whatever you go for is good but 3x cheaper is 3x cheaper ;-) even if the price isn't that high to begin with.


mmh, true, and it'll probably hurt more if anyone decided to get them from a pcb house that charged per sq cm.

yet another option: get rid of all the jacks, and do a second optional board with just the 6 jacks, that will reduce wiring to soldering 7 jumpers. in itead terms, that would work out as 10x 10x10 + 10x 10x5 = ca. 4.70 usd per set (plus shipping). i guess i could do it myself but i've got zero experience with diptrace.

people not building it in euro probably won't mind anyways. as far as i am concerned, as long as i don't have to deal with brackets and so on i can stomach a little wiring.
3M-10
Please put me down for 6 VCO's (preferably two trios).

+1 For PWM and FM attenuators, 3VCO's /board and the driver circuit.

It's a fitting tribute to the original design.

Thanks!

3M-10
paulstone
definitely interest in 6 pcb for my use
thx !
raisinbag
Well I'd like to build some in 4u and some in euro so I can live with wiring. If boards are under $3 ill buy like 16 of them. If they are 5-7 probably buy like 8. If there was a main and control pcb is buy half with and half without.
thetwlo
thanks for your work on this! Looks great.
defiantly prefer board mount pots/jacks even if a little daughterboard adds some cost.
Likely in for 6.
thanks!!
tIB
Not checked through the whole thread yet but colour me interested for at least one set, probably two!
tIB
Oh, and I'd probably be building in frac. Don't suppose there is room for a 4 way mta header as well as the euro connect? Would suit people building in 5u too as far as I know.

(Apologies if this has been covered...)
a100user
I'm interested in a set too also for a Frac set-up love
tIB
^ blue panels ftw!
seanpark
I would be happy to build this as-is but am all for the cheaper, format-neutral version.

@logicgate have you seen the dual power footprint fonik used on his Henry PCBs? Basically a MOTM style footprint connected to a euro.

+1 for mounting holes, too.

Thanks for doing this!

EDIT: Just installed diptrace. Looks like a great program.

Latest version has mounting holes! I might play around with a format neutral adaptation but PCB design is new to me.
logicgate
Hey Guys!

After some thinking, I'm deciding to leave this as is, I Was able to put the mounting holes, as requested, but I couldn't find a good way to fit the 4 way mta frac header, sorry!

I mean, I would give US$ 5 (wich is what we were gonna save with a smaller board) to skip the wiring part, which I hate so:lol: , I prefer leaving the PCB mount components.

I was able to reduce the total height of the PCB to 119mm, wich means it will perfectly fit behind a standard 128.5mm euro panel (128.5mm minus 6mm (3mm + 3mm) from top and bottom holes position = 122.5mm) The module will be very shallow so, skiff friendly!

I was able to widen all copper traces a bit more, re-routing some tracks here and there.

I'm attaching the latest file to this message. Diptrace is very easy to use, I'm sure that you can replace the euro connector with the one you want.




Last thing needed to do now is to etch the pcb and test if everything is ok, I believe that til the end of this week or the next I'll be able to do it (I'm out of ferric chloride, but it should be arriving this week). Im still waiting for a laminator to arrive.
raisinbag
Looks cool man. So is there a file that I can use with illustrator to make a drill template for a panel?
logicgate
raisinbag wrote:
Looks cool man. So is there a file that I can use with illustrator to make a drill template for a panel?



Using diptrace's "place dimension" tool I was able to measure everything, very cool! What a powerful and complete software.


It might be off a couple of microns here an there, but who cares anyway


I've attached an image to this message raisingbag, this will guide you.




cheers
raisinbag
SlayerBadger!
logicgate
screaming goo yo
raisinbag wrote:
SlayerBadger!



I've sent you a PM with the .DXF file, illustrator supports it.
seanpark
logicgate wrote:
After some thinking, I'm deciding to leave this as is, I Was able to put the mounting holes, as requested


Dude thanks for sharing this thumbs up

The power connector is not so much of an issue. Mine will likely be thru-powered anyway.

Definitely in for a set if you run them.
oldcrow
Hm, I will have to give diptrace a look. SlayerBadger!
aladan
When it's time to make some boards up, 6 oscillators' worth for me, please. MOTM power preferred, but whatevs Mr. Green thumbs up
oldcrow
Here is the artwork I did a few years back, for reference. One board with the four subsections and my usual split power option (MOTM/"Konkuro"). I want to do a similar thing with CS VCOs. --Crow


joshuagoran
Is the plan to use Alpha/Bourns/similar pots with built in indicators for the input attenuator pots? Just guessing since they're so close to each other, would probably be too tight for use with knobs.

Also, I put together a quick draft version of a panel using FPD just to illustrate spacing. The input attenuators should be at the proper position relative to each other and on the x-axis but I couldn't derive an exact y-position from the attached dimensions. This is just showing the actual holes for pots/jacks, not the nuts or knobs or anything...I mainly wanted to see/show what spacing might look like at this early stage. Text below the knobs would definitely need to be moved down.

I don't mean for this to be anything like a finished panel idea, I sort of wanted to give FPD a quick try and see how things work. It's nice to work with if you're familiar with AutoCAD at all, FWIW, but is difficult to add any type of elements besides what are built in unless you have them as .dxf files already.

My thoughts, should they be worth anything razz
- spacing on the horizontal axis seems okay, but vertically is pushed very far to both extremes. It might be good if the jacks could be moved up and the pots down.

- as I mentioned, the input attenuators seem too close to me to be used with knobs, so they might need to be pots with indicators on the shaft (a la uVCA, Tiptop drums, RLS scale, etc)

- I haven't measured versus any existing PCBs, but it seems to me that the vertical dimensions of the PCB might not fit between the rails on all cases. 128.5mm panel height - 6mm (2x3mm) for the mounting hole centers = 122.5, which leaves 3.5mm space between the edge of the board and the mounting hole centers. I think 1.75mm gap on top and bottom might not be enough, because you also have to figure in the thickness of the rails themselves and that this measurement is only to the screw centers.

Also, I was trying to think of an idea for a name that would make clear the original circuit but also make clear that this is a different beast, "LiVCO" was the best I came up with, might be stupid, might not be necessary.

Hopefully this helps us visualize things as the process goes forward!

sduck
Call it RetroVCO!
logicgate
Very nice, JOsh!! SlayerBadger!


Hum I haven't considered the rails! You are absolutely right, it might not fit, which makes me reconsider removing all PCB mount jacks and pots and making a smaller board with 100% wiring.


Later today I'll try to reduce the PCB height one more time, and make the input attenuators a bit far from each other.


I can send you the .DXF files, then.
joshuagoran
@logicgate,

I'm not sure how it will work in the case of this layout, but you might still be able to pull off having the pots on the board and wire the jacks. I am okay with panel wiring but if there's still hope of minimizing it or at least not having to make a mounting bracket, I'm all for that. From observing other threads, definitely fewer people will be interested in a board that requires wiring, but this isn't a commercial project...though, the more the merrier, of course, and I certainly won't complain about a simpler build thumbs up

If it's all wiring, keeping it to .100 standards as is the norm for 5U/other formats would make wiring easier since we could use headers.

EDIT: and yes, please do send along the next set of .dxf files if you manage to move things around while still having PCB mounted controls of some kind. If you do ditch the board mounted controls, I'll probably shrink my own personal panel to something like 24hp for 3 VCOs to save space.
frozenkore
sduck wrote:
Call it RetroVCO!


Or in tribute, what about LivingMemoryVCO?
sduck
frozenkore wrote:
sduck wrote:
Call it RetroVCO!


Or in tribute, what about LivingMemoryVCO?


thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up Dancing Star Trampoline Dancing Star thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up
2thick4uni
I agree!






.
Paradigm X
Interesting! Will read full thread later.

Really should learn pcb layout...
msprigings
frozenkore wrote:
sduck wrote:
Call it RetroVCO!


Or in tribute, what about LivingMemoryVCO?


Great name!
spotta
frozenkore wrote:
Or in tribute, what about LivingMemoryVCO?

thumbs up lovely idea.
hellpony
This is such a great euro layout by loudestwarning! ...euro banana that is... we're not worthy we're not worthy we're not worthy we're not worthy
thetwlo
how important are the 10-turn pots for this?
sduck
Not important at all, but they look really cool. I've used them on one of my vco's, and found them to be a pain both to get working right and then to use, so didn't use them for the next version of the same vco.
thetwlo
sduck wrote:
...ound them to be a pain both to get working right and then to use,....


Thanks! was wondering, seems like they'd be better suited to fine tune, not as interesting as a live/playable control, where you might want to tweak high to low rapidly.
delayed
Can you post a correctly sized front and back layout to do a PNP etch? Cannot open DipTrace.
seanpark
There was recent talk on the EM thread about R40, PW1ADJ. In the schematics this trimpot is connected to +ve, R39, -ve. On the official PCB it is +ve, R39, ground (sduck checked his pcb).

The frequency trimpot is also connected to +/- on the schematics.
yan6
Sign me up for 3 please.
logicgate
Hello folks!

I started all over and was able to make the board smaller using the PCB mount components, now it will fit behind the panel nicely.

I've added the 4 way header for FRAC or MOTM power, I just don't know if the pitch is correct (used 3.02mm).


Well, the height is shorter, but it gained almost 10mm in width so, it a bit more chubby.









Total height now is 110.5mm screaming goo yo

I don't think this will get any better than this version...
logicgate
@delayed

pm sent with the files


@seanpark

interesting, this will be easy to check after I etch the proto.
sduck
The motm spacing for that part is .156 inches, or roughly 3.9mm, so it's too tight at your spacing.
logicgate
sduck wrote:
The motm spacing for that part is .156 inches, or roughly 3.9mm, so it's too tight at your spacing.



Thx!! Gonna update it thumbs up
logicgate
Done it:

wavehead
this can't happen any sooner.

i want 9 VCO boards when the time comes if at all possible. been wanting LVCOs for years now... have a feeling i could give up on some older vintage synths with a bunch of these racked up.

has anyone used multiple voices of LVCOs for chords/polyphony (2-4 etc.)? i wonder if it would just be too much... actually it would probably be sick.
woodster
I'd be in for a few of these.
logicgate
Alright, now we have a version that might interest more people since it takes less HP.

I removed the erthenvar jacks and replaced by headers, I only kept the 9mm alpha pots, as suggested, to remove the necessity of making brackets, which is a pain, too.

I've added the FRAC - MOTM 4 way pwr header.


PWM IN and FM IN attenuators pots are now a bit more far from each other.


The total height now is 100.5mm (I believe I can still get rid of the .5mm so we can reach the US$2.50 per board mark), and total width is 56mm.


Only a bit of wiring is needed now, here is the "slim" version haha:




raisinbag
Nice! This looks like it has been a good practice of pcb design. You will be a master router now! Good job. As I said at that price I will get at least 16, maybe a few more wink. I have a crazy project in mind.
tIB
Smaller board and mta header ftw!
raisinbag
Curious. Is r11 a tempco? Like 1k?
mOBiTh
How about side-of-board mounted pots (like the fantastic frequency central stuff)?

That way the boards could be stacked vertically behind, and perpendicular to, the faceplate, automatically supported by the pots and it's still easy to wire the jacks with the pcbs in place. This way you could have multiple VCOs on a similar sized faceplate to this design?

A small buffer/mixer pcb could be added for I/O duties etc.

Just a thought...
Monobass
logicgate wrote:
I was able to reduce the total height of the PCB to 119mm, wich means it will perfectly fit behind a standard 128.5mm euro panel (128.5mm minus 6mm (3mm + 3mm) from top and bottom holes position = 122.5mm) The module will be very shallow so, skiff friendly!


whoah there! smile

You need to be coming in no more than about 110mm... you should be leaving 9-10 at each end of the panel free. 108.5mm max would be preferred.

edit: sorry this is solved now... I thought i was at the end of the thread d'oh!
Dave Kendall
"Living memory VCO" on the silkscreen

That's a nice touch. thumbs up

cheers,
Dave
2thick4uni
raisinbag wrote:
Curious. Is r11 a tempco? Like 1k?


Yes, R11 is a 1K 3300ppm/c tempco.

Sounds like quite a project if you're getting 16 of them!

8 voice dual VCO polysynth perhaps? nanners nanners nanners



.
seanpark
Latest version looks great logicgate thumbs up
Monobass
2thick4uni wrote:
raisinbag wrote:
Curious. Is r11 a tempco? Like 1k?


Yes, R11 is a 1K 3300ppm/c tempco.


good time to announce my restock wink assuming 1/6W are ok.

http://www.thonk.co.uk/shop/tempco-resistor-anakeohm-1-3300ppm-x3/
raisinbag
2thick4uni wrote:
raisinbag wrote:
Curious. Is r11 a tempco? Like 1k?


Yes, R11 is a 1K 3300ppm/c tempco.

Sounds like quite a project if you're getting 16 of them!

8 voice dual VCO polysynth perhaps? nanners nanners nanners



.


Thanks tooThick, if anyone can tell me if a 1/6th watt tempco would work in there is be greatfull. I have a whack of those anekom ones I bought on group buy and thought they were 1/4w. I just suck at figuring out the math to see if there is too much juice flowing through the tempco to get away with less than 1/4w.

I'm making a Mono synth with massive ass detained oscillators!!!! Hahahhahahhahaahhahahaha. Seriously it's more like a wall of sound I'm going for. I'm making lots of midi to cv converters. Woo hoo
2thick4uni
raisinbag wrote:
, if anyone can tell me if a 1/6th watt tempco would work in there is be greatfull. I have a whack of those anekom ones I bought on group buy and thought they were 1/4w. I just suck at figuring out the math to see if there is too much juice flowing through the tempco to get away with less than 1/4w.

I'm making a Mono synth with massive ass detained oscillators!!!! Hahahhahahhahaahhahahaha. Seriously it's more like a wall of sound I'm going for. I'm making lots of midi to cv converters. Woo hoo


1/6th Watt tempco will be absolutely fine. Not done the numbers on this one but similar tempco circuits have about 400uA at 180mv or so, you're not going to burn it out! thumbs up

That sounds like some monosynth! screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo



.
raisinbag
Nice! Thanks 2thick.
raisinbag
So an ls318 is an npn pair right? Is there a drop in sub for that?
logicgate
raisinbag wrote:
So an ls318 is an npn pair right? Is there a drop in sub for that?


SSM2210 drop in

MAT02, 2SC1583 (Watch pinout!!! Leg bending needed)
raisinbag
Crap that's what I thought (was just doing some reading back through the thread). I hadn't noticed that it switched from 3046 to 8pinerz. I have like a billion 3046 but none of the other stuff and they are hard to find and big $. What was someone talking about matching 3904's? Can we do that instead of ls318?
logicgate
Your best choice is a hand matched 2N3904 pair, that's what I'm gonna use wink


There's a very simple transistor matching circuit you can lay in a little piece of veroboard:

http://www.dragonflyalley.com/constructionTransistorMatching.htm
raisinbag
How (and by how I mean where do you place matched pair) do you use the matches pain instead? Are the two tranny pads for a matched pair instead? If so do somehow get the tempco to be in contact with them?
wavehead
any vague idea on a time frame when you will be doing a run of these? assuming you are close to a final layout and will order tests soon thereafter?

having both PWM attenuator and PW offset isn't just kinda imo what every VCO needs, but the "over-modulation" of the PMW is something JH made a pretty big part of the LVCO sound.

Quote:
Like the Yamaha CS-80, the Living VCOs have a limited pulse width. Even with strong pulse width modulation, you never "loose" the VCO signal, because you never get down to 0% or up to 100% pulse width. What may sound like a limitation at first, actually opens the possiblitity of "overmodulation": You can modulate the pulse width with a triangle LFO of rather slow rate, and with a depth that would normally be bigger that 100% modulation index. As a result, the modulation is clipped, becomes trapeuoid-shaped. Musically, this is like a periodic "push" of the modulated oscillator's pitch - something that sounds less detuned than ordinary PWM and allows a sonically very rich modulation.


i do think it would be ideal if not only the VCO driver PCB was included, but a panel-mount PCB for everything (3 VCO + driver) with something like this wiring scheme could happen.
http://www.jhaible.com/living_vcos/living_vcos_wiring_opt3.pdf

it seems like a fairly crucial part of what makes JH's design so awesome is the vibrato, portamento, octave switch (so nice to have on any VCO like this) and most of all settings for PMW on both the driver and the individual oscillators.

this could feasibly all happen while still making making cheap smaller boards (with the exception of a pretty big panel mount PCB) for anyone who doesn't care about all of that, but i'm happy just having this available in any form. i'm not complaining!
seanpark
raisinbag wrote:
How (and by how I mean where do you place matched pair) do you use the matches pain instead? Are the two tranny pads for a matched pair instead? If so do somehow get the tempco to be in contact with them?


Generally check the pinout on LS318 datasheet and assign your matched pair's pins accordingly to the board.

Check out ray's pictorial here:
http://www.musicfromouterspace.com/analogsynth_new/ELECTRONIC_PARTS/Ma tched2N3904_MFTempco.php
mxmxmx
logicgate wrote:




The total height now is 100.5mm (I believe I can still get rid of the .5mm so we can reach the US$2.50 per board mark), and total width is 56mm.



nice progress here! so one of these should fit behind 14HP or so, assuming the idea is to have the jacks lined up in a single row? not sure whether one could squeeze in two rows, ie, if 12HP or less was the objective (hmmm, since smd intolerance seems to be on the wane around here ... ).

but 14HP/single row should be perfectly doable, probably not with erthenvar but kobicon or lumberg ones. (in that case, any chance to arrange the headers in a more systematic fashion? something like : v/oct; fm; pwm; pulse; saw; tri (but i guess there's a reason to that)).


@wavehead - as to that driver board, i'm sure someone could/will whip up a board in no time. but if i'm not mistaken, except the op amp stage, which logicgate included, that's just a little CV processor that's got nothing to to with the sound of things really. keeping it out of the equation i think is a good thing, financially, logistically and psychologically speaking (i, at least, would loath building up such a huge thing and it would probably just rot away in some drawer ... anti-living memory)
logicgate
@mxmxmx

Given 1HP is 5.08mm, 14HP = 71.12mm woah


The PCB has 56mm of width = 11HP, I guess the panel must have 12HP


I guess one can have single or double row of jacks.


I would go with double.
logicgate
@wavehead

I believe this weekend I'll be able to etch the proto and test if everything is working as it should.

If yes, then it's just a matter of arranging the manufacturing.


I think that it would be a lot easier if all the people interested could order their own boards. It will be cheaper this way.

There's no reason why I would order a ton of PCB's to Brazil, only to re-send them around the world, not to mention that the customs here is a mess, and things get stuck there for a month, at least.


It's very easy to place an order at Iteadstudio, you just have to choose the board size you want and send them the files.


I'm glad to answer any questions.
wavehead
re: driver board - this isn't really essential at all compared to just having a simple PW offset along with the PWM attenuator IMO.

i'm sure there could easily be a group-buy/order setup out of the US or euro, but maybe this should just be something people can order for themselves.

regardless - i just want some living oscillators. a lot of them.
raisinbag
Haha that's an interesting idea. I have never ordered pcbs myself so if you hold my hand, id go for it.
sduck
Way back in the beginning of the random looping sequencer thread there's an example of crowd-sourcing the group buys - the guy just released the files, and gave relatively easy instructions on how to order from itead. Then various people (including myself) had their own nation specific group buys - it was quite successful, and low burden for the original designer.
Kunfuz
OSHpark is also a good alternative if you just wanna order a few boards Ghost
mxmxmx
logicgate wrote:
@mxmxmx

Given 1HP is 5.08mm, 14HP = 71.12mm :woah:


The PCB has 56mm of width = 11HP, I guess the panel must have 12HP


I guess one can have single or double row of jacks.


I would go with double.


true, preferably 12HP. i have a few of those 100mm boards from itead, and fitting one row of erthenvar jack below or above the board is no problem obviously, not sure about 2 though. but something will work out. i'd prefer double, too. worst case scenario i guess would be to use something like a lumberg KLB 4, which are just 8mm and do zig zag, like so











thetwlo
If we're ordering our own boards would it be too much to also offer a version using the CA3046? Sorry, no idea if that's a simple change or a bit of work.
thanks!
raisinbag
Well I have been thinkin of using a 3046 as well but didn't think it makes any sense to logicgate to redo the whole thing. So I was thinking if I put a 3046 on pref board, ran appropriate pins to some header pins and put those into a socket on the main board it would work fine as long as I got the pins right.
logicgate
@thetwlo and raisinbag

Check CA3046 to determine wich pins correspond to CBE (better check the schematics of the LVCO so you will know wich pins to connect more precisely)

Best way is to use perfboard, as you mentioned.
Isaiah
Hmmm... I wonder if there's sufficient interest for a 6" x 2, 3 or 4" PCB for CGS/Serge-style builds...
I'm sure a 6" x 4" PCB would accommodate a bank of three Living VCOs and the driver circuitry.
Mounting holes 0.15" from each edge, same as CGS PCBs.

Just thinking out loud hihi
logicgate
Heya!

I tried to etch the PCB in it's actual state, but I think that for home fabrication I will have to make the PCB bigger, I found that the holes for the components ended up too small even for my smallest drill (0.8).


Tomorrow I'm gonna widen all holes and pads, space them out a bit more and etch again. Was a fun practice, though! Pity it's going to the trash can.

Tombola
@sduck That's always been my idea - And new services like OSH Park make it even easier - you can order just 3 boards.

They now have a 'shared projects' area just order like it's a shop - https://oshpark.com/shared_projects - and the quality of the boards is incredible

To do that you'd have to open source the design (as I've done with mine) - I'm not sure anyone here would have permission to do that with this particular circuit - unless we're being super legalistic about the theory that 'you can't copyright a circuit, only a particular layout'
msprigings
Interested! The driver board to me is pretty awesome! And the Serge format I vastly prefer for my own selfish reasons.

Isaiah wrote:
Hmmm... I wonder if there's sufficient interest for a 6" x 2, 3 or 4" PCB for CGS/Serge-style builds...
I'm sure a 6" x 4" PCB would accommodate a bank of three Living VCOs and the driver circuitry.
Mounting holes 0.15" from each edge, same as CGS PCBs.

Just thinking out loud hihi
raisinbag
logicgate wrote:
Heya!

I tried to etch the PCB in it's actual state, but I think that for home fabrication I will have to make the PCB bigger, I found that the holes for the components ended up too small even for my smallest drill (0.8).


Tomorrow I'm gonna widen all holes and pads, space them out a bit more and etch again. Was a fun practice, though! Pity it's going to the trash can.



That looks great! Glad to see its comin along. DON'T THROW IT OUT, ahhhhh! If you are really gona throw it out, send it to me with my midi bud, ill hang it I my wall and frame it!!!!! So when you are a famous synth desiger, it will be like a "gold record". we're not worthy
yan6
Great work, looking forward to the next version.

+1 for driver board hihi
logicgate
raisinbag wrote:


That looks great! Glad to see its comin along. DON'T THROW IT OUT, ahhhhh! If you are really gona throw it out, send it to me with my midi bud, ill hang it I my wall and frame it!!!!! So when you are a famous synth desiger, it will be like a "gold record". we're not worthy[/quote]


Haha if you are really want it I can send it to you lol


Now, famous synth designer, that is a couple of light years ahead, perhaps hihi



Alright, new board etched, I've changed the layout so it was easier to etch and drill, we're almost there!





Hand is sore of so many holes!! waah
raisinbag
WOO HOO! THanks! Ya between you and Hex, you are like synth Crack dealers! Man, anytime you come to Canada, my drill press is open to you for free use! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! Looks like you got the two sides lined up really nice, good job
logicgate
Thx mate! A drill press would be perfect! w00t

We are halfway thru now:









It's looking like trash!!! lol
raisinbag
NICE! Just remember, I'll take all your garbage. Thats one crazy looking board, luv it.

So do you use toner transfer for your hand etches?
logicgate
raisinbag wrote:
NICE! Just remember, I'll take all your garbage. Thats one crazy looking board, luv it.

So do you use toner transfer for your hand etches?



Haha ok, I Won't forget.


Yep, glossy or magazine paper laser printed, then clothes iron (but now I received the iron plate laminator finally! I haven't tested yet but I believe that the results are gonna be much better).
raisinbag
Hmm I have had so much trouble with using magazine paper with lazer print. Only some of the toner is sticking to aluminum (I'm making panles) so I must be doing something wrong. Anyway wrong thread, but your pcb looked so good I was curious.
Jarno
logicgate wrote:
....then clothes iron (but now I received the iron plate laminator finally! I haven't tested yet but I believe that the results are gonna be much better).


Did you have that many "misfires" with the clothes iron? I have that bit pretty much down, I always use Epson inkjet photo paper. Scrub board with steelwool, acetone to degrease it, put the paper on if the copperclad board has dried, then iron. Really going over the traces, make sure the edges are also done. Straight in the cold water, leave it until the paper comes off easily, scrub with thumbs to remove white residue, leaving the toner.
Interested the results of the flat plate, I actually think the results might be worse, because of the un-flatness of the pcb, warpage. With the iron you can really push down on some places where fine tracks are, and with the plate you do not have this kind of adjustment.
logicgate
@raisinbag

yeah, depends of the magazine, the good (expensive ones) with more thick and shiny paper are very good. The thin ones are not very good, but do work. The glossy paper is the best I think, I'm waiting for transfer paper for PCB (from ebay), let's see if it's good.

I also have had good results with the crap you receive in the mail box (advertise, flyers), they use very good paper on some.

@jarno

Not many misfires, but I got a good deal on the laminator and couldn't resist. It's very sturdy and has a industrial look, it goes over 300C (temperature is adjustable via knob) and doesn't jam with thick material. I'm gonna post a pic later.

I can test it and post the results here
logicgate
Here it is:






It goes up to 200C, not 300C as I said in my previous post (had 300 in my head lol )
LektroiD
If these get produced, I'd be in for a set of 3, provided Euro panels are made...
samuraipizzacat29
whoa, i've stayed away far too long. this looks great.

Nice that someone's willing to take up the torch for the sake of fun smile

Nate
Jarno
+1

Now for someone to make the driver as well w00t

Nice laminator btw, indeed looks very sturdy.
I sometimes make frontpanels using toner transfer, and get uneveness because of the clothesiron, the laminator might solve that very nicely.
yan6
Hi there, I'm Just checking in to see if there has been any more progress on this
seanpark
I wonder if logicgate ever built the one he etched?
drip.feed
Waiting very patiently here... MY ASS IS BLEEDING
logicgate
Hey guys!

I haven't finished soldering all components in to the board yet. Dead Banana


TBH, it's gonna take a bit longer than I expected, but it will definetely happen.


The thing is that I got divorced and now I'm in the process of moving to another city, and as you all know, moving sucks big time.

I have packed up everything into boxes. Only when I get to my "new" home (ok I'll admit it, my mother's) and set up my bench again I'll be able to resume it.

I still have deal with divorce papers and stuff.


But I promise it's the 1st thing I'm gonna do once I'm settled.

Cheers
drip.feed
logicgate wrote:
I got divorced and...

WOAH! Didn't realise that dude, sorry. d'oh!

Look after number #1. We'll still be here when you get your life back again. thumbs up
negativspace
Ugh, man, I've been exactly there. I packed what I could fit in my car and drove 800 miles to my mother's place. Fucking mess. Right decision in the end, though, no matter how hard it was.

Needless to say, if there's anything we can do for you...
nidas
I´m also in for 3 if and when it will be finished..

Cheers
3M-10
I'm in for 4!
thx.
InfraXpert
Put me down for 4, please
Thanks for doing this.
logicgate
Hey guys,

Bumping this thread just to say that this is still happening.

Now that I'm back on my feet again, things are rolling



About 6 months ago my life flipped upside down, but now all is fine.



Ok, I went thru all my boxes and couldn't find the damned prototype that I etched to test the circuit. So I started breadboarding it and half the way thru I found out I didn't have a couple of crucial components to finish it. Placed the order already a couple of weeks ago, might be getting something in the next weeks (here everything takes a long time to arrive from abroad).


But hang in there cause this is happening for sure, it was just stalled.
steffensen
logicgate
Just wanted to say I'm glad your back on your feet again!
Take your time, stuff like this is worth it.
Dego
I agree smile
logicgate
Hello there!

Has anyone here ever breadboarded successfuly the living vco schematics found here http://www.jhaible.com/living_vcos/jh_living_vcos.html

Today I tried two times and it didn't work Dead Banana


I didn't expect it to work right away, but at least I should have gotten something out of the circuit.

2nd time I meticulously put it together, exactly as depicted on the schematics, and it just didn't work.


I wonder if there's something missing or there's an error, but this is beyond my skills. This might represent an impasse for this project...


Tomorrow I'm gonna try one more time


EDIT:

I found a post on electro music forum mentioning some resistor changes to make it work on +12/-12v, gonna try them tomorrow.

But I still think that even powering it from 12v and using the original resistors value I would at least had heard something... It's a simple circuit to breadboard.
kvitekp
I've breadboarded JH LVCOs using schematics from Jurgen's site and it works as is, there are no errors. I did not test it with 12V though.
logicgate
kvitekp wrote:
I've breadboarded JH LVCOs using schematics from Jurgen's site and it works as is, there are no errors. I did not test it with 12V though.


Hello Peter!

Cool, that's good news, then...

I've got your PM, thanks for the reply mate! thumbs up


I don't know if my breadboard is of dubious quality or what, I'll try again tomorrow using the resistors changes for 12v and if it doesn't work I'll start swapping the IC's and caps.


Since you have it on you breadboard, when you have a spare time, would you make a quick test with 12v, just to confirm if anything comes out of the saw core.


Cheers mate we're not worthy
Randy
Finally listened to a demo of this on Youtube, wow! Count me on the interest list.

Randy
logicgate
Another frustrating day at the bench Dead Banana

Today I VERY slowly and paying close attention to the schematics and breadboard, laid it together again, but I only have silence at the output...

I'm very hmmm..... hmmm..... hmmm..... hmmm..... hmmm..... lol


Used the values indicated for 12v usage, swapped caps, IC's, only silence!

Tomorrow I'll try again. Nevertheless, I'm having a prototype PCB made (based in the last PCB design). In the meantime I'll keep trying to breadboard it.

kvitekp
When you re-build it, you may want to build it in blocks making sure that each one works as expected: start with pitch CV scaler op amp and expo converter, it should produce a current out of U2 pin 5. Then add oscillator integrator with the discharge transistor, you can test it by shorting Q3 base to ground -- if you set frequency pot to low, you'll see it charging slowly after you unshort Q3 base to ground. Then add comparator loop back which automatically discharges integrator capacitor when its voltage reaches threshold.
logicgate
Hello Peter! Thanks for the tips, gonna rebuild tomorrow following your steps.


Here's a close up of the SAW core, I added the components value, if someone is interested in helping.

kvitekp
Here are three basic blocks JH LVCO is built with:







Hopefully this will help you to identify blocks that do not function correctly.
Now and Zen
It is probably easiest to get the oscillator working without the expo converter and summing stage. The expo converter simply sinks current from the timing cap to ground, the rate depends upon the conduction of the relevant expo transistor - it is best to disconnect the expo stage and connect a resistor (or two pins of a pot) pot between the timing cap (on the emitter of Q3 side) and ground. Varying the resistance will change the rate of oscillation. Once you get this running then you can connect up expo converter and debug further.
logicgate
Peter and Now and Zen, thank you for the GREAT tips!!

It LIVES!!! Well, sort of, the FREQ pot does nothing, even though I can see in pin 1 of U1 that it goes from 0v to 12v when I turn it from FCCW to FCW.

I thought that maybe Q3 was backwards, and I discover that when fliping the orientation I get a low freq output or a higher freq, I uplodaded a video!!

We're almost there.
logicgate



I got it! had to remove the "s" from http
logicgate
What I discovered so far:

mechie
logicgate wrote:
even though I can see in pin 1 of U1 that it goes from 0v to 12v when I turn it from FCCW to FCW.


PLUS 12v?
logicgate
mechie wrote:
logicgate wrote:
even though I can see in pin 1 of U1 that it goes from 0v to 12v when I turn it from FCCW to FCW.


PLUS 12v?



thumbs up


I posted a pic on the post above your question
Now and Zen
Should be 0 to -12v as it's gone through an inverting opamp. You usually need around -18mv per octave on the base of current mirror transistor, so looks somewhere near.

Good to see it running thumbs up
logicgate
Now and Zen wrote:
Should be 0 to -12v as it's gone through an inverting opamp. You usually need around -18mv per octave on the base of current mirror transistor, so looks somewhere near.

Good to see it running thumbs up


Yup,

If you check the schematics, FREQ_1 is connected to -V, than it's going to inverting input (pin 2), and then comes out as positive.


EDIT:

I've just tested using positive instead of negative (at FREQ_1) and it made no difference at all
Now and Zen
logicgate wrote:
Now and Zen wrote:
Should be 0 to -12v as it's gone through an inverting opamp. You usually need around -18mv per octave on the base of current mirror transistor, so looks somewhere near.

Good to see it running thumbs up


Yup,

If you check the schematics, FREQ_1 is connected to -V, than it's going to inverting input (pin 2), and then comes out as positive.


EDIT:

I've just tested using positive instead of negative (at FREQ_1) and it made no difference at all


Ah, ok, the Freq control is putting a negative offset voltage in. The actual 1v/oct voltages are positive though, so will be inverted and divided down to around -18v per oct. The more negative the voltage at B2 of U2, the higher the VCO frequency.
mechie
logicgate wrote:
What I discovered so far:


OK, I'm curious to know what is happening on U2 pins 1 and 3...
Could you do a little table of U1 output, U2 pins 1, 2 and 3 for U1 outputs in maybe 1v steps? (with R10 in place as it should be)
logicgate
I took a step back d'oh!

Yesterday I got too confident for getting it to work that I decided to unmount everything and rebuild again... Now it doesn't work anymore LOL lol


It's weird cause It's EXACTLY the same (because I followed the video frame by frame), but now I have the SAW output stuck at 9v.


I even copied the schematics in diptrace, making sure they were exactly as the one in JH site, exported to PCB, ran the autorouter, then I placed the components as they were connected in the virtual PCB, but it doesn't work...






There we go again, at least now I'm putting it together 3x faster

lol
logicgate
I think that living vco is a proper name for this oscillator. I accidentally caused a short circuit while I was poking around, and it suddenly sort of started to work. I think it needed to be defibrillated or something. I have a ramp every 10 seconds at SAW output, it's like it's working veeeeery slow, super LFO
kvitekp
Sounds like a dodgy breadboard to me. JH LVCO is very stable and perfectly reproducible circuit. I've breadboarded quite a few variants with a number of modifications and they all worked right away.
logicgate
kvitekp wrote:
Sounds like a dodgy breadboard to me. JH LVCO is very stable and perfectly reproducible circuit. I've breadboarded quite a few variants with a number of modifications and they all worked right away.



That's exactly what I'm thinking. At least I have an extra breadboard still on package, but it's of the same brand, a smaller model... And the other small ones I have are those chinese ones from ebay.
logicgate
Hello Peter,

I moved to another breadboard and and started rebuilding in blocks, as you suggested. Right at the start I don't have current out of pin 5 of U2, so no point in going further til I get this right, even though everything is wired as the schematic. I get the exact same result as the previous build. I have a bag of CA3046, BC550 and BC560, kept swapping them, same results so, it's not the components.

logicgate
I think I know what the problem is...

The transistors I have here are BC560 (with no "C" at the end), and the BC550B


Maybe the transistors must be of the "C" variant to work.


I ordered a bunch, now it's waiting time
logicgate
SUCCESS!!!

It was the damned transistors!!!


It seems that the LVCO will only work using C variant transistors!



These were the ones I was using:







I swapped them with their C variant and the LVCO came to life instantly!!








Prototype board based in the latest PCB will be ready next week I think. I'll probably change the pots and use alpha 16mm instead of PC mount 9mm.


5 x 9mm pots it's like US$10 Vs. US$2,50 for 5 16mm, way cheaper. Then I'm gonna place them on the edge of the PCB, a la frequency central style.


Any thoughts?
Isaiah
Glad you got it working!

Please include mounting holes thumbs up
logicgate
Isaiah wrote:
Glad you got it working!

Please include mounting holes thumbs up



Yes, definetely.


Another thing to mention:


What you hear is straight out of U1.7


I don't even think it needs the AMP stage, I'm thinking it's loud enough already. I'm gonna compare with the bubblesound VCOb I got here, but It's almost the same loudness. Well, I don't know how loud the square wave will sound cause I have to laid the PWM circuit part now, let's see.


If indeed there's no need for the AMP stage, costs will be even lower and PCB smaller.
seanpark
Excellent!
oldcrow
Aha, this is the same issue MC and I ran across on crOwBX voice boards. The nominal current gain of the BC550C is 2x that of the BC550B. Similarly, the nom. hfe of a 2N3906 is 2x that of a 2N3905. screaming goo yo screaming goo yo

--Crow
/**/

logicgate wrote:
SUCCESS!!!

It was the damned transistors!!!
kvitekp
logicgate wrote:

I don't even think it needs the AMP stage, I'm thinking it's loud enough already. I'm gonna compare with the bubblesound VCOb I got here, but It's almost the same loudness. Well, I don't know how loud the square wave will sound cause I have to laid the PWM circuit part now, let's see.


If indeed there's no need for the AMP stage, costs will be even lower and PCB smaller.
Glad you figured it out!

PULSE output is about 2.5V peak to peak, see those 4 level shaping diodes D1-D4. For this reason positive only saw output from U1.7 is normalized to about the same amplitude by voltage divider (R24/R25) and shifted down to swing around 0V by R26, so resulting saw has similar amplitude and offset as pulse signal.

2.5V PP is too low for module synthesizer standards, so you'll need an amp stage to bump the amplitude. The amp stage also provides necessary output buffering, so I don't think it is a good idea to drop it.
kvitekp
BTW, if your JH LVCO is powered by +-12V you may want to tweak R24/R25/R26 so the saw output matches the pulse output amplitude and offset. This is because saw amplitude is set by R21/R22 which depends on +V: your saw will be 8V PP versus original 10V PP. Alternatively, you can probably tweak R21/R22 to produce 10V, however it's not clear if pulse wave shaper powered by 12V prefers 8V or 10V saw on input. LTSpice is your friend wink
logicgate
Hello Peter!

PWM circuit works, SUCCESS!


Thanks for your great help thumbs up


You were spot on on the measurements, I was getting 2.6v peak to peak on pulse. I ended up adding the AMP stage.


Now, can you tell me if the pulse width pot has a very subtle effect on the pulse wave?

Calibration says to leave at 12 o'clock position - check

Then adjust R40 until we get a 50% pulse wave, but It seems I can't get it, the wave disappears. I can get a very narrow pulse when R40 is FCC, but I can't get a 50% pulse.


Although I can hear PWM when I turn the pot, it's barely noticeable on the scope, I made a video:





EDIT:

I used a sinewave to modulate the PW, and I have signal drop outs when pulse goes to 0%. I was reading the vco description at JH site, and it mentions that the pulse never goes up 100% or below 0%, so we never have dropouts, so I believe there's some tweaking to be done
seanpark
There are two differences I know of between the published schematics and Jurgen's PCBs.

On the PCB R37 is referenced to ground instead of -V, R6 is added at R30/31 junction to ground.
logicgate
seanpark wrote:
There are two differences I know of between the published schematics and Jurgen's PCBs.

On the PCB R37 is referenced to ground instead of -V, R6 is added at R30/31 junction to ground.



Hello Sean!

Thanks for the info. I added R6 to the circuit and it made no difference.


Now, R37?? It's connected between R40 and Q7, how it's referenced to -V??



Now, I found out I had a little mistake, and now I can get 10% 90% pulse when adjusting R40, but PW pot does almost nothing. I replaced the 100K pot with 1M pot and now I have a better range, still, I think I should get a bit more.

seanpark
Oops it's R40 not R37.
logicgate
Cool!

I just made the change and, comparing to the last video, the width range improved a little bit, but it's not quite there yet (almost, though).

I'm pretty sure it's 1 resistor change and that's it
lombrose
applause
kvitekp
In my LVCO I had to almost double the value of R38 (267K instead of 150K) in order to achieve nice PWM modulation range for +-5V modulation CV.
wavehead
the "overmodulation" on PWM is a pretty key part of the LVCO, isn't it? that sound is awesome on all the examples i've heard of it.. so i hope the pulse waveshaping reflects that effect.

would be pretty cool and i imagine fairly useful if someone could lend/send logicgate a killer build from the JH PCBs to compare his own version with? probably overkill, but then again overkill is (imo) fairly appropriate when it comes to JH's killer designs.
kvitekp
Yep, PWM overmodulation sounds nice. Here's a short video demonstrating how it works on my LVCO with R38 changed from 150K to 267K: trapezoid modulation starts when the PWM knob is at 12 o'clock.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUNnOlwZowc
logicgate
Hello!

Thanks a lot for the video Peter, very helpful!

I had no 267K so I used 300K for the modulation input, working nice! However, no attenuation in this video I just made, LFO straight into modulation input.

I changed R39 to 220K and now I'm able to get almost the full range of the width when turning the PW pot, just some more tweaking and that's it. I get full range width with CV modulation.


logicgate
PWM Circuit Success!!

Everything working nicely now.

I can get the same pulse width range with pot and CV modulation now!! applause


So, to make it work nicely with +-12v, changes were:

PW_1 Pot changed to 1M

R39 - 520K (had to use 510K + 10K in series)

R36 - 1M5

R5 - 120k
R7 - 390k
R12 - 1k8
R22 - 47k
R24 - 4k7
R33 - 33k
R34 - 10k






Now I'm gonna test two SAW to TRI converter circuits and choose what works best.
logicgate
SAW to TRI converter circuit WORKING!!

I used the circuit found at MFOS website:

http://www.musicfromouterspace.com/analogsynth_new/SAWTOTRICONVERT/ima ges/saw%20to%20tri%20converter%20schem.gif


Works very nicely, signal will need amplification after conversion, though:






Now I'm gonna try this one

http://electro-music.com/forum/phpbb-files/sawtotri_186.gif

And compare the results
kvitekp
Here's the one I added to my JH LVCO driver board, it's identical to your second link. BC550C works, however the switching spike seems to be smallr with original 2N3904.
kvitekp
BTW, if you have triangle wave, it would make sense to employ unused half of the LM13700 OTA on the JH LVCO driver board for triangle to sine conversion, just like it's done in vibrato LFO built with the first half.

I did not do it on my driver board, and now regret it: the sound of just two linearly detuned LVCOs is so HUGE that adding a third LVCO is too much most of the time, however adding a nice sine wave to round up the bottom end may be useful.
Isaiah
Maybe consider the Saw-Triangle convertor featured here:
http://hem.bredband.net/bersyn/VCO/vco_ministyle.html

I'm not sure of the amplitude or bias requirements of the input sawtooth though.

I have no experience with this circuit.
logicgate
@kvitekp and Isaiah

Thx for the schematics! Gonna try them too!


Peter, I'm not building the driver part, I'm doing standalone VCO boards so people can build as many as they want.
logicgate
Here is Berfgotron SAW to TRI test. This is the best triangle shape I could get after trimming. I found it very buzzy. So, I'm sticking with MFOS converter, it sounded very good to me. What do you guys think?? Now I just need to make the final PCB revision and it's manufacturing time!!

It's peanut butter jelly time!


kvitekp
logicgate wrote:
Peter, I'm not building the driver part, I'm doing standalone VCO boards so people can build as many as they want.

Yeah, I also did one VCO per board since this makes a lot of sense. However, I also have the driver board, it has everything JH had on it plus saw to triangle converter, see here:

logicgate
Beautiful build, Peter!! we're not worthy


Things here starting to take shape!

Jarno
Looks great, but, bigger pads for the pots, ICS and power header?
logicgate
Jarno wrote:
Looks great, but, bigger pads for the pots, ICS and power header?



Definetely.

I usually customize the silkscreen and pads after all placement is done, never use the default library. Boar will be smaller than this! I'm still tidying it up!
logicgate
Final version:


[/img]
Barcode
logicgate wrote:
Peter, I'm not building the driver part, I'm doing standalone VCO boards so people can build as many as they want.


Darn. I really wish you were doing the driver. Oh well, I guess I'll have to make my own. Anyway, I take 3 boards.
logicgate
@Barcode

Hi mate,

I'm not selling any boards, project files will be available here so people can order as many as they want.


I have just placed an order at Itead Studio, 10 PCBs for US$19!!! nanners


I'll attach the gerber files here in this post, people can open them and check them.


Caps C7 and C8 are 1uf aluminum non-polarized.

SMD caps are all 100nf.
Phetus
so if i just send the gerber files to itead studio, i should get 10 working pcbs in return?

and regarding is this open source? it isn't, is it?
logicgate
Phetus wrote:
so if i just send the gerber files to itead studio, i should get 10 working pcbs in return?

and regarding is this open source? it isn't, is it?



Still need the drilling file!! I forgot to put it together in the rar file


Gonna add to this post!



This PCB was designed following the schematics and the mods I did for 12v operation. I've spent 2 whole weeks debugging some minor errors so, this version is supposed to be working 100%. Since I haven't received the PCBs and built one, I cannot tell you they are 100% working, but I believe so.

You might want to wait a bit for me to receive my order and build at least one.


And yes, it's open source, definetely.


Cheers!
Phetus
Hihi, thanks. Ok I'll hold out till you've made one I think smile
sammy123
Barcode, you want to go in on an order?
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
Barcode, you want to go in on an order?


Sure! I'm making a couple changes to the PCB (adding pots for PWM and FM / headers for all of the pots) that should be ready this weekend. I'll PM you when everything is ready.
Phetus
Barcode, would you be willing to share your version of the PCB when its done? Thanks.
logicgate
@Barcode

For FM and PWM attenuation you didn't need to add headers, only add the pots to the panel and wire the fm/pwm jacks to the pots, and then to the PCB... at least it's what I'm gonna do. There's a 0v pad on the PCB that will provide the ground for all jacks and pots, in case you didn't notice... (excluding the three PCB mount pots, of course)
Barcode
logicgate wrote:
@Barcode

For FM and PWM attenuation you didn't need to add headers, only add the pots to the panel and wire the fm/pwm jacks to the pots, and then to the PCB... at least it's what I'm gonna do. There's a 0v pad on the PCB that will provide the ground for all jacks and pots, in case you didn't notice... (excluding the three PCB mount pots, of course)


I've been on an anti-wiring kick lately. I plan on setting it up to have a similar pot and jack layout to the FC stuff.

BTW, thanks for the layout files!
logicgate
Barcode wrote:
logicgate wrote:
@Barcode

For FM and PWM attenuation you didn't need to add headers, only add the pots to the panel and wire the fm/pwm jacks to the pots, and then to the PCB... at least it's what I'm gonna do. There's a 0v pad on the PCB that will provide the ground for all jacks and pots, in case you didn't notice... (excluding the three PCB mount pots, of course)


I've been on an anti-wiring kick lately. I plan on setting it up to have a similar pot and jack layout to the FC stuff.

BTW, thanks for the layout files!



Haha I feel you, I hate wiring too.


I thought about adding all pots to PCB, but didn't like how the panel was going to look, with all pots in a single row..,
sammy123
Nice Barcode. This is exciting.
Barcode
Here is my progress of the "Barcode Edition" of logicgates version of JH's Living VCO (wow that was a mouthful).

I added the pots for FM and PWM. All of the pots also have pads with a 2.54mm pitch so 9mm pots or header pins can be used. The pots are spaced 20mm apart. Also added was headers for each of the inputs / outputs. I added these because I'm kinda anal about keeping them all in the same area on the board. The original pads were left on the board so either can be used. The PCB size has grown a small amount to 98.5mm x 62mm.

I am working on the Driver PCB at the moment. Everything from the original schematic will be on the PCB minus the amp section which is already included on the VCO boards. I also plan on adding a few triangle to sine converters.

Once I have everything verified, I will share the gerbers.

Updated: The "Barcode Edition" now has larger drill holes for the tempco and pads for a 0805 version under the 3046. I also added R3 and a Driver In pad.

logicgate
Good job!! applause
Nordcore
Drills and pads for the tempco looks like for a standard resistor.

Thats very tight, I'd go for 1.1mm drill.

(The KRL Tempcos have 0,8mm wires = fits hardly on a usual 0.8mm resistor hole ... )
roglok
Nordcore wrote:
Drills and pads for the tempco looks like for a standard resistor.

Thats very tight, I'd go for 1.1mm drill.

(The KRL Tempcos have 0,8mm wires = fits hardly on a usual 0.8mm resistor hole ... )


maybe you could make a provision for an SMT tempco underneath the 3046?
looks like a couple of vias should do
logicgate
Nordcore wrote:
Drills and pads for the tempco looks like for a standard resistor.

Thats very tight, I'd go for 1.1mm drill.

(The KRL Tempcos have 0,8mm wires = fits hardly on a usual 0.8mm resistor hole ... )



I haven't thought of that, mainly because what I'm gonna use are those anakeohm tempcos (is that right?) and they look like a regular resistor, I'm not using the bandry on this build. Maybe barcode can make the pads and respective holes wider.
Barcode
logicgate wrote:
I haven't thought of that, mainly because what I'm gonna use are those anakeohm tempcos (is that right?) and they look like a regular resistor, I'm not using the bandry on this build. Maybe barcode can make the pads and respective holes wider.


Done! I updated the image above. thumbs up
Barcode
Over the weekend I was able to get the first version of the driver pcb designed. It doesn't look pretty but it should work. I also included 3 x triangle to sine converters.

raisinbag
Where the hell is the "like" button MY ASS IS BLEEDING
Barcode
I'm don't mean to hijack this thread but..... Another update to the project I'm working on. I started working on a front panel today. The current version is 40hp. I am trying to squeeze another 4 hp out of it. We will see how that goes. I plan on using 9mm pots to keep everything compact.

logicgate
Very nice barcode!! we're not worthy

Keep us updated
Barcode
The gerber files are on page 42....
samuraipizzacat29
Thank you! This is the true spirit of DIY.
synchromesh
SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! screaming goo yo

Fantastic! Thanks very much for that, it's very inspiring. I feel an iTead order coming on, followed by a PCB giveaway... Although if someone else wanted to verify the layout first, that would be great too. hihi
sammy123
Hey Barcode, in case you didn't get my PM....I am all in.
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
Hey Barcode, in case you didn't get my PM....I am all in.


I got your PM. thumbs up I forgot I needed to purchase plane tickets this week so I'm going to have to wait until Friday to order the boards.
sammy123
No rush at all. Thank you.
drip.feed
Watching this topic all right. love
InfraXpert
Will there be a BOM for the "Barcode Edition"?
Barcode
InfraXpert wrote:
Will there be a BOM for the "Barcode Edition"?


There are no changes to the Core BoM. I only added all of the pots to the boards and few extra headers. I'm working on putting together the Driver / Waveshaper BoM today.
tojpeters
I'd like to get in on this- but I don't think I need 10 of each.
Anybody want to split an order,or sell me some of your spares?
Barcode
The BoM's are on page 28.
aladan
tojpeters wrote:
I'd like to get in on this- but I don't think I need 10 of each.
Anybody want to split an order,or sell me some of your spares?


I'm looking to grab 4, from anyone who gets some boards made up. Somewhere in Oz would be great to save on postage costs, but not really that fussed.

Cheers,
A.
Barcode
tojpeters wrote:
I'd like to get in on this- but I don't think I need 10 of each.
Anybody want to split an order,or sell me some of your spares?


I should have a few extras of both the Core and Driver PCB's. I would just need you to cover the cost of the boards and shipping.
aladan
Barcode wrote:
tojpeters wrote:
I'd like to get in on this- but I don't think I need 10 of each.
Anybody want to split an order,or sell me some of your spares?


I should have a few extras of both the Core and Driver PCB's. I would just need you to cover the cost of the boards and shipping.


Sounds good... actually, sounds great! Count me in for 4 of each, please - shipping plus my share of the cost of manufacture. And I'll certainly cover any paypal fees & charges.

Thank you very much!

Cheers,
A.
Barcode
aladan wrote:
Sounds good... actually, sounds great! Count me in for 4 of each, please - shipping plus my share of the cost of manufacture. And I'll certainly cover any paypal fees & charges.

Thank you very much!

Cheers,
A.


So 4 Core and 4 Driver PCB's? You understand how the living VCO works right? 1 Driver controls 3 Cores.
aladan
Barcode wrote:
aladan wrote:
Sounds good... actually, sounds great! Count me in for 4 of each, please - shipping plus my share of the cost of manufacture. And I'll certainly cover any paypal fees & charges.

Thank you very much!

Cheers,
A.


So 4 Core and 4 Driver PCB's? You understand how the living VCO works right? 1 Driver controls 3 Cores.


Obviously I do not understand. I thought you'd made a standalone VCO, and the "driver" was just one of those euro PCBs for mounting components that seem to be all the rage these days.

I will go re-read the whole thread :-)
Barcode
Check out my panel design on the bottom of page 25. It should give you an idea of how everything works. Each VCO can be used as a standalone or the driver can control them all together. The switch on each of the VCO's determines that. Everything else should be pretty self explanatory.

I plan to put together a wiring diagram soon.
aladan
Barcode wrote:
Check out my panel design on the bottom of page 25. It should give you an idea of how everything works. Each VCO can be used as a standalone or the driver can control them all together. The switch on each of the VCO's determines that. Everything else should be pretty self explanatory.


Right, all good now. I would like 1 driver and 3 cores, please. And a healthy dose of "should have paid more attention" thumbs up
tojpeters
Anyone see a problem with not using board mounted pots so I can build the Barcode edition in 4U with standard Serge panel spacing?
Jarno
MORE WIRING! Mr. Green (I sometimes use thicker solid core wires to mount the pots so the pcb is also suspended from them (saves making a bracket)).
tojpeters
Here's a couple ideas for 4U/ Serge style panels


Barcode
I uploaded a new version of the Driver gerber files back on page 26. No changes to the circuit, just cleaned up the silk screen.
Barcode
BoM's are on page 41.
lombrose
Great!!! MY ASS IS BLEEDING
Barcode
If you ordered the Core PCB's already DO NOT install C15 without making the modification below. I found a small error on the original file which rather than the decoupling cap going between the ground and -V, it was going between -V and +V. The gerber files on page 26 have been updated.

the bad producer
This is a great thread - following it for a while! I've built several euro Living VCO's, and one thing I didn't do - but would recommend if possible - is to add another CV input to each VCO, so that you have '1V/oct', 'FM in' and another 'CV in'... I keep meaning to re-panel them with this feature but not got round to it, if I do I'll have two (or more) enormous and shonky lazertran panels to get rid of if anyone is interested?

I used the MFOS waveshapers on mine... Really I find them the most amazing VCO's in my system!

sammy123
I have never sourced SMD caps before. Mouser and Digikey seem to be pretty exspensive. Am I missing something here? I though SMD components were supposed to be super cheap. Tayda has the smaller size for a penny a piece. Any ideas?
logicgate
sammy123 wrote:
I have never sourced SMD caps before. Mouser and Digikey seem to be pretty exspensive. Am I missing something here? I though SMD components were supposed to be super cheap. Tayda has the smaller size for a penny a piece. Any ideas?



They don't need to be SMD, you can use normal caps too (the very small ones with 2.5mm width will do), you just need to cut the legs and lay it horizontally.
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
I have never sourced SMD caps before. Mouser and Digikey seem to be pretty exspensive. Am I missing something here? I though SMD components were supposed to be super cheap. Tayda has the smaller size for a penny a piece. Any ideas?


The 0504 is also a very uncommon size these days. I plan on using 0603 caps which should fit in the footprint. These:

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Murata-Electronics/GRM188R71C104KA 01D/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs0AnBnWHyRQOK8EV8n4V50G20%252b9HBoAD4%3d

If you are planning to use a SMT resistor for the tempco use this one...

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Panasonic/ERA-S33J102V/?qs=%2fha2p yFaduiamcDwRD0o%252bQMOomQv6GK8d7nJwl%252bk7XjidcJ1MaHlKg%3d%3d
sammy123
Thank you gentlemen. thumbs up
leterell
i'd be interested in taking part in a pcb order, or buying 2-4 extra vco pcb's plus a driver pcb off someone's hands. i'm yet to order any pcb's myself ever, so hand-holding there might be necessary, but i'm also not reluctant to try that out.

i'm in germany, but i'll gladly pay for the troubles of overseas postage, other due fees are also no problem.
mxmxmx
leterell wrote:
i'd be interested in taking part in a pcb order, or buying 2-4 extra vco pcb's plus a driver pcb off someone's hands. i'm yet to order any pcb's myself ever, so hand-holding there might be necessary, but i'm also not reluctant to try that out.

i'm in germany, but i'll gladly pay for the troubles of overseas postage, other due fees are also no problem.


not that i need another vco but i'd take 2 or so of the core pcbs, if you order them. or i can do it .. but i wasn't going to get the driver boards. it's not particularly tricky, assuming you were thinking of itead or similar.

is that latest layout confirmed working?
InfraXpert
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.

If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.

Infraxpert: [4][12]
Leterell: [2][6]
Oberkorn: [1][3]
Jop: [1][3]
Dego: [1][3]
Monobass:[2][6]
Mechie: [3][11]
Fidgit: [2][6]
LED-man: [1][3]
Skaput: [1][3]
Mush: [1][3]
Synthsense: [4][12]
mxmxmx: [][3]
Phetus: [4][12]
Rigo: [1][3]
Grumskiz: [1][3]
designator: [1][3]
Spotta: [1][3]
thorncore: [2][6]
Pfurmel: [2][6]
synchromesh: [4][12]
quanty37: [1][3]
Clusterchord: [1][3]
Kynsi: [1][3]
clochard: [1][3]
drip.feed: [1][3]
Total: [44][137]

I will PM everyone with an exact price and ask for confirmation before ordering. I will order when the Ctrl. PCB have been confirmed.

Non-profit pricing:
PCB pr. piece: $3.5
Shipping in EU pr. shipment: $6
Barcode
mxmxmx wrote:
is that latest layout confirmed working?


My order shipped yesterday. I'm expecting delivery next week and I should have one built shortly after. I'll keep everyone posted.
leterell
Quote:
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.


well, that would be super duper, InfraXpert! i'm in.

and seeing your plans, i'm starting to lean towards not even trying to let myself be limited by common sense or the physical confinements of my current system, i'd take 2 ctrl and 6 vco pcb's.
sammy123
Alrighty, I think I have all the missing parts ordered. SlayerBadger!
Barcode
I forgot to add the switches to the BoM's..... You will need a SPDT (On - Off - On) for the Driver and a SPDT (On - On) for each Core. The files on page 28 have been updated.
oberkorn
the bad producer wrote:
Quote:
if I do I'll have two (or more) enormous and shonky lazertran panels to get rid of if anyone is interested?

PM'd you about possible panel

InfraXpert, I'm in for 1 driver and 3 vcos to Sweden (maybe double that if my friend also wants)
Jop
@InfraXpert

Quote:
If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.


Yes, please. I would love to have 1 set of these (3 vco's + ctrl)
samuraipizzacat29
I'm not following who's doing what, but if someone wants to go in on a set of pcbs with me, let me know.

thanks,
Nate
negativspace
Nate, I'll go halfsies on a dozen if you want. (And I guess we'll have 6 spare driver boards to spread around in the thread if we're locked to minimum 10.)
Barcode
negativspace wrote:
(And I guess we'll have 6 spare driver boards to spread around in the thread if we're locked to minimum 10.)


I plan on building a couple standalone driver modules. Could be fun with my other VCO's. thumbs up
samuraipizzacat29
I was actually thinking the same thing while reading the thread. sure I'm game. You want to handle Jason?

The only question I have is if there's a better way to panelize for discount? heh heh I'm probably just getting greedy (see:cheap)
bsmith
Ooooh, I want to play. I'd go for 2 (maybe 4) if some kind of order happened.
negativspace
I'm juggling a bunch of stuff right now (SVVCFs) and I don't have the time or capital to organize anything large. But I've got cash for my share or a small run (3-5 people?)
InfraXpert
Keeping a list on page 29 on who's in on my order.
Price for pcb and shipping soon.
samuraipizzacat29
I'll organize in the USA. I already have shipping materials and everything set up to do it right soooooo why not? When I gather interest I'll email everyone and post final cost here. There will be 0 additional cost from me. Cost of pcbs, paypal costs, shipping costs. That's it. Expenses will be itemized for transparency's sake.

NO INTERNATIONAL SHIPPING FROM ME! Defeats the purpose and adds a level of difficulty I don't want to handle (for free).

Just select you want from my website and follow through the checkout process. I just tried it and it works. The downside is you surrender $.04 to me in the process. Just select "local pickup - free shipping" for the shipping method. this is the easiest method for me to gather complete interest
http://paper-products-music.myshopify.com/products/living-vco-driver-p cb
http://paper-products-music.myshopify.com/products/living-vco-vco-pcb

Anybody want to do panels? I can take panel interest the same way.

sound good?
Nate
lombrose
Jop wrote:
@InfraXpert

Quote:
If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.


Yes, please. I would love to have 1 set of these (3 vco's + ctrl)


Always in for panel. applause
Jop
Quote:
Keeping a list on page 29 on who's in on my order.
Price for pcb and shipping soon.


Many thanks for arranging this! SlayerBadger! Really curious how these VCO sounds.
synthisland
Nate, I've just ordered a set through your Paper Products site (1 x driver and 3 x VCO pcbs).

Thanks for offering to do this order... I've been looking for a good euro pcb for this VCO for a while now, happy to see it available!
Skaput
InfraXpert wrote:
Keeping a list on page 29 on who's in on my order.
Price for pcb and shipping soon.


Hi InfraXpert, one set for me if possible (3 vco 1 ctrl) would be greatly appreciated w00t
mush
InfraXpert wrote:
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.

If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.

Infraxpert: [4][12]
Leterell: [2][6]
Oberkorn: [1][3]
Jop: [1][3]
Dego: [1][3]
Monobass:[2][6]


I'd like to be added for 1+3 if possible.

Thx.

/rasmus
negativspace
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:

Anybody want to do panels? I can take panel interest the same way.


I can take a whack at a panel... and since I also have the apparatus in place to ship/distribute I may as well handle that.

I'll need a couple of weeks to get some other things off my desk. MY ASS IS BLEEDING

(I'll start sketching now...)
LED-man
InfraXpert wrote:
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.

If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.

Infraxpert: [4][12]
Leterell: [2][6]
Oberkorn: [1][3]
Jop: [1][3]
Dego: [1][3]
Monobass:[2][6]


thx for your offer,
please 1 ctrl and 3 vco pcbs

shipping to germany
leterell
Quote:
I can take a whack at a panel...


thumbs up

i thought i'd do my own designs for a panel, but that sounds like it'll look better and be cheaper. prob down for 2.
samuraipizzacat29
so far I've got 42 vco pcbs and 14 driver pcbs. will continue taking orders for a while.

negativspace are you with us or on your own?
keninverse
Is there any way to alter the gerbers to include power to pass through to each PCB? Just some extra pads next to the power inlet?
Randy
I've read through the last 4 or 5 pages and thinking about 3 core and 1 driver but is anyone taking orders for Canada and, just to make sure, is this Euro?

Randy
InfraXpert
J.H. used a 10K 10 turn wire-wound pot for the freq.
What happened with that?
sammy123
The Barcode version has euro power headers. That is what I am going with. His panel is for euro as well.

Randy wrote:
I've read through the last 4 or 5 pages and thinking about 3 core and 1 driver but is anyone taking orders for Canada and, just to make sure, is this Euro?

Randy
Randy
Thanks sammy123.

I figured the negativspace panel might be Euro. I'm going to read the entire thread and see if I can figure out what's going on. I'd like to grab 3 core PCBs, 1 driver PCB and a panel from someone, I just need to figure out who.

Randy
mechie
InfraXpert wrote:
J.H. used a 10K 10 turn wire-wound pot for the freq.
What happened with that?

I built one of JH's original boards, with freq pots.
The kind of use I have for oscillators I honestly intend to swap it out for a rotary switch giving octave steps, just need to get it back into the backlog stack (and do a new front panel with switch legends).
YMMV.
hmmm.....
samuraipizzacat29
keninverse wrote:
Is there any way to alter the gerbers to include power to pass through to each PCB? Just some extra pads next to the power inlet?


I would make ribbon cables before asking anyone to change a working pcb. I can gladly make any ribbon cable you want. It's worth investing if you plan to diy a lot. I've found tons of uses for my ribbon cables and tools.
negativspace
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
negativspace are you with us or on your own?


I'm with you guys... in for 6 and 2. SlayerBadger!
logicgate
Randy wrote:
Thanks sammy123.

I figured the negativspace panel might be Euro. I'm going to read the entire thread and see if I can figure out what's going on. I'd like to grab 3 core PCBs, 1 driver PCB and a panel from someone, I just need to figure out who.

Randy



The project was designed for +12v usage so, it's Euro, yes.

The only difference between mine and Barcode version is that he added 3 extra pads for PCB mount pots if you want to attach all of them to a panel in a single row, also he added a row of pads for inputs/outputs etc (but kept the original pads too, which are closer to the IC's inputs/outputs).
Randy
Thanks logicgate. I'm in for 3 and 1 and a Euro panel, probably go with whoever negativspace goes with because he knows what he's doing and I don't. Assuming whoever that is will ship to Canada.

Randy
Synthsense
InfraXpert wrote:
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.

If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.

Infraxpert: [4][12]
Leterell: [2][6]
Oberkorn: [1][3]
Jop: [1][3]
Dego: [1][3]
Monobass:[2][6]
Mechie: [3][11]
Fidgit: [2][6]
LED-man: [1][3]
Skaput: [1][3]
Mush: [1][3]

I will PM each of you before ordering.

Non-profit pricing:
PCB pr. piece: $2
Shipping in EU pr. shipment: $6


Hi InfraXpert and thanks for organizing this awesome project

x4 Controls x12 VCOs for me please, Cheers! Guinness ftw!
Synthsense
Double post, sorry!
designator
Hi InfraXpert,

I'm interested in 1 set (3x VCO, 1x Driver),too, shipping to Germany.

Thank you very much!
samuraipizzacat29
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
so far I've got 42 vco pcbs and 14 driver pcbs. will continue taking orders for a while.


I'm going to start getting quotes together and then will email y'all and post prices here for anybody on the fence and waiting for a price.

Negativspace, if you could complete the form at some point, it will help me gather contact information and keep my orders all in one place. thumbs up

Randy wrote:
Thanks logicgate. I'm in for 3 and 1 and a Euro panel, probably go with whoever negativspace goes with because he knows what he's doing and I don't. Assuming whoever that is will ship to Canada.

Randy


I'll ship international, I just don't "want" to. If you have no other source, just complete my form and I"ll add you to my list.

Nate
Randy
Thanks Nate. I didn't see a form but created an account and added 1+3 to my cart.

Randy
samuraipizzacat29
weird double post. Randy, you need to complete the order so I get the paypal information across smile Just click to check out with Paypal.

thanks,
Nate
Phetus
InfraXpert wrote:
I wouldn't mind taking care of ordering and distribution in EU.
I am planing to order 10 ctrls and 30 vco but I'm just going to use 4+12 for myself so I have some left for others.

If more want to join in I could extend the order since I have not ordered yet, waiting for the layouts to be confirmed.

Infraxpert: [4][12]
Leterell: [2][6]
Oberkorn: [1][3]
Jop: [1][3]
Dego: [1][3]
Monobass:[2][6]
Mechie: [3][11]
Fidgit: [2][6]
LED-man: [1][3]
Skaput: [1][3]
Mush: [1][3]
Synthsense: [4][12]

I will PM each of you before ordering.

Non-profit pricing:
PCB pr. piece: $2
Shipping in EU pr. shipment: $6


Yes!! At that price put me in for [4][12]!! Thanks
Randy
Doh! Done. I sure hope someone does a Euro panel for this.

Randy
samuraipizzacat29
yep, got it w00t

I'm getting our quote together now Hoping to be sub $2 just to beat infraxpert hihi

Nate
negativspace
I did the cart thing... I swear all was good until I clicked 'go' and then it showed me 2 VCOs and 6 control boards. (Seriously, I swear I had it right in the cart!)

Either way I think you probably know what I meant. I'm in the system at least. hihi

I'll get a Euro panel sorted as soon as I can. Lots of orders to fill right now but I've been quite the module-machine the last few days...
Phetus
I was going to try ad knock up a 21hp panel, that way you could have 4 in 3u, should be possible, maybe a little cramped.
samuraipizzacat29
negativspace wrote:
I did the cart thing... I swear all was good until I clicked 'go' and then it showed me 2 VCOs and 6 control boards. (Seriously, I swear I had it right in the cart!)

Either way I think you probably know what I meant. I'm in the system at least. hihi


sure.... SURE... you did! hihi Yeah, i got it right. working on pricing this week and will keep everyone posted.

Nate
samuraipizzacat29
I'm getting slightly over $2 per when checking seeed studio (a few pennies cheaper than itead). Yet, it doesn' efficiently use the panel space. Is everyone ok with having to cut boards? For instance, the barcode gerbers are roughly 100mm x 70mm. That bumps the panel price to 10x10, wasting 30% of the space we're paying for. If I panelize to fit the 10x15, it will cost significantly less per pcb (like $1.50 each!) but you'll have to make a cut. It's only a savings of about $3 per "set" so I don't know if you guys are as cheap as I am and would prefer to cut or be ready to go...

infraxpert - I don't see as cheap as $2 each from the sources I know to check, so either you're selecting dimensions wrong, I'm not ordering from the right place, or I don't have the same sources available to me smile

Nate
InfraXpert
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:

infraxpert - I don't see as cheap as $2 each from the sources I know to check, so either you're selecting dimensions wrong, I'm not ordering from the right place, or I don't have the same sources available to me smile

Nate


Sorry, but I don't see the problem.
The PCBs are smaller than 10x10cm.
At that size Itead give 10 PCBs at $20.
20/10 = $2 inclusive cutting.

But the size of the EU order is so big that I might have to pay customs, so I guess I have to recalculate. confused

John
samuraipizzacat29
No, it's my fault. Hours in front of a screen and I was fried. That works just fine. Yet, if the consensus doesn't mind cutting you can save 30% of the cost by panelizing and going 10x15. We're talking with such low numbers anyway, it's about 40c per pcb. Worth it just to keep it simple and avoid cutting unless the majority says otherwise thumbs up
InfraXpert
I do not see panelizing as an option.
Since a lot of people have ordered one controller and an odd number of VCOs I would be the person cutting the PCBs before distributing.
That is not going to happen on the EU order, sorry.
I guess everyone should pay me 40c per PCB to do the cutting. hihi

But since the order have grown so big I will have to pay import tax of 25% plus customs and fees.
Therefore the price per PCB will increase to: $3.50, sorry.
Please let me know if you step out of the EU group buy.

/John
Rigo
InfraXpert wrote:
I do not see panelizing as an option.
Since a lot of people have ordered one controller and an odd number of VCOs I would be the person cutting the PCBs before distributing.
That is not going to happen on the EU order, sorry.
I guess everyone should pay me 40c per PCB to do the cutting. hihi

But since the order have grown so big I will have to pay import tax of 25% plus customs and fees.
Therefore the price per PCB will increase to: $3.50, sorry.
Please let me know if you step out of the group buy.

/John

Can I still join in for [1][3] ? Or would I be the main (or mean) cause of increasing prices ?
InfraXpert
No, we are already above the small order size and have to pay all the taxes, fess and customs.
Before ordering I will PM everybody with an exact price and ask for confirmation.

I put you down for [1][3].
grilojoe
Hope I'm not too late for the US order. I'm in for a set.
Rigo
OK, thank you!
Grumskiz
Is it still possible to join in on the EU order?
I would also like a set of 3 vco boards + 1 driver board.
What is the total price for this order and how will payment work? Is paypal an option?
InfraXpert
The estimated total price for [1][3] is $20 including shipping.
Before ordering I will make an exact calculation and send you a PM, asking you to confirm by sending money to my paypal account.

I put you down for 1+3

/John
douglas442
InfraXpert wrote:
The estimated total price for [1][3] is $20 including shipping.


$20 is very reasonable... and I've actually had three 1.75" vernier "Duodials" for several years now that I've been itching to do something with... so it must be fate!

One more 1+3 set for the US, then?
InfraXpert
douglas442 wrote:
InfraXpert wrote:
The estimated total price for [1][3] is $20 including shipping.


$20 is very reasonable... and I've actually had three 1.75" vernier "Duodials" for several years now that I've been itching to do something with... so it must be fate!

One more 1+3 set for the US, then?


The above price is for the EU group buy.
The US group buy is organized by samuraipizzacat29 and I am sure he can get much better prices since US is not a part of EU.

/John
designator
Hi InfraXpert,

sorry for bothering, but I indicated interest in 1 set of PCBs on page 32 and I wasn't added to the list so far.
InfraXpert
designator wrote:
Hi InfraXpert,

sorry for bothering, but I indicated interest in 1 set of PCBs on page 32 and I wasn't added to the list so far.


Sorry, I have overseen that.
A set is that 1 ctrl. and 3 vco?

/John
designator
Yes it is, thanks!
spotta
In for [1][3] on the EU order thanks thumbs up
Royalston
If its not too late I'm in for 6+2. If Im in Australia, which list can I join?
douglas442
InfraXpert wrote:

The above price is for the EU group buy.
The US group buy is organized by samuraipizzacat29 and I am sure he can get much better prices since US is not a part of EU.

/John


@John - Oops! Sorry about that! I should have read back a couple of pages... well, it was late. Thanks for replying!

samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
... you need to complete the order so I get the paypal information across :) Just click to check out with Paypal.

thanks,
Nate


@Nate - follwing this lead I've gone to your store, placed an order for a 1+3 on the PCBs ( $0.04!? ), completed through paypal, and finally chose "standard shipping" ( $10.00 ) for a total of $10.04.

Will this be the final total, or is it a current estimate?

Anyway, thanks for these!
samuraipizzacat29
No, the idea was to checkout and select free shipping as I was just taking interest that way. Yet, the final order will likely be within a dollar or two of $10 so it doesn't look like it'll matter much either way smile
douglas442
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
Yet, the final order will likely be within a dollar or two of $10 so it doesn't look like it'll matter much either way :)


@Nate - Ok. If it comes out a little bit more I assume I can just send it via paypal to your account?

Either way, a very generous deal! Thanks Again!



EDIT: I'm well equipped with a bandsaw and scrollsaw, etc.etc. , so sending the boards uncut is ok with me.
InfraXpert
designator and Spotta, you'r on the EU order.

/John
thorncore
infraxpert i am down for 1+3 if its not too late on the European order...
cheers
[/b]
InfraXpert
thorncore wrote:
infraxpert i am down for 1+3 if its not too late on the European order...
cheers
[/b]


You are on the list.

/John
Pfurmel
Looking for 2 + 6 in europe if thats possible?
InfraXpert
Pfurmel wrote:
Looking for 2 + 6 in europe if thats possible?


I can put you on my list if you want to. See page 29.
/john
quanty37
Please add me to your list with 1 + 3 (will go to D).
Pfurmel
InfraXpert wrote:
Pfurmel wrote:
Looking for 2 + 6 in europe if thats possible?


I can put you on my list if you want to. See page 29.
/john


John, that would be great if you can put me on your list.

Thanks,

Barry
InfraXpert
Pfurmel wrote:
InfraXpert wrote:
Pfurmel wrote:
Looking for 2 + 6 in europe if thats possible?


I can put you on my list if you want to. See page 29.
/john


John, that would be great if you can put me on your list.

Thanks,

Barry


You'r on
/John
synchromesh
Hi John,

I'd love to get two sets (2 + 6), with shipment to the UK. Thanks! thumbs up

EDIT: Now bumped up to 4 + 12...
Randy
I was fooling around with a panel design, just for, uh, fun. It's 36HP, I like having most of the jacks in one area.



Randy
InfraXpert
Randy wrote:



Randy


Really nice.
/John
Randy
Thanks John. It just needs the names of the people here who developed this version, and of course J. Haible.

Randy
Barcode
Randy wrote:
Thanks John. It just needs the names of the people here who developed this version, and of course J. Haible.

Randy


No need to put my name on it..... Barcode only pawn in game of life.....
burkaygur
Did I miss the train already? Can I be part of US group buy? How much?
CHOONSM8
Hey Man, definitely interested in this VCO. I'm a broke newbie so I am trying to learn to build my own modules though I don't know how difficult this really is? I think I can?
Randy
Barcode wrote:
Randy wrote:
Thanks John. It just needs the names of the people here who developed this version, and of course J. Haible.

Randy


No need to put my name on it..... Barcode only pawn in game of life.....


But the pawn is the one who gets it all started.

CHOONSM8, if you have some experience building and soldering, go for it. I don't think this would be an ideal first kit 'though.

Randy
haima
any australians interested in this...?

or should I jump in on one of the US/EU groups?
logicgate
Randy wrote:
Barcode wrote:
Randy wrote:
Thanks John. It just needs the names of the people here who developed this version, and of course J. Haible.

Randy


No need to put my name on it..... Barcode only pawn in game of life.....


But the pawn is the one who gets it all started.

CHOONSM8, if you have some experience building and soldering, go for it. I don't think this would be an ideal first kit 'though.

Randy


By the way, I'm the one who created this project and laid out the PCB...

Haven't you read the thread since the beginning?

Anyhow, there's no need to put my name anywhere too, it's on the PCB already... I believe that Jurgen is the one who deserves credit for this, not me... As Barcode, I'm just another pawn... lol
Barcode
logicgate wrote:

By the way, I'm the one who created this project and laid out the PCB...

Haven't you read the thread since the beginning?


thumbs up
samuraipizzacat29
burkaygur wrote:
Did I miss the train already? Can I be part of US group buy? How much?


CHOONSM8 wrote:
Hey Man, definitely interested in this VCO. I'm a broke newbie so I am trying to learn to build my own modules though I don't know how difficult this really is? I think I can?


Pricing is not set in stone yet, I have to check back with one more supplier. a set of pcbs will cost around $10 including shipping. This is the DIY forum after all...

The build should be simple enough. Worst case, you can always contact me for help. I only charge $5k a minute for consulting, so no big deal, right? hihi I kid, I kid, help is always free.

Nate
logicgate
CHOONSM8 wrote:
Hey Man, definitely interested in this VCO. I'm a broke newbie so I am trying to learn to build my own modules though I don't know how difficult this really is? I think I can?


As soon as I receive my PCBs I'll open a build thread with some pics of the build proccess and all the info you will need, but you can always post a question there thumbs up
samuraipizzacat29
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
burkaygur wrote:
Did I miss the train already? Can I be part of US group buy? How much?


CHOONSM8 wrote:
Hey Man, definitely interested in this VCO. I'm a broke newbie so I am trying to learn to build my own modules though I don't know how difficult this really is? I think I can?


Pricing is not set in stone yet, I have to check back with one more supplier. a set of pcbs will cost around $10 including shipping. This is the DIY forum after all... Oh, and check a couple pages back for my post on how to express your interest via my website.

The build should be simple enough. Worst case, you can always contact me for help. I only charge $5k a minute for consulting, so no big deal, right? hihi I kid, I kid, help is always free.

Nate
Randy
Logicgate, I know you were the OP, I figured you would jump in but when barcode did, I didn't bother re-reading the entire thread. I also didn't specifically credit anyone, I just mentioned something about the pawns - figured I'd cover my bases by not being specific yet.

I still think the pawn(s) should get honourable mention somewhere on the panel.

Either way, no disrespect intended.

My panel design was just for fun, nobody jumped on it as THE panel design anyways.

Randy
clusterchord
InfraXpert wrote:

You'r on
/John




Hi John, if not too late, i'd like to be on the EU list for [1]+[3]

thanks


//i'll send a PM too, just in case//
kynsi
[1] + [3] for me too please, if possible. I'm in the EU..

Thanks!
Isaiah
I feel almost rude or ungrateful asking this after people have made the effort to create and share these files, but does anyone have plans to develop a CGS/4U-friendly version of this?
Maybe the Driver and three VCOs would fit on a 4" x 6" PCB.
Just curious...
Barcode
Isaiah wrote:
I feel almost rude or ungrateful asking this after people have made the effort to create and share these files, but does anyone have plans to develop a CGS/4U-friendly version of this?
Maybe the Driver and three VCOs would fit on a 4" x 6" PCB.
Just curious...


The pcb size was kept under 100mm x 100mm to keep the small scale production cost down to an absolute minimum. Anything over 100mm x 100mm literally doubles the price for half the amount of PCBs.

That being said.... I have a new layout in the works. It will contain all four circuits on 1 board and it will also have a control board as well (for Euro). It will be a while before I have anything to share. I have lots going on right now in both life and SDIY. Don't cancel your orders for the current PCB's, just build a second VCO when I finish this one. thumbs up
InfraXpert
Barcode wrote:
That being said.... I have a new layout in the works. It will contain all four circuits on 1 board and it will also have a control board as well (for Euro). It will be a while before I have anything to share. I have lots going on right now in both life and SDIY. Don't cancel your orders for the current PCB's, just build a second VCO when I finish this one. thumbs up


Barcode:
Have you received the PCBs for this build and can you confirm the layout?
Barcode
InfraXpert wrote:
Barcode:
Have you received the PCBs for this build and can you confirm the layout?


Not yet. Tracking shows that they left China on May 24th so I am expecting them any day now. I also have all of the components in stock, so I will start building 1 the day the PCB's show up.
Barcode
Hey guys. My order of PCB's came today. The boards turned out really nice. I hope to get one built tonight. I will keep everyone posted on the results.
logicgate
Barcode wrote:
Hey guys. My order of PCB's came today. The boards turned out really nice. I hope to get one built tonight. I will keep everyone posted on the results.


w00t w00t w00t

How I envy you!

That's the difference between living in a country where the services work, here in this fucking shit hole I have to hope for my stuff to arrive...

The PCBs arrived in customs two weeks ago, and still stuck there... Dead Banana sad banana


EDIT:

Here is my tracking history:

26/05/2014 15:32 Received - International Processing
30/04/2014 07:35 In transit to BRASIL
28/04/2014 14:12 HONG KONG Posted
samuraipizzacat29
for those of you interested in the US version of the bar code pcbs, I'm going to wrap up the first wave of orders, probably this week or so. I'll have a final number and will be taking orders from my website. It'll likely be $2 per pcb with only the shipping costs to figure. It will most likely be between $10-15 for a full set of pcbs.

Thanks,
Nate
Barcode
I was able to get my first "core" pcb 98% built last night (waiting on 4 resistors that I missed on my order to arrive tomorrow). Everything went together pretty well. The only small issue I came across was that the resistors are placed pretty close together so be careful when populating.

I'm hoping to have some demos put together over the weekend.
logicgate
Awesome! nanners
sammy123
Cool. Can't wait.
grilojoe
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
for those of you interested in the US version of the bar code pcbs, I'm going to wrap up the first wave of orders, probably this week or so. I'll have a final number and will be taking orders from my website. It'll likely be $2 per pcb with only the shipping costs to figure. It will most likely be between $10-15 for a full set of pcbs.

Thanks,
Nate


It's motherfucking bacon yo

Excellent!
InfraXpert
Barcode wrote:
I was able to get my first "core" pcb 98% built last night (waiting on 4 resistors that I missed on my order to arrive tomorrow). Everything went together pretty well. The only small issue I came across was that the resistors are placed pretty close together so be careful when populating.

I'm hoping to have some demos put together over the weekend.


Fantastic :0)
Barcode
While building the Driver today I found a typo in the BoM. The the components are correct, just a few of the designators are wrong. I will get it corrected and uploaded tomorrow.

I should have these finished up tomorrow or Monday and demos will be soon to follow.
logicgate
I assume that the oscillator boards are working, then?
Barcode
logicgate wrote:
I assume that the oscillator boards are working, then?


My missed parts arrived 35 minutes south of me on Friday and they continued to stay there through Saturday. I will have them tomorrow and finished it then.
negativspace
SlayerBadger!
Barcode
I finished putting everything together and it make sound! The only issue I've found so far is that the "detune" pot does nothing. I am still looking into it.

InfraXpert
logicgate wrote:
I assume that the oscillator boards are working, then?


logicgate:
Did you change any components from the original design to the eurorack version of the VCO board to make it run on 12v?
In case you did, which?
/John
mechie
Barcode wrote:
the "detune" pot does nothing.

It is very subtle on my original JH build - it would be impossible to see its effect on a single osc.
Barcode
mechie wrote:
Barcode wrote:
the "detune" pot does nothing.

It is very subtle on my original JH build - it would be impossible to see its effect on a single osc.


Well it looks like I'll need to start building a second one. thumbs up

Edit: I just tested the Detune along side another VCO and it works. Thanks for pointing that out mechie. For some reason I was thinking it was more of a fine tune.

I also verified that the V/Oct works. I just need to get some calibrations done to see how many octaves it will track. That will come after work.
kvitekp
@Barcode, to verify linear detune circuitry operation you may want to temporarily short R14 with a 1M resistor to make the detune effect more pronounced.
logicgate
@Barcode


WOW! Very cool mate! I feel so proud! lol

The PCB layout is proven to be working then, so people are safe to order if they want, they just need to send the files to the manufacturing house.

What did you use on R60? Have you jumped or used a 100K resistor?


My PBCs are still stuck at customs... Dead Banana


EDIT:

I noticed that the top and bottom of your squarewave are "angled". While testing the circuit on breaboard I got a squarewave with even top and bottom. I don't know if it's the scope or some resistor value you used?

logicgate
InfraXpert wrote:
logicgate wrote:
I assume that the oscillator boards are working, then?


logicgate:
Did you change any components from the original design to the eurorack version of the VCO board to make it run on 12v?
In case you did, which?
/John



If you keep going back in the thread, you will eventually reach a page that contains a post with all the info you need. Also, Barcode put together a BOM for 12v. thumbs up
negativspace
The sloped top and bottom on the square wave are probably due to AC coupling somewhere in the signal chain going into the laptop.
logicgate
negativspace wrote:
The sloped top and bottom on the square wave are probably due to AC coupling somewhere in the signal chain going into the laptop.



Oh I see! All is good, then It's motherfucking bacon yo
Barcode
Neg is correct. I have never been able to get a perfect square using my computer as a scope. This is the reason I have a decent scope of my want list for this year.

Oh and before work I was able to verify that the PWM and FM both work.

If the girlfriend lets me I plan to have the driver fully tested tonight.
sammy123
Nice work w00t
Barcode
I was able to test the driver tonight and it works just as expected. The vibrato adds just an awesome effect to this VCO.

I think I'm at the point where I can say the VCO Core and Driver PCB's are in correct working order. I hope everyone has fun building their's.

I plan to add more demos once I finish building the last 2 VCO's. This is such a fantastic VCO!
Barcode
Here are the most recent BoM's. All of the components are the same just a couple designators are different.

June 19: I made a change to the driver BoM. The Octave trimmers post were missing. There was also an extra 100n 2.5mm cap listed.

July 5: Updated the BoM's to show the correct pot types.
samuraipizzacat29
this is great. thank you guys for being so forthcoming and dedicated to this thread so all of us can share in some diy glory smile
logicgate
@samuraipizzacat

Glad you enjoyed mate!



Was checking the BOM, noticed you left the 10K as the pot for the coarse frequency. I used a 100K pot and thought the result was very good, 10K would be for a 10 turn pot.

I haven't tested with a normal 10K pot, but if you used one and it works as expected then it's ok! thumbs up


EDIT:

Can't wait to see your demos with the complete set! applause
Barcode
As far as I can tell the 10k pot works completely fine. It can go from the LFO range to nearly inaudible highs.

I'm hoping to get the last 2 built up and have everything wired by the weekend.
Barcode
I had an extra set of PCB's and they are now "Gone".
Phetus
Gone?
Randy
I was wondering that too. Where's he gone?

Randy
Barcode
Check that post now. lol
Randy
Ahhh. Now it all makes sense.
Barcode
After looking at the driver PCB the tune pot might be backwards.... I plan on trying it tonight and I will report back.... Sorry.
Barcode
I confirmed that the Tune pot on the driver reacts backwards... Turning CW the pitch goes down and CCW the pitch goes up. I'm in the process of adjusting the gerber files to apply the fix. Literally it is just swapping to pads.

If you already ordered your PCB's it's a simple fix. Just 2 trace cuts and 2 oops wires. I'll post a picture of the modification I did on mine a little later. Sorry guys...

Here is the fix for the tuning pot. This only applies to the original version of the driver PCB. If you are using the gerbers below the fix was already added.

Barcode
Here are the most recent gerber files.
Randy
Barcode wrote:
I confirmed that the Tune pot on the driver reacts backwards... Turning CW the pitch goes down and CCW the pitch goes up. I'm in the process of adjusting the gerber files to apply the fix. Literally it is just swapping to pads.

If you already ordered your PCB's it's a simple fix. Just 2 trace cuts and 2 oops wires. I'll post a picture of the modification I did on mine a little later. Sorry guys...


No big deal. As long as it's documented, little adjustments like this shouldn't impact even a ham-fisted solderer like me.

Randy
negativspace
Stuff like that happens. Easy fix is an easy fix.
InfraXpert
I have ordered the PCBs for the EU-zone today.
The order is based on the latest Gerbers.
If you want to know if you are on the order and the amount please check page 29 where you find an updated list.
I will calculate the exact price and send everyone on the list a PM.
mechie
InfraXpert wrote:
I have ordered the PCBs for the EU-zone today...

Awesome pie full of awesomeness!
applause
Synthsense
InfraXpert wrote:
I have ordered the PCBs for the EU-zone today.
The order is based on the latest Gerbers.
If you want to know if you are on the order and the amount please check page 29 where you find an updated list.
I will calculate the exact price and send everyone on the list a PM.


Yes Sir! The Chewbacca Defense Bop! Om
Jop
Great news InfraXpert!
Maco
who is taking orders to USA????
Phetus
Synthsense wrote:
InfraXpert wrote:
I have ordered the PCBs for the EU-zone today.
The order is based on the latest Gerbers.
If you want to know if you are on the order and the amount please check page 29 where you find an updated list.
I will calculate the exact price and send everyone on the list a PM.


The Chewbacca Defense


My sentiments exactly!
Barcode
I finished building up my 2nd and 3rd cores this weekend and they turned out great.

I was also able to get them calibrated. I was able to get they to track over 5 octaves with barely any turned of the trimmers. Now I just need to finished wiring everything up and I will post some demos.
logicgate
Barcode wrote:
I finished building up my 2nd and 3rd cores this weekend and they turned out great.

I was also able to get them calibrated. I was able to get they to track over 5 octaves with barely any turned of the trimmers. Now I just need to finished wiring everything up and I will post some demos.



Rockin' Banana! It's motherfucking bacon yo screaming goo yo Dead Banana screaming goo yo It's motherfucking bacon yo Rockin' Banana!
oberkorn
InfraXpert: great news, really looking forward to this w00t

oh and loudestwarning/badproducer: please msg me about teh panel
Randy
Panel!? What panel? For this VCO? Can we see it?

Randy
Barcode
I made and update to the Driver BoM on page 41.
mOBiTh
dammit - seemed to have blinked and missed this one. will there be more pcbs available (EU) at some point?
oberkorn
Randy wrote:
Quote:
Panel!? What panel? For this VCO? Can we see it?

yes, this -->

doesn't fit the PCBs though, but looks very nice IMHO
InfraXpert
mOBiTh wrote:
dammit - seemed to have blinked and missed this one. will there be more pcbs available (EU) at some point?


I have ordered a little more than needed.
How many do you want?
Randy
oberkorn, that is nice. Looks like Euro banana, is that right? I have a draft panel on ModularGrid, might play around with it a bit.

Randy
InfraXpert
The PCBs for Europe have arrived and everyone on the list should have received a PM from me with the orderinfo and price.

If you have not received a PM from me please let me know.
I will ship as soon as I receive the shipping details from paypal.
InfraXpert
and I forgot:

PLEASE INCLUDE YOUR MUFF USERNAME IN THE PAYPAL OR SEND AN PM WHEN YOU HAVE PAID WITH YOUR REAL WORLD NAME.

Thanks
logicgate
Very nice!

Meanwhile, my PCBs still stuck at customs since 20/05... sad banana
mechie
logicgate wrote:

Meanwhile, my PCBs still stuck at customs since 20/05... sad banana


Psst! I know where you might get some Smacked in the head with a trout

sorry, couldn't resist oops
oberkorn
InfraXpert: Just paid! thanks for arranging this

Randy: its badproducer aka loudestwarnings panel, I'll probably do it without bananas though
Jop
Great pricing John, just paid.

Thanks!
spotta
Funds sent, many thanks John thumbs up
Maco
Any chance to get PCB's????

really interested
Rockin' Banana!
Barcode
Nice guys! I still have a demo video in the works... Life has just been really crazy lately. I'm hoping to get it finished up on Friday. I must say this in one of the best (if not the best) VCO in my system (I have 14 not including the Living VCO).
Randy
Oberkorn, it's a nice panel. I'm kinda hoping Manhattan Analog does something, or I'll do my own based on the quickie design I did already.



Randy
Synthsense
Already paid too InfraXpert, Thank you so much indeed thumbs up
aladan
My PCBs arrived in the antipodes! Thanks Barcode.
InfraXpert
Hey algor�tmid,

You send me a PM, but Muffs won't let me answer you.
Tells me your name does not exist.

But:
Since its a group buy, I do not have ekstra PCBs but a lot of people have not paid yet, so.
I will announce it here if there are left-overs.

/John
moogasm
Nate, any update on the US group buy?
Skaput
Many thanks to all involved with this especially Logicgate, Barcode and InfraXpert. we're not worthy really appreciate all your hard work.

I have been checking out the bill of materials and does anyone have a source for those SMT 0504 100n caps, they seem less common than hens teeth.

Mouser dont seem to have them and farnell no longer stock them. hmmm.....

By the way Randy thats an awesome panel design. SlayerBadger! Its the one aspect of this Vco that Iam apprehensive about. The last two panels I did where only small but the drill would stick in the metal and the panel would spin round and try its best to remove the tips of my fingers. I also drilled a hole in our kitchen table. d'oh!

So if anyone is up for a) saving the tips of my fingers and b) saving my kitchen table, by doing a panel, well I be indebted and would do your washing up for 6 months hihi

(Disclaimer- Not actually washing Up)
logicgate
@Skaput

Hey mate, check here:

http://www.taydaelectronics.com/100nf-50v-smd-ceramic-chip-capacitor.h tml


I'm glad you are happy!


You are not obligated to use smd, those 2.5mm spacing ceramic caps will do to, you just need to cut the leads very short.
Barcode
I used 0603 sized caps and they worked perfectly.

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Murata-Electronics/GRM188R71C104KA 01D/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs0AnBnWHyRQOK8EV8n4V50G20%252b9HBoAD4%3d
Skaput
Nice one ,thanks for the replies. thumbs up

Never thought to check Tayda and Google was no help, it didnt flag up Tayda at all.

So now for a fun weekend of ordering components w00t
samuraipizzacat29
moogasm wrote:
Nate, any update on the US group buy?


yeah, I did a lot of back and forth trying to get prices a bit lower but it was far too much hassle for only a little reward. I'm going to start taking money and order the pcbs ASAP.
negativspace
w00t
Paradigm X
I would love a spare PCB in the EU if possible please?

Many thanks

Ben
Randy
Skaput wrote:
By the way Randy thats an awesome panel design.


Thanks!

Randy
InfraXpert
Hey,

I guy from the Nederlands have Paypal'ed me for a set of PCBs.
No Muff nickname in the information so I don't know who you are.
Please PM me your real name so I can match name and order.
Thanks :0)
LED-man
Have this living vco version the same function like j.haibles design ?
Because i would use the original 5u fpd file from Bill and Will.

http://www.dragonflyalley.com/constructionJHLivingVCO.htm
InfraXpert
Hello Europe!

For everyone that have paid for what they ordered, the PCB are in the mail:


For those of you that have ordered, received a PM but not paid, your PCBs will be up for graps in 24 hours unless you write me a PM or have written a PM and asked me to hold for some reason.

For those of you who have not ordered but want to get in on this after all send me a PM with your wishes and I will see what I can do. First in, first out.

And you dutch guy that have paid but not informed me about your Muff name, your PCBs are in the mail but I still would like to cross you of me list.
grilojoe
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
moogasm wrote:
Nate, any update on the US group buy?


yeah, I did a lot of back and forth trying to get prices a bit lower but it was far too much hassle for only a little reward. I'm going to start taking money and order the pcbs ASAP.


It's peanut butter jelly time! w00t screaming goo yo
spotta
Hey John

I forgot to include my muff username in my order, sent you a pm on 26th, just checking you matched me up with my payment.
InfraXpert
spotta wrote:
Hey John

I forgot to include my muff username in my order, sent you a pm on 26th, just checking you matched me up with my payment.


I got you covered Spotta.
The PCBs are in the mail. :0)
spotta
InfraXpert wrote:
spotta wrote:
Hey John

I forgot to include my muff username in my order, sent you a pm on 26th, just checking you matched me up with my payment.


I got you covered Spotta.
The PCBs are in the mail. :0)

thumbs up
tojpeters
It's alive. Untrimmed but sounds good. Missing 3 one meg pots including the port pot so the driver isn't right but everything works.
Thanks Logicgate, Barcode, and everyone else involved
Benjamin AM
Am I to late to pick up a set of PCBs?
oberkorn
PCBs received! thanks InfraXpert w00t
LED-man
I'm planning to use a motm panel.
Have this version all functions like the original haible design ?
samuraipizzacat29
Benjamin AM wrote:
Am I to late to pick up a set of PCBs?


nope US group buy hasn't been completed yet. IDK what I"m waiting for.... will crunch numbers and get back to you guys ASAP.
logicgate
LED-man wrote:
I'm planning to use a motm panel.
Have this version all functions like the original haible design ?


This is the LVCO by J.Haible, no mods. (only altered values in BOM to work with 12v, if you wanna power from 15v just follow the original BOM).
donpachi
Seems that I somehow missed this confused

If someone would like to part with a set of boards (three oscillators and a driver) in the EU, please PM me 8_)
Monobass
Got mine, thanks InfraXpert smile
livefreela
i'd be in for a set too when it's time for the US buy
Synthsense
I've got my boards too, thanks InfraXpert Guinness ftw!
Jop
Thanks John, received today!
Rigo
Also got a package in the mail today, thanks InfraXpert Guinness ftw!
drip.feed
My little boards arrived too. thumbs up

Now...just need to figure out how to panel it...
Synesthesia
same here - brilliant!
thorncore
likewise package arrived..
thanks very much,
can't wait to get these up and runnin thumbs up
Grumskiz
Got my boards as well!
Looking forward to stuffing them with parts, but need to do some SMD training first...
tojpeters
I couldn't get enough range on the octave up trimmer and the octave down trimmer just had enough so I added a 47k resistor to the circuit. I'm running mine on 12v. I suggest changing the octave trimmers to 200k.
The detune pots are backwards on mine. Not using board mount pots and haven't double checked the wiring.
There is a small glitch at the top of my triangle wave.
I'm guessing the triangle wave/ saw offset circuit is one of the places calling for matched resistors, maybe matching the diodes also might be a good idea. There is no room on the board for an offset trimmer. The triangle wave and the sine both sound great.
I can see how the wiring option that uses 1 knob for the pulse width of all 3 oscillators would be useful.
Perfect tracking over 5 octaves.
I'm really happy with this project.
synchromesh
My PCBs arrived today! SlayerBadger!

Thanks again, John! It's peanut butter jelly time!
mush
My set finally arrived here, thanks John!
tojpeters
Portpot should be log not lin.
Phetus
On the core, which pots should be lin and which log?

Thanks,
Barcode
Phetus wrote:
On the core, which pots should be lin and which log?

Thanks,


They should all be Linear on the Core. I updated the BoM's on page 41 to reflect this.

I also updated the Driver BoM to show the Portamento pot to show as Log.
spotta
Just got back from holiday and mine were waiting for me.

Thanks again John, this one will be jumping to the front of my backlog
LeftyLogic
If the US group buy of these is still open, I'd love to get 3x of the VCO boards, and depending on cost, maybe 1x of the driver boards as well! It's peanut butter jelly time!
Phetus
Barcode wrote:
Phetus wrote:
On the core, which pots should be lin and which log?

Thanks,


They should all be Linear on the Core. I updated the BoM's on page 41 to reflect this.

I also updated the Driver BoM to show the Portamento pot to show as Log.


Thanks Barcode.

This one might be naive/n00bz/whatever, but am I right in thinking the LM13600 can be replaced with a LM13700? Better safe than sorry wink
tojpeters
It can,I asked the same question.
Phetus
Oops, sorry, must've missed that, thanks
kynsi
Could have been me.. PM sent.

InfraXpert wrote:
Hey,

I guy from the Nederlands have Paypal'ed me for a set of PCBs.
No Muff nickname in the information so I don't know who you are.
Please PM me your real name so I can match name and order.
Thanks :0)
Fidgit
is there a mouser shopping cart / project for the parts or something, please?
logicgate
tojpeters wrote:
I couldn't get enough range on the octave up trimmer and the octave down trimmer just had enough so I added a 47k resistor to the circuit. I'm running mine on 12v. I suggest changing the octave trimmers to 200k.
The detune pots are backwards on mine. Not using board mount pots and haven't double checked the wiring.
There is a small glitch at the top of my triangle wave.
I'm guessing the triangle wave/ saw offset circuit is one of the places calling for matched resistors, maybe matching the diodes also might be a good idea. There is no room on the board for an offset trimmer. The triangle wave and the sine both sound great.
I can see how the wiring option that uses 1 knob for the pulse width of all 3 oscillators would be useful.
Perfect tracking over 5 octaves.
I'm really happy with this project.



I noticed the glitch too when I had the circuit on breadboard, I thought it was due to the lack of bypass caps, but since it sounded very good I really didn't care much about it.


Have you checked your wiring? I'm pretty sure the detune pot is not backwards.
tojpeters
Check the tuning with a high resolution tuner.
I'm using an ancient Peterson strobe tuner made for piano tuners. It is very accurate,reads far under 1%- It even has an offset dial marked in 1% divisions.
I reversed my wiring as compared to board mount pots and now clockwise is sharper,CCW it goes flat.
Fantastic control of beats-try just 2 vcos.
I added a master PW control activated with push-pull pots. A very worthwhile mod.I wish I had added a master PWM input/atten also.
I have to say this module lives up to it's reputation.
The triangle wave glitch is truly small. The sine wave sounds awesome.
The vibrato depth control has a rather logarithmic response-Either I put a log pot in there by mistake,or perhaps an anti-log pot might be better there?
Don't take any of this as criticism.
This is an unbelievably sweet sounding VCO(s)
Thank you so much for doing this. A few minor 'beta testing' problems are nothing.
So any chance you might do any more Haible pcbs?
I put a drone sample on the MW Facebook page.
Randy
Has anyone been thinking about producing a panel for this yet and now that there is a build thread, any idea on an ETA for the North American wigglers?

Thanks

Randy
Phetus
I've got a panel, that I could get made, 21 hp. Missing the octave switch at the moment

Synesthesia
you need to show us Phetus smile
Phetus
Ninja edit wink

...Maybe not so ninja


Edit: If you're interested, let me know, I should be able to get pricings for friday. I'm open to suggestions/feedback so let me know what you think. I'd be happiest sticking to 21hp though. I want to be able to get 4 into 3u.
logicgate
Very cool design!! I loved it! applause
Phetus
Thanks logicgate!
I should mention, I designed it to the Barcode edition, so it should be possible to just bolt the panel to the faceplate, however, I haven't done a mock up yet, so it may need a little re-jigging. The only place I can foresee issues is around the driver.
tojpeters
Here's mine in 5U. Barcode edition.


Fidgit
is there a mouser shopping cart / project / BOM for the parts or something, please?
Phetus
BOMs are on page 41
Dego
Phetus - I want one panel applause
Paradigm X
Many thanks John, mine arrived very quickly indeed w00t w00t w00t

thumbs up
Phetus
Dego wrote:
Phetus - I want one panel applause


thumbs up Cool! I'll get back to you on pricing! smile
Skaput
Phetus wrote:
Ninja edit wink

...Maybe not so ninja


Edit: If you're interested, let me know, I should be able to get pricings for friday. I'm open to suggestions/feedback so let me know what you think. I'd be happiest sticking to 21hp though. I want to be able to get 4 into 3u.


Rockin' Banana! Awesome stuff Phetus, I would also love to take a panel .
thorncore
defo interested in a panel Mr Phetus thumbs up
designator
Hi InfraXpert,

Got my PCBs already!

Thank you very much again!
Phetus
The company I spoke to is going to want about 50€ per faceplate. That's for for a finished panel, with the print under the anodizing.
Is this normal? Seems expensive to me.

If anyone can suggest a cheaper place they know of in europe, I'd love to know. Thanks.

[Edit: I though it would be 32€, but just realised I missed out the setup cost and MwSt, so it'll be 50€ per plate]
thorncore
maybe we could try Re:synthesis ,I just got one of their Postman panels in Euro and its very nice indeed.Cost about 25 quid all in...But I guess they made a few of them...
LED-man
I'm interested in a 5U Panel.
Motm would be nice.
tojpeters
I posted a pic of mine in 5U a page or 2 back. I can send you the FPE file if you like it. I made mine paper face . Uses alpha 17mm pots but not board mounted. I think I drew it with pcb mounted pots in 5U also.
LED-man
tojpeters wrote:
I posted a pic of mine in 5U a page or 2 back. I can send you the FPE file if you like it. I made mine paper face . Uses alpha 17mm pots but not board mounted. I think I drew it with pcb mounted pots in 5U also.


Thx, but i'm interested in the design from dragonflyalley.
Maybe i have to order from schaeffer a panel.
logicgate
tojpeters wrote:
Thank you so much for doing this. A few minor 'beta testing' problems are nothing.
So any chance you might do any more Haible pcbs?
I put a drone sample on the MW Facebook page.


You are welcome! It was fun doing it.


The next one that I plan to build is the interpolating scanner. I'm almost done with the schematic in diptrace, then it's a matter of designing the PCB. It has so many parts, to make it for eurorack I believe it will take two sandwiched PCBs. But this is not my top priority so, It will take a while...
tojpeters
I was just looking at that schematic last night. A lot of parts for sure.
I'd build all 3 versions,interloping scanner,vibrato,and the waveshaper version.
I'm always happy to design panels,anything else I can do just ask.
douglas442
... er...

Traffic on this thread seems to have slowed considerably over the past few days ( ... or is it just that everyone else in the world is also being hit by weird weather extremes? )...

Anyway, just thought I'd bump it to the top to see if that might generate any more discussion, of any kind.

Nate, any chance of a status update?
Pfurmel
I'm busy desiging a panel for mine. I'd imagine a lot of people are busy building...
Barcode
I'm still here. Just have had a bunch of stuff going on (July is always crazy). I should hopefully have my panel on Saturday or Monday. Once I have everything mounted I'll take some pics.
logicgate
Barcode wrote:
I'm still here. Just have had a bunch of stuff going on (July is always crazy). I should hopefully have my panel on Saturday or Monday. Once I have everything mounted I'll take some pics.


And once you do, please post them in the build thread! thumbs up


You could also put there the build of the core PCB (if you want, of course)


Cheers
sduck
LED-man wrote:
tojpeters wrote:
I posted a pic of mine in 5U a page or 2 back. I can send you the FPE file if you like it. I made mine paper face . Uses alpha 17mm pots but not board mounted. I think I drew it with pcb mounted pots in 5U also.


Thx, but i'm interested in the design from dragonflyalley.
Maybe i have to order from schaeffer a panel.


These? - http://www.dragonflyalley.com/constructionJHLivingVCO.htm

Make sure you check out Dave Brown's version - he even has readily available fpds.
LED-man
sduck wrote:
LED-man wrote:
tojpeters wrote:
I posted a pic of mine in 5U a page or 2 back. I can send you the FPE file if you like it. I made mine paper face . Uses alpha 17mm pots but not board mounted. I think I drew it with pcb mounted pots in 5U also.


Thx, but i'm interested in the design from dragonflyalley.
Maybe i have to order from schaeffer a panel.


These? - http://www.dragonflyalley.com/constructionJHLivingVCO.htm

Make sure you check out Dave Brown's version - he even has readily available fpds.


thanks for your info.
here is the link:
http://modularsynthesis.com/jhaible/lvcos/jhlvco_panels.htm
samuraipizzacat29
douglas442 wrote:
... er...

Traffic on this thread seems to have slowed considerably over the past few days ( ... or is it just that everyone else in the world is also being hit by weird weather extremes? )...

Anyway, just thought I'd bump it to the top to see if that might generate any more discussion, of any kind.

Nate, any chance of a status update?


yeah, it's been a while since I've surfed here myself....

I keep on trying to put email questions in to seeedstudio and they'll respond to me once and then not respond any more. I get their response two days later and send a follow-up because they didn't actually answer the question. Then they never respond. And then time passes faster than i realize and it's a month later.... sad banana

So, I'm getting settled in a new apartment but this is one of the very next things on my docket.
Barcode
Sorry for the crappy cellphone picture.... But my panel arrived yesterday. I really happy with the way it came together.

sammy123
Looks great! thumbs up
logicgate
Very beautiful barcode! Now some demos!! twisted
tojpeters
very nice
douglas442
samuraipizzacat29 wrote:

I keep on trying to put email questions in to seeedstudio... they never respond. And then time passes faster than i realize and it's a month later.... :sadbanana:

So, I'm getting settled in a new apartment...


Thanks for the reply!

... can certainly relate to those sorts of problems, so no hurry, for me at least. I'm just interested in knowing so I can begin to order up some parts when they're needed.

Barcode, that panel looks great! Second on the demos!
sammy123
Barcode, does the fix need to be made to the VCO core boards from your order, or was that fixed prior to ordering?
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
Barcode, does the fix need to be made to the VCO core boards from your order, or was that fixed prior to ordering?


The Driver fix needs to happen on the boards from me.
sammy123
Ok. So the reversed pot error for the driver pcb needs fixing, but not the VCO core trace cut fix. Got it. Thank you.

By the way I am getting really excited to finish this. I have a long way to go though.

http://instagram.com/p/q3DyvrJNkc/?modal=true
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
Ok. So the reversed pot error for the driver pcb needs fixing, but not the VCO core trace cut fix.


The VCO core cut needs to happen also if you plan to use the decoupling caps. If you want to you can just skip that cap.
sammy123
Ah I see. Thank you sir.
waveformless
I would like a set if you are still gonna make the boards! love
Jop
Would a 10 turn pot for the frequency be beneficial? Or will a single turn be just fine, also for smaller adjustments? Those 10-turns are quit expensive...

negativspace
Personally I've always preferred the coarse/fine system to a multiturn pot, but that's a matter of taste for most builders I think.
Jop
Good point Jason, and cheaper as well!

Is below image correct how to implement a fine tune control in parallel with the coarse? I assume the pot value for the fine can be also 10K and the resistor to the wiper one with higher resistance?

Thanks.

sammy123
I am making good progress on mine. I have my ground rails in but am waiting on some parts. I'm not so sure on the wiring for these boards....we'll see.

http://instagram.com/p/q9izRTJNqI/
mush
Got my panel today:


Just drilling and connecting panel components left now. smile
logicgate
Beautiful panel! When you finish everything you can post in the build thread if you want, you could take some pics of the wiring, definetely helps people! thumbs up


And please make it scream for us! twisted


I'm very busy lately I wasn't able to finish mine, just need to wire everything though.
sammy123
Very nice panel indeed. Any photos or drawings of the wiring would be greatly appreciated. Most of it is pretty straight forward, but I'm not 100% on the driver or the sines.
mush
Logicgate: I doubt it would give much info to anyone as I've tightened barcode's paneldesign to save a few HP's - so I will wire even my potentiometers and mount my boards flat behind the panel in two layers...

Anyway, my soldering station just decided to die, and the replacement won't be here until next week, so no updates until then. (Karma is a bitch...)
Barcode
sammy123 wrote:
Very nice panel indeed. Any photos or drawings of the wiring would be greatly appreciated. Most of it is pretty straight forward, but I'm not 100% on the driver or the sines.


Wiring up the sine converter is super easy. Just run one of the Triangle outs from the Core to the Triangle In on the Driver. The the Sine Out on the Driver to your panel. Repeat 2 more times.

For the Driver, just connect one of the Driver Outs to the center of the lugs on your switch. Then connect one of the other lugs to the Driver In on the Core. Repeat 2 more times, separate switches per Core of course.

On a different note... I finally got my "studio" mostly put back together. There's a new baby on the way and I moved to the basement. I should hopefully have time this weekend to actually put together a decent demo.
sammy123
Thanks man. Btw. Your last demo was pretty damn decent.
samuraipizzacat29
if somebody wants to take over the US pcbs, I'll get all the names over to said person. I just got absolutely HAMMERED with work that I need to do.

Else, just keep on being patient with me (as you already have)

Nate
Randy
Stupid question probably but why are there two 1v/oct inputs in the driver section?

Randy
Barcode
Randy wrote:
Stupid question probably but why are there two 1v/oct inputs in the driver section?

Randy


I think a better question would be.... why won't the driver have 2 1v/ocy inputs? SlayerBadger! On some patches I personally use one for a sequencer and the other for my Midi2CV. It works like a transpose and it is fantastic!
mush
Finished mine. Well, haven't calibrated it yet and it is still missing knobs. But it is working as it should. Quite an easy and straight-forward build.


Will be a nice one through the kansas home-cooking filter that is just waiting for some potentiometers... smile
Randy
Barcode wrote:
Randy wrote:
Stupid question probably but why are there two 1v/oct inputs in the driver section?

Randy


I think a better question would be.... why won't the driver have 2 1v/ocy inputs? SlayerBadger! On some patches I personally use one for a sequencer and the other for my Midi2CV. It works like a transpose and it is fantastic!


I kinda figured it was for a transpose or something along those lines. I've been trying to design my own panel and have everything placed nicely except the octave switch on the driver.

Thanks

Randy
mush
Randy wrote:
I've been trying to design my own panel and have everything placed nicely except the octave switch on the driver.


I put mine below the 4 knobs on the driver. It's quite nice as it is easy to reach even if every jack is connected.
Randy
I noticed that, thanks Mush. I'm thinking I'd like to have all of the jacks at the bottom, something like this maybe:



Randy
Synesthesia
Hey Guys,

quick question - all the trimmers on the driver boards are multiturns ?
Barcode
Synesthesia wrote:
Hey Guys,

quick question - all the trimmers on the driver boards are multiturns ?


Correct.
mechie
Randy wrote:
I noticed that, thanks Mush. I'm thinking I'd like to have all of the jacks at the bottom, something like this maybe:

<snip>
Randy


At the risk of interfering...
would it make more sense to put all the pulse stuff together,
maybe swap the 'Free / Track' switch so the toggle points towards the controller when tracking?


I agree with grouping the sockets together - it does help unclutter the front a bit when using it.

>>EDIT<<
But you have inputs and outputs mixed together - I have a panel or two with mixed sockets - needs something to clearly define one from the other - It WILL cause mix-ups!
Randy
You're not interfering. If I was concerned about interfering I would not have posted the picture.

Although I like the other panel better for aesthetics, I understand your points. What about this one:



Randy
sammy123
That looks really nice.
mechie
sammy123 wrote:
That looks really nice.

What he said!

But with one thought...

I personally would swap saw and square (pulse) outputs so all the pulse stuff is logically grouped together

Other than that it's the cats nackers!
Randy
Thanks for the suggestions gentlemen. I will make the mod tonight after work and re-post.

You guys might enjoy this, or might just think I'm nuts but the layout is done in Excel.

Randy
sammy123
The more diy it is the more fun it is, right?
Randy
I had a boss once who did all of his graphics in PowerPoint, which was probably worse. As the old saying says, "if all you have is a hammer, every problem is a nail."

Randy
Randy
Again:



Randy
mechie
This is now awesome!
I like the groupings and the coloured box picks out the outputs nicely.

I think this is so close to spot op I might steal it when I get to build mine hyper

I know this is concept, not final, but make sure you leave enough space below the bottom sockets and above the top controls for the case rails - obvious but I just goofed on that one very frustrating

Maybe for consistency, a shaded box around the 'Driver Out' socket to match the osc outputs?
mush
Reminds me of my first panel ideas for it:


Never finished the driver part though... And I went with a simpler panel in the end...
Randy
Mush, that is close, did you post that one? I haven't looked through all of the posts yet. I shifted everything up a bit to make sure the jacks would clear the lower rail.



Randy
mush
I never did. I usually don't post until any sketches... I do my panels in Aludibond with brushed aluminium (butler finish) - and as I only do it for myself - and I haven't got the time to spend to much energy thinking things over - I usually just send stuff to print too early. wink

I decided to go down the easy route - and follow Barcode's panel and just tighten it up a bit... Stupid. As I had no 9mm pots for horizontal mounting lying around. So I ended up mounting the pcb's in two layers and wire everything up anyway. The good thing is that it is not as deep now - the bad thing is that I ended up with design that is a bit boring and not as ergonomic...
mechie
Randy wrote:

Randy

Now I think it's perfect applause
Time to set some dimensions for everything?
My way of doing this (you use Excel?) I use M$Paint!

This is a panel I did for the Barton Voltage to Rhythm.
I use waterslide transfers for the legends and these dimensions get used when I do the legends in Photoshop, printing one copy on paper for a drilling guide (centre pop through it to mark drillings), and a Lazertran transfer. The legends should then align with the holes hmmm.....
Randy
That's cool! Yup, it's Excel. I also use laser waterslide decal transfers, works great.

I can try to line it up to the grid in Excel and see what happens.

Randy
Randy
Here's everything lined up and spaced correctly (I suppose), although the knobs and labels are really only a guide. I can't figure out how to attach the Excel file but you're welcome to it, just in case anyone would like to fool with it. The file has the gridlines as well.



Randy
synthsearcher2
Is it still possible to order a PCB set?

Best regards,

Peter
douglas442
*bump!*


synthsearcher2 wrote:
Is it still possible to order a PCB set?

Best regards,

Peter


A good question.


samuraipizzacat29 wrote:
if somebody wants to take over the US pcbs, I'll get all the names over to said person. I just got absolutely HAMMERED with work that I need to do.

Else, just keep on being patient with me (as you already have)

Nate



Certainly, I can wait. Especially as just about everyone I know of is being similarly hammered by endless responsibilities, petty and annoying distractions, breadsticks, appetizers, etc., these days...

... well, everyone except for those sort of folks who can afford to hire others to take ( or do ) the hammering for them.

Anyway... by chance has anyone offered, yet, to take these on? Did Seeed Studio ever come through with their part?
Royalston
Waiting patently in Australia smile
Milkweg
Another one in Australia. This looks AWESOME
mush
You know, it is not that hard to use the files attached in this thread - post them to your preferred PCB-maker - and get the PCBs....
diablojoy
I will probably order some boards within the next month or so.
10 x driver and 30 x vco core boards
I plan to keep most but there will be a few spares
if you are in OZ and want some let me know by pm
price will be at cost plus postage of course
douglas442
mush wrote:
You know, it is not that hard to use the files attached in this thread - post them to your preferred PCB-maker - and get the PCBs....


This is true. However...

... in my case, at least, I currently require only a single set of PCBs ( one driver & 3 VCOs ).

Unless someone can suggest another source that is both inexpensive and reliable... a casual perusal of various custom PCB makers suggests this to be an uneconomical option compared to a group purchase or buying from a limited-run. So it's not a really desirable option under my already overstressed DIY budget.

Besides that... I've been oddly unable to download any files from this site for several weeks, now. I'm ( ever more regrettably ) still on AOL, and I can't even connect anymore unless I use an older alternate browser set to "turbo" mode. Otherwise AOL simply reports "Not Found__The requested URL was not found on this server."

... so, on top of everything else, it seems as if AOL is suddenly now blocking this site from it's users.

--------------------------
Barcode
Hey folks. I've been seeing that their are a bunch of people wanting to get sets of these PCB's. I've decided to do a run of them. On this run I will be asking for prepayment, so please only fill out the form below if you are committed to the order.

The price per set (3 x Core and 1 x Driver) will be $14.00 and individual PCB's will be $3.50. Shipping will be determined by the amount of PCB's ordered but should always be less than $5.80 for inside the US and about $7.50 for international.

I plan to used iTeadstudio for the order. They do great work and turn around is fairly quick. I'm also happy with their pricing.

I plan to leave the order open until Sept. 6th. Please only fill out the form one time. If you need to make changes to your order just PM me. Once ordering is closed I will be sending out invoices via PayPal. I need st least 10 sets ordered to place the order with the manufacturer.

Ordering is closed.
raisinbag
hey barcode, will you consider Canadians in that order as well?
Barcode
I updated the order form to allow people outside of the US.

Feel free to submit an order raisinbag. thumbs up
Randy
Tempting, but I'm wondering if this screws up samuraipizzacat29 at all?

I've already sent Nate some money (I think), but not so much that I'm going to be too upset about it. Besides, two sets of PCBs are always better than one.

Randy
Barcode
Randy wrote:
Tempting, but I'm wondering if this screws up samuraipizzacat29 at all?


He made a post earlier this month asking if someone else wanted to take over the orders.
Randy
I remember that. Have you officially taken over then?

Randy
OrganFixer
Thanks for doing this. My order has been placed.
DJBRUTAL
Thanks Barcode! Order placed.
Royalston
Order Placed Barcode! Thank you...

Is anyone making and selling panels for this?
synthsearcher2
Order placed. Thanks Barcode.
LeftyLogic
Thanks very much to Logicgate and Barcode for making this project available! It's peanut butter jelly time! I'll be ordering boards as soon as I can get some cash into my paypal account... Dead Banana

In the meantime, I thought I'd share a panel design I put together for it:



Euro version is 38HP, and I also designed a 5-width Frac version. I've attached FPD files if anybody wants to use them, and I could also look into getting a small run made if anyone's interested! thumbs up
mush
Maybe you should put the PWM and FM jacks next to their knobs?!
Synesthesia
Ouch smile 161 euros for that FPD panel ... jesus smile
LeftyLogic
mush wrote:
Maybe you should put the PWM and FM jacks next to their knobs?!

Yeah, I had a bit of a dilemma about that. The way I have it now is a little harder to read, but with the PWM and FM jacks next to their respective knobs the panel just looks out of balance. I couldn't really find a completely satisfactory way to do it. seriously, i just don't get it
Synesthesia wrote:
Ouch smile 161 euros for that FPD panel ... jesus smile

lol Yeah, FPD pricing is pretty unpleasant, isn't it!
For the stuff I've built in the past I only use FPD to design the panel. Once I get that part figured out, I print it off and stick it on a piece of acrylic. hihi
I think if I had them professionally made I'd get them laser cut in acrylic from Ponoko or something. I'm pretty sure that would be significantly cheaper!
Synesthesia
Ahahah - well there is ways to keep the price down with PFD too smile

I still like the design though - it looks nice smile
douglas442
Barcode wrote:
Hey folks. I've been seeing that their are a bunch of people wanting to get sets of these PCB's. I've decided to do a run of them. On this run I will be asking for prepayment, so please only fill out the form below if you are committed to the order.

The price per set (3 x Core and 1 x Driver) will be $14.00 and individual PCB's will be $3.50. Shipping will be determined by the amount of PCB's ordered but should always be less than $5.80 for inside the US and about $7.50 for international.

I plan to used iTeadstudio for the order. They do great work and turn around is fairly quick. I'm also happy with their pricing.

I plan to leave the order open until Sept. 6th. Please only fill out the form one time. If you need to make changes to your order just PM me. Once ordering is closed I will be sending out invoices via PayPal. I need st least 10 sets ordered to place the order with the manufacturer.

The order form can be found here:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1nryCKxhOBqflWx_mJr-gsrwc9S25qx0_LM2h9 fbuUYY/viewform



If the link isn't working properly let me know....



One set ( for now ), please! Order has been submitted.

Thanks, Barcode, for taking this on!
logicgate
Barcode wrote:
Here are the most recent BoM's. All of the components are the same just a couple designators are different.

June 19: I made a change to the driver BoM. The Octave trimmers post were missing. There was also an extra 100n 2.5mm cap listed.

July 5: Updated the BoM's to show the correct pot types.



Hi barcode.

What designators are different?

I have fired the oscillators up and I bumped into a problem I was having when I had the circuit on breadboard. The PW pot, when FCCW makes the square wave disappear. I had fixed that by changing some values (I'm trying to find that post of mine where I posted all the mods I did to make it work). The thing is that I followed your latest BOM blindly (since you mentioned the only change you had made was adding the pads for pots and the row of pads for ins and outs). Just wanted to know if there's any other change, because 1 resistor out of place could be causing the issue.

Cheers!


EDIT:

found it. R39 is supposed to be 520K, not 510K. Gonna test now.
logicgate
Changed to 520K and I get the same results, weird... On all 3 oscillators hmmm.....



PW pot at noon I have 50% square wave - ok

PW pot FCW I have 90% - ok

PW pot FCCW wave goes below 0% and disappear. When I had it on breadboard it would go to a minimum of 10%.

Anyone having the same results?
mush
Jep.haven't had time to sort it out yet though.
logicgate
Hey guys!!


Bingo!!


R39 value is critical for the PW pot operation get the whole range of the square wave without making the signal disappear.


I removed R39 and soldered IC sockets so I could keep swapping:




The best results I got was with a 820K resistor at R39. It's weird because when I had it on breadboard the best value was 520K. Oh well, maybe the full circuit on PCB is different than on breadboard.

Anyways, if you are having problems with the PW pot then change R39 to 820K.

Ah and don't forget that 1st you have to leave PW pot at noon, then adjust R40 to get 50% square wave.
tojpeters
I did have the same PW problem.
Thanks for the fix,I'll implement it soon.
Zaibach
@barcode
I just placed an order, but i'm living in germany. I hope it's not to much trouble for you...
Barcode
Wow I just found mine does the same thing. I guess I didn't mess with the PW pot enough. It is really notice able when modulating the PWM. I will saw out R39 this weekend and give it a test.
sammy123
I'll have to swap this as well. I finally recieved my transistors so I should be able to finish this weekend.

Barcode...that reminds me. I might have to pick your brain soon about panel design. I want to have some made at Ponoko and may need some pointers if thats cool.
davidschwan1
Just placed an order for 1 set.
LektroiD
I've seen a few people actually building these, and placing orders. I've been through the thread (not 100% thoroughly, I admit), but can't find anything about ordering, pricing, and there doesn't seem to be any website to order from, etc. How do we go about it and how much are these?

I'm looking for 1 PCB/panel set shipped to the UK.
Randy
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1nryCKxhOBqflWx_mJr-gsrwc9S25qx0_LM2h9 fbuUYY/viewform

Barcode's post from two pages back.

Randy
LektroiD
Randy wrote:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1nryCKxhOBqflWx_mJr-gsrwc9S25qx0_LM2h9 fbuUYY/viewform

Barcode's post from two pages back.

Randy


Brilliant, thank you. Is anyone doing panels for these?
jonesboy
I'm brand-new here, but have ordered a set of boards for this because hey, what says "new Eurorack wheeeeEE!!!" better than bare boards with homebrew panels?

applause
Randy
Lektroid, there are no official panels yet.

Jonesboy, you are brave! You might want to start with something a bit easier. I'm doing some of the Befaco kits at the moment, not too hard at all.

Randy
jonesboy
Randy wrote:
Lektroid, there are no official panels yet.

Jonesboy, you are brave! You might want to start with something a bit easier. I'm doing some of the Befaco kits at the moment, not too hard at all.

Randy


Heh. I should be clear: far from my first build, it's just that I'm new to Eurorack / modular. smile
Royalston
this thread is overwhelmingly huge...

I've placed an order with Barcode - I *think* the correct BOM for those boards is on Page 41...

Is anyone making panels for this or does everyone sort themselves out?

Thanks
Royalston
Sorry - just missed the last post about panels...
sammy123
I got an acrylic panel from Barcode. You could ask him.
Phetus
I'm going to try and get my panel for this finished this week, if not it'll be next week. And then I'll do a small order. Been snowed under, otherwise I'd've gotten it done sooner. Either way, looking at sometime near the end of the month.
Barcode
Just a quick update on my order. I will be sending out the invoice after I close the ordering on Saturday. Expect an invoice either Saturday or Sunday. I'm hoping all of the payments will be made within a few days and I will place the order shortly after.

As of right now we are up to 43 sets of PCB's. That being said I just got a quote from the fab house which came in lower than my original stated price. Once ordering is closed and I have a final total I will get the final quote.
bsmith
w00t w00t
LeftyLogic
Got mine ordered! It's peanut butter jelly time! Can't wait to get it built! hyper
Siri
Ordered too!
Barcode
I will be closing the ordering in about 3 hours.
apoisontree
Just saw Barcode's post about a new run. Order placed. Hope this is not too late.

Thanks!
Barcode
Not too late. I'm closing ordering. I will have the final prices ready tomorrow. We ended up with 55 sets!
apoisontree
Great ! w00t
Zaibach
Quick question: Does anyone know the approximate power draw of the driver and three VCOs? I ordered two sets and have a small 450mA Doepfer PSU in my drawer which I wanted to use (I plan to dedicate a small stand alone case for this)... I couldn't find anything on Jürgen Haible's homepage or in this thread so far...
Randy
Barcode, if we don't get an invoice by, say, Monday evening, should we contact you?

I ordered through your link but didn't mention it here.

Randy
Barcode
Randy wrote:
Barcode, if we don't get an invoice by, say, Monday evening, should we contact you?


All invoices should be sent out tonight. If you don't receive it by tomorrow night shoot me a PM.
Barcode
Invoices have been sent out to all of the folks in the United States. For everyone else I will be sending out the invoices tomorrow evening. I want to make sure I get the best price for international shipping.

Invoices will be coming from someone with the initials "M W". That's me!

Also, I was able to get the price of each set of PCB's down to $10.00. Not bad for 4 boards. thumbs up
jonesboy
Barcode wrote:
Invoices have been sent out to all of the folks in the United States. For everyone else I will be sending out the invoices tomorrow evening. I want to make sure I get the best price for international shipping.

Invoices will be coming from someone with the initials "M W". That's me!

Also, I was able to get the price of each set of PCB's down to $10.00. Not bad for 4 boards. thumbs up


Seriously amazing price. Thanks for doing this. I am awfully excited. smile
Zaibach
Barcode wrote:
Invoices have been sent out to all of the folks in the United States. For everyone else I will be sending out the invoices tomorrow evening. I want to make sure I get the best price for international shipping.

Invoices will be coming from someone with the initials "M W". That's me!

Also, I was able to get the price of each set of PCB's down to $10.00. Not bad for 4 boards. thumbs up


nanners nanners
Barcode
The international invoices have been sent. The shipping will be First Class which can take a couple weeks to get to you. If you want the PCB's quicker send me a PM and I will get a price for you.
LeftyLogic
Got mine paid for earlier today. Thanks a ton for doing this run Barcode! Can't wait to get it built! It's peanut butter jelly time!
Barcode
Just a quick update to the PCB order. I'm still waiting on a few folks to make payment. I'm going to give them through the weekend. Once everyone is paid I will submit the order.
douglas442
Knowing all the problems that can occur online, these days, I'd like to state that mine should also have been paid. Thanks for making these available!

A question, then: are the most recent files for these available anywhere else online? For some reason, I am still unable to download any files ( and images ) that are specifically linked to this site.
Barcode
Since I'm only waiting on payments from a couple more people, I took and placed the order with the fab house. I hope they will ship to me in a couple weeks. I will keep everyone posted. thumbs up
sammy123
Well if they never pay up I'll take a set.
bsmith
The Chewbacca Defense The Chewbacca Defense The Chewbacca Defense The Chewbacca Defense
thresholdpeople
Oh no! I think I missed it! very frustrating

If someone drops out, I'm definitely interested in 1 full set!
nihilist
I would like a set of these if still available.
nigel_mck
I would be interested in a set as well if someone drops out/there are extras!
Barcode
I just received an email from the fab house stating the boards shipped. w00t
simfonik
Man, I was late to the party. Just filled out the form anyway. If someone drops out, or you do another run, please consider it a standing order.
Barcode
I did order some extra sets for lost shipments and for folks late to the party. I'm not going to make any promises yet, but it will be first come first serve after all of the current orders are shipped. thumbs up
Barcode
Now that's a stack of PCB's! The order came in today. I will need at least the weekend to get everything organized and packed up for shipping. thumbs up

logicgate
woah
LeftyLogic
logicgate wrote:
woah

My sentiments exactly! eek!
moogasm
Awesome!!!
douglas442
hmm... I'd be tempted to keep a stack like that all for myself.

... I wonder what that many LVCOs, all together, would sound like?
diablojoy
Quote:
I wonder what that many LVCOs, all together, would sound like?

not sure but give me a few months and maybe I can record what 6 sound like

I have put in my order with Itead, should have 4 sets going spare in a couple of weeks time if anyone is interested. will be $12.00 USD per set plus postage
costs
PM if interested
Barcode
Quick update.... all of the PCB's are sorted and ready to ship. Just waiting on the last bit of packing materials to show up. Hopefully today.
baloo
Could I get one ??
apoisontree
Thanks for all the work, barcode. we're not worthy
Barcode
The shipping packing finally arrived on Saturday. I will get started on packing everything up tonight. Hopefully I will start getting things in the mail on Wednesday.

As for folks coming late to the party. I have a list on everyone who has shown interest in the extras. I will begin contacting folks in order of who asked first next week. I'm hoping I'll have enough for everyone, but no promises.
Barcode
Ready to ship! The US orders are on the left and internationals on the right. Everything will be going out tomorrow.



I have enough spares to offer everyone who contacted me after ordering closed 1 set each. I will be contacting you folks shortly.
logicgate
So awesome what you did applause


Barcode for president
DJBRUTAL
Barcode and logicgate you guys both seriously rock! SlayerBadger! Thank you so much! we're not worthy
Zaibach
Awesome! thumbs up
moogasm
I second the nomination.
Barcode
All PCB sets are on their way! thumbs up
frozenkore
hyper
LeftyLogic
Hooray! It's peanut butter jelly time! hyper
seanpark
Thank you guys!

I love this oscillator.
spacedog
I would like to buy one ... love
livefreela
barcode - we owe you a huge debt of gratitude for this. i had been wanting to build this module for quite some time and couldn't be happier to know that i've got some pcbs on the way to finally make it happen. the fact that you pulled this whole endeavor off reminds me of what's so great about our sdiy community here - people are just so generous with their time in helping make incredible things happen, for nothing but the love of this art. given the importance of legacy of this particular designer makes it all the better. soon, a whole new generation of vcos will be living (and singing) around the world - i'm confident that somewhere jh is smiling....
tojpeters
diablojoy
I received my boards from itead so
6 of these..... maybe
I knocked up a prototype panel today still debating.

edit 16/10/14 oh I now have 2 sets of PCB's available if anyone's interested
LeftyLogic
Got my set of PCBs today! hyper Massive thanks to Barcode and Logicgate for making these available! applause
bsmith
Got mine too hooray!
So... Maybe it's in this very thread somewhere, but it's up to 66 pages now... Is there a Bom with the numbered component parts for this? The Bom on the haible page doesnt specify what r1, r2 etc.. is. There's the schematics, but ugh. And what package size are those smt caps?
sduck
This kind of stuff should be in the build thread ---

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117137
bsmith
Ummmm d'oh! hadnt seen it thankya
moogasm
I want to express my gratitude to Barcode for his efforts. Not only did he re-layout the PCBs but he also provided them at cost! Not to mention donating his time and effort to pack and ship them. And let us not forget Logicgate for initiating the project and getting the design working in the first place. All for the good of us synth diy fanatics. Thanks for a job well done!

P.S. None of this would have been possible without the genius of Jurgen Haible. May he rest in peace.
douglas442
Received my boards today, and they look great - can't wait to get started on these!

Great job!

Thanks, again, Barcode & Logicgate...

... should you guys do another project, like this one, consider me to be a loyal customer!
Barcode
I added the BoM's to page 4 of the build thread.
synthsearcher2
Barcode, the PCB's have arrived safely today.

Barcode, logicgate, I like the text that gives credit to the right people.

I think there is no better way of honouring JH by continuing to construct his designs.

Barcode, Logicgate thanks for this opportunity.
thresholdpeople
I received my PCBs yesterday! screaming goo yo
tojpeters
apoisontree
I received my PCBs today. Thanks again Barcode! SlayerBadger!
cleaninglady
Am very happy to have grabbed some LVCO pcb's , i have wanted this in my rig for years !!

Many thanks to Barcode , logicgate for making this happen. (...and to diablojoy for the PCB's) !! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger!
livefreela
tojpeters - bolting the pcbs in a hoop for efficient assembly i gather? (that, or assembling the weirdest oversized module in the history of euro) either way, i like your style!
simfonik
Hoping I didn't miss your message about extras being available. I posted interest earlier in the thread. Are extras still available?
LektroiD
LeftyLogic wrote:
Thanks very much to Logicgate and Barcode for making this project available! It's peanut butter jelly time! I'll be ordering boards as soon as I can get some cash into my paypal account... Dead Banana

In the meantime, I thought I'd share a panel design I put together for it:



Euro version is 38HP, and I also designed a 5-width Frac version. I've attached FPD files if anybody wants to use them, and I could also look into getting a small run made if anyone's interested! thumbs up


These are brilliant! If you can get the costs down, I'd be in for one...
simfonik
Disregard my last post. I just noticed the invoice on my PayPal account. Payment sent, sorry for the delay! smile
LeftyLogic
LektroiD wrote:
These are brilliant! If you can get the costs down, I'd be in for one...

Thanks, I'm glad you like it! It's peanut butter jelly time!
I've been looking at a couple of ways to get the price to be more manageable, and at this point I think that using 2mm PCB material would be the cheapest way to go without getting a low quality panel. Going that route it looks like I could get the cost down to somewhere between 10 and 25 dollars apiece, depending on how many are ordered.
Would anyone be interested in this?
LektroiD
LeftyLogic wrote:
LektroiD wrote:
These are brilliant! If you can get the costs down, I'd be in for one...

Thanks, I'm glad you like it! It's peanut butter jelly time!
I've been looking at a couple of ways to get the price to be more manageable, and at this point I think that using 2mm PCB material would be the cheapest way to go without getting a low quality panel. Going that route it looks like I could get the cost down to somewhere between 10 and 25 dollars apiece, depending on how many are ordered.
Would anyone be interested in this?


One of my friends on Electro-Music just sent me a Fonik VCPS panel on silver acrylic, granted it is thicker than the aluminium panels, but you can't tell it is acrylic unless you take it out of the cabinet. Would definitely be good option, but I wonder where others go to get a run of aluminium panels and manage to price them at €15 each...
Randy
Got mine, thanks!

Randy
Zaibach
My boards arrived today safe and sound in Germany. Thank you, Barcode!

Now I'm off to the solder iron thumbs up
LeftyLogic
LektroiD wrote:

One of my friends on Electro-Music just sent me a Fonik VCPS panel on silver acrylic, granted it is thicker than the aluminium panels, but you can't tell it is acrylic unless you take it out of the cabinet. Would definitely be good option, but I wonder where others go to get a run of aluminium panels and manage to price them at €15 each...

I had actually looked at getting engraved acrylic panels from Ponoko, but it looks like that would turn out to be quite a bit more expensive, and since I'd have to infill the engravings myself, it would also be a lot more work on my end.
One of the reasons I was wanting to use PCB material is that it's quite a bit easier to stay within my preferred aesthetic of white panels with black lettering than trying to do the same with aluminum. Additionally, from looking at prices on existing designs, I'm pretty sure that a panel of this size would end up costing at least $30 if made in aluminum, and potentially a lot more than that. Of course, if people are willing to pay that much, I suppose I could go get a quote from MPC about having the panels made there, but honestly I'd kind of hate to have to charge 3 times the cost of the PCB set for the panel. seriously, i just don't get it
LektroiD
LeftyLogic wrote:
LektroiD wrote:

One of my friends on Electro-Music just sent me a Fonik VCPS panel on silver acrylic, granted it is thicker than the aluminium panels, but you can't tell it is acrylic unless you take it out of the cabinet. Would definitely be good option, but I wonder where others go to get a run of aluminium panels and manage to price them at €15 each...

I had actually looked at getting engraved acrylic panels from Ponoko, but it looks like that would turn out to be quite a bit more expensive, and since I'd have to infill the engravings myself, it would also be a lot more work on my end.
One of the reasons I was wanting to use PCB material is that it's quite a bit easier to stay within my preferred aesthetic of white panels with black lettering than trying to do the same with aluminum. Additionally, from looking at prices on existing designs, I'm pretty sure that a panel of this size would end up costing at least $30 if made in aluminum, and potentially a lot more than that. Of course, if people are willing to pay that much, I suppose I could go get a quote from MPC about having the panels made there, but honestly I'd kind of hate to have to charge 3 times the cost of the PCB set for the panel. seriously, i just don't get it


Ultimately aluminium is best for me, as it suits the asthetics of my system, so I'd be keen to know the best price you can get a panel made in aluminium. Hopefully a few will jump onboard and bring the costs down a bit. If it ends up costing more than the PCBs, that's cool too; better having the boards panelled up and in my system, than without panels and left in the drawer...
raisinbag
Id be interested to see what price you come up with for the PCB style. Also im trying to find your files for the euro and frac panel but it must be way back? I can seem to find them. I was thinking of trying to cut it myself (if you don't mind that is) I just got a CNC machine, literally just got, it is still wrapped in plastic and I have to figure out how the hell to ue it now!. anyway, if I can get the FPD files it would be neat to play around if I can translate them into DXF
LeftyLogic
LektroiD wrote:
Ultimately aluminium is best for me, as it suits the asthetics of my system, so I'd be keen to know the best price you can get a panel made in aluminium. Hopefully a few will jump onboard and bring the costs down a bit. If it ends up costing more than the PCBs, that's cool too; better having the boards panelled up and in my system, than without panels and left in the drawer...

Alrighty! I sent a quote request in to MPC the other day, so hopefully they'll get back to me soon with pricing. Maybe if we're lucky it won't be too terribly outrageous! MY ASS IS BLEEDING
raisinbag wrote:
Id be interested to see what price you come up with for the PCB style. Also im trying to find your files for the euro and frac panel but it must be way back? I can seem to find them. I was thinking of trying to cut it myself (if you don't mind that is) I just got a CNC machine, literally just got, it is still wrapped in plastic and I have to figure out how the hell to ue it now!. anyway, if I can get the FPD files it would be neat to play around if I can translate them into DXF

Hmm, I'm really not sure when it was that I posted those layouts. hmmm.....
And since I really don't feel like digging through the last who knows how many pages of this thread, here's a couple of DXF files! It's motherfucking bacon yo
Feel free to cut yourself a panel or two, and good luck with the CNC machine! I'm pretty damn envious to be honest. hihi

With the PCB material panels it looks like with 10 orders I could get the price to be about $20 per panel, and with 25 or more I could get it down to somewhere between $10-$15. Would that work for people?

Also, do you guys (and/or any mods that might be lurking around) think that I should set up a new thread for this? I'd hate to make this thread any more cluttered than it already is!
LektroiD
LeftyLogic wrote:
LektroiD wrote:
Ultimately aluminium is best for me, as it suits the asthetics of my system, so I'd be keen to know the best price you can get a panel made in aluminium. Hopefully a few will jump onboard and bring the costs down a bit. If it ends up costing more than the PCBs, that's cool too; better having the boards panelled up and in my system, than without panels and left in the drawer...

Alrighty! I sent a quote request in to MPC the other day, so hopefully they'll get back to me soon with pricing. Maybe if we're lucky it won't be too terribly outrageous! MY ASS IS BLEEDING


That's awesome! Hopefully a few more will jump in and grab a panel or two. Your design is really nice!

LeftyLogic wrote:
Also, do you guys (and/or any mods that might be lurking around) think that I should set up a new thread for this? I'd hate to make this thread any more cluttered than it already is!

I was thinking of suggesting this too, maybe that way more people will see it and hopefully get the quantities up to make it more cost effective...
Randy
I'm interested in something a bit more narrow. This is 30hp:

http://www.modulargrid.net/e/other-unknown-living-vco-prototype-panel

Randy
raisinbag
THANKS lefty! I'll go open up that file and check it out. Well ya give me some prices. At $20 I'd probably buy 2, if you got it down to $10 I would totally buy 5!!!!!!! I'll keep my eye on the thread or new thread if you start it. I don't mind it wide! Just means I have to make more cases! hahaha SlayerBadger!
LeftyLogic
LektroiD wrote:
LeftyLogic wrote:

Alrighty! I sent a quote request in to MPC the other day, so hopefully they'll get back to me soon with pricing. Maybe if we're lucky it won't be too terribly outrageous! MY ASS IS BLEEDING


That's awesome! Hopefully a few more will jump in and grab a panel or two. Your design is really nice!

LeftyLogic wrote:
Also, do you guys (and/or any mods that might be lurking around) think that I should set up a new thread for this? I'd hate to make this thread any more cluttered than it already is!

I was thinking of suggesting this too, maybe that way more people will see it and hopefully get the quantities up to make it more cost effective...

Thanks very much! It's peanut butter jelly time!
I think I'll go ahead and set up a new thread once I get pricing back from MPC; that way I'll be able to lay out all the options on no uncertain terms.

Randy wrote:
I'm interested in something a bit more narrow. This is 30hp:

http://www.modulargrid.net/e/other-unknown-living-vco-prototype-panel

Randy

I tried as best I could to keep it at 30 HP, but I eventually realized that at that width it's a little too cramped for my liking, and there also isn't room to use 16mm pots. I completely understand wanting a smaller panel, but I'm not sure there's much I can do with this one without doing a complete redesign. seriously, i just don't get it

raisinbag wrote:
THANKS lefty! I'll go open up that file and check it out. Well ya give me some prices. At $20 I'd probably buy 2, if you got it down to $10 I would totally buy 5!!!!!!! I'll keep my eye on the thread or new thread if you start it. I don't mind it wide! Just means I have to make more cases! hahaha SlayerBadger!

Hey no problem! Thank you for your interest! thumbs up 5 panels would sure make a dent in the number of orders I'd need to get a decent price! (Incidentally, did you really order 5 sets of these PCBs?! eek! )
raisinbag
haha ya I have 5 sets, didn't intent to acquire that many but it just happened, and since I have wanted this module for sooooooooo long, I have learned to grab an extra or two when you can. I was thinking of doing one for each format I have Euro, 4U and Frac, but if the panels are cheap enough I'll just do them all euro and have a massive wall of sound, detuned goodness!
raisinbag
Hey, I have looked a bunch of threads in from front to back, but don't see the BOMs for vco's and driver. If anyone knows what page, can they give me a link.

The Bag help
raisinbag
DONT WORRY! I just found a Build thread that I didn't know existed!
SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger!
LeftyLogic
raisinbag wrote:
haha ya I have 5 sets, didn't intent to acquire that many but it just happened, and since I have wanted this module for sooooooooo long, I have learned to grab an extra or two when you can. I was thinking of doing one for each format I have Euro, 4U and Frac, but if the panels are cheap enough I'll just do them all euro and have a massive wall of sound, detuned goodness!

Wow, that is gonna sound incredible. we're not worthy Make sure you post some sound samples once you get them all finished! It's peanut butter jelly time!

Anyway, I got the quote from MPC, so a new thread should be going up shortly! thumbs up
BananaPlug
By the way, Randy's 30HP panel is practically a ready-to-go frac panel. Frac would be slightly higher (5.25") and the screw hole would be in different places but that's it.

So if you go with this placement the PCBs behind will work for both formats. we're not worthy
Randy
Accidental benefits, nice!

Randy
LeftyLogic
Okay, so I was reflecting on what I said the other day about not being able to get my design to be any smaller than it already was, and I said to myself, "You know what? I'm gonna try it."
Well, I do believe I can now firmly insert my foot into my mouth, cause here it is in 30 HP! MY ASS IS BLEEDING



Thanks for the motivation, Randy! It's peanut butter jelly time!

Also, new thread is up! It's peanut butter jelly time! https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1704049
LektroiD
^ WOW ^

Nice work!
thetwlo
guess, I missed this, as the title never changed. Amazing work.
so I assume it's too late to get in on a set?
I know shipping sucks. I assume that's why this wasn't posted here as [order]
I'm also happy to do it--take orders and ship. Would be great to included the panel.
LeftyLogic
LektroiD wrote:
^ WOW ^

Nice work!

Thank you! It's motherfucking bacon yo

thetwlo wrote:
guess, I missed this, as the title never changed. Amazing work.
so I assume it's too late to get in on a set?
I know shipping sucks. I assume that's why this wasn't posted here as [order]
I'm also happy to do it--take orders and ship. Would be great to included the panel.

Barcode just finished up a run of the PCBs a couple of weeks ago, and I think he said he had a few left over. You might want to send him a PM to see if he still has any!
Randy
I am honoured!

Randy
falafelbiels
hey this thread prompted me to dig up my old Living VCOs module and stick it in my "active" cabinet, thanks Logicgate.

It seems to track just as well/ poorly on +/-12v as on +/-15v. Must be my build...
Sounds wonderfully thick though, but I need to come up with an octave switch. These 10 turn pots are great for tuning but...
Maybe I'll build a little Yusynth CV standards.
samuraipizzacat29
I haven't visited this thread in a stupid amount of time. Looks like you guys have it sorted.

If I owe you a legitimate amount of money back, I will send it back in short order, just have to get it straight and do it all at once.

thanks,
Nate
oldenjon
Looks like I'm late to this party. Are there any of these left?... Or perhaps someone has a couple extra they can part with? Wishful thinking maybe Mr. Green
seanpark
Any interest in a big fat 4 MU panel? I'm playing around with the design, the 4MU version would be very similar to megaohm phil's blue square version. I'm also considering a simpler 3MU version.

Panels will either be silkscreened by me on dotcom blanks or if a couple other builders are interested we could get a good price from re: synthesis. Won't be happening for a while either way as I have to build the prototype and get it working well -- some of the features I want to include will require a daughterboard.
diablojoy
Quote:
Looks like I'm late to this party. Are there any of these left?... Or perhaps someone has a couple extra they can part with? Wishful thinking maybe Mr. Green

I have 2 spare sets available still
$12 USD per set plus shipping of course,
I am in Australia so shipping might end up being as much as a set of boards
if you have no luck with finding any in the US send me a PM
LED-man
seanpark wrote:
Any interest in a big fat 4 MU panel? I'm playing around with the design, the 4MU version would be very similar to megaohm phil's blue square version. I'm also considering a simpler 3MU version.

Panels will either be silkscreened by me on dotcom blanks or if a couple other builders are interested we could get a good price from re: synthesis. Won't be happening for a while either way as I have to build the prototype and get it working well -- some of the features I want to include will require a daughterboard.


please check this page for templates, maybe Ben resynthesis can use this.
http://modularsynthesis.com/jhaible/lvcos/jhlvco_panels.htm

i go with the 5U in MOTM Version from schaeffer, if someone want this please pm me, on my page is a picture for the MOTM panel in 5U width
https://www.dsl-man.de/display/MAIN/Juergen+Haible+Living+VCO+in+MOTM
Barcode
Hey folks. All of the extras from my run are officially gone or in my personal stash.
raisinbag
Barcode wrote:
Hey folks. All of the extras from my run are officially gone or in my personal stash.


I have all the ones I need as well, but over on the other thread regarding panels I am seeing a bunch of people asking for more. Just curious, can someone else do a run for another group buy, or is this your baby (Barcode)? I wasn't sure it if was like a "turning machine" kinda thing, where people can do runs as they wish? Just seeing lots of interest and trying to help others get some if they want to take the initiative.
LektroiD
On the driver board, R28 is silkscreened as 18K, but the BOM calls for 10K. Which do I go with, Silkscreen, or BOM?
LektroiD
More errors... I stuffed all the resistors on the driver board (v1.1) and there are extra places for resistors. Turns out the trimmers are meant to go into these fixed resistor placements, how are we supposed to do that? trim one of the legs off?
raisinbag
I guess it depends, is it supposed to be a Variable resistor or a voltage divider? If just a variable resistor, ya trimming off one of the outside legs should do the trick, (someone speak up if Im talking shit!) If it is a voltage divider we are going to have to be really creative
LektroiD
Hopefully the pic should help
raisinbag
Hmmm well there are 6 trimmers noted and 6 spots for trimmers on the board. So Im guessing that R11,21,16,26 are in fact for actual resistors, but something got Eff'd up on the BOM. Barcode and Logicgate will hopefully be able to clarify this for us. I havent even started stuffing yet, I'm waiting for panels before I build
raisinbag
DUDE YOU ARE LOOKING AT SOME OLD DOC OR SOMETHING!!!!! I am looking at the doc I have and all your trimmers are noted totally different. What doc are you going off of
raisinbag
r11, r21 are 390r on mine, and r16, r26 are 2.2k
Barcode
Yes those are the old BoM which I thought I deleted. You may have found it deep on my blog.... I really wish I had started the build thread so I could have control of it. Everything is kind of a cluster eff right now. Below is a link to page for of the build thread which contains the correct BoM.

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117137&start=30
LektroiD
I got the BOM from this thread. I just went through the pages until I found the BOM (the one erroneous I got is still there, same filename)... Anyway, I see there is another now. It was a bit difficult having the resistors sitting over the designators, and no silkscreen to locate them by, but I think I managed to replace all the erroneous resistors. Managed to rip a couple of pads off the board in the process, but it seems to be OK now. I'll know when I fire it all up.
evengravy
Just wondering if boards are still available, would love to build this one
Reality Checkpoint
evengravy wrote:
Just wondering if boards are still available, would love to build this one


You are in luck!

Have a look here:

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124339

And welcome btw. w00t
evengravy
Thanks and thanks! I've been backwards engineering the original pcb for my own use for a while coz I'm dying to have it in my life, appreciate the heads up and the welcome!
evengravy
All I need now is someone to do he haible 36db filter phaser and his vocoder and il be happy wink
Benjamin AM
My Vibrato Depth doesn't seem to do much until 3 o'clock position. Is this how the circuit is supposed to function?
*edit- I just watched Barcode's Youtube video. It appears that this is the normal function. I would assume that this is for gated Vibrato. I wish I would have done this before spending a few hours "trouble shooting" the function.
sduck
A reminder - take your build questions/issues to this thread -

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117137

This thread is for board ordering only. If this turns into the build thread I'll lock the official build thread.
InfraXpert
Does anyone have a mouser no. or other place to get the 1k_TC SMT 0805?
spacedog
Mouser-Nr.:
667-ERA-S33J102V
cutterfiltoff
Does anyone know if we can mod our kits for sync? SOUNDS FREAKING AMAZING



https://soundcloud.com/random-source/jhaible-living-vcos-2015-sync-dem o
Wray
sorry, wrong section, need MU...
deleted
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